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The last time someone attacked the Jovians, it was the Amarr, at Vak'atioth, and the Amarr fleet was crushed?

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Author Topic: The Alignment System Game!  (Read 32899 times)

Pieter Tuulinen

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Re: The Alignment System Game!
« Reply #75 on: 20 Jun 2013, 23:04 »

Pieter: lawful neutral or evil, mostly because caldari ideals are about promotion, economic gain and self-interest in the end.

Actually, Caldari believe in the good of the group over the good of the individual fairly heavily. Of course they only work towards the end of an inlier group that they're part of - not the general weal of humanity.
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Karmilla Strife

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Re: The Alignment System Game!
« Reply #76 on: 20 Jun 2013, 23:07 »

Aldy, all that gif needs is some fire and it's 100% true.
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John Revenent

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Re: The Alignment System Game!
« Reply #77 on: 20 Jun 2013, 23:58 »

Quote
Detailed Results:

Alignment:
Lawful Good ----- XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX (24)
Neutral Good ---- XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX (24)
Chaotic Good ---- XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX (24)
Lawful Neutral -- XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX (20)
True Neutral ---- XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX (20)
Chaotic Neutral - XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX (20)
Lawful Evil ----- XXXXXXXXXXX (11)
Neutral Evil ---- XXXXXXXXXXX (11)
Chaotic Evil ---- XXXXXXXXXXX (11)

Law & Chaos:
Law ----- XXXXXXXXX (9)
Neutral - XXXXXXXXX (9)
Chaos --- XXXXXXXXX (9)

Good & Evil:
Good ---- XXXXXXXXXXXXXXX (15)
Neutral - XXXXXXXXXXX (11)
Evil ---- XX (2)

So I am not sure what to make of this but I RP John more along the lines of NG/CG. While in the public he seems pretty lawful, behind closed doors he conducts himself very differently.
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Katrina Oniseki

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Re: The Alignment System Game!
« Reply #78 on: 21 Jun 2013, 00:10 »

Looks like you got Neutral Good.

Repentence Tyrathlion

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Re: The Alignment System Game!
« Reply #79 on: 21 Jun 2013, 01:25 »

Interesting to see LG applied to Amarrians at all, what with the whole slavery as part of religious beliefs thing.

I think the general consensus is to ignore the objectively dubious aspects of a given culture, and to take people as they stand within that culture (or from the character's perspective).  Slavery is acceptable and not a moral black spot from an Amarrian perspective, hence it doesn't shift things.  Reppy is a Holder, but I don't consider her being a slave owner to be worth points in any particular direction - maybe even worth a few good points, considering her somewhat liberal attitudes.
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Makkal

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Re: The Alignment System Game!
« Reply #80 on: 21 Jun 2013, 01:31 »

I'm responding from my character's viewpoint. I assumed everyone else was doing the same. 
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Repentence Tyrathlion

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Re: The Alignment System Game!
« Reply #81 on: 21 Jun 2013, 01:46 »

I'm responding from my character's viewpoint. I assumed everyone else was doing the same.

That too.
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Merdaneth

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Re: The Alignment System Game!
« Reply #82 on: 21 Jun 2013, 01:58 »

This thread is making me realize I may be overplaying Katrina's frustrations with the greater community. People are geniunely questioning if she's a good person!

Katrina seems Lawful Neutral with evil tendencies to Merdaneth. Lots of hate, very pre-occupied with her own troubles, self-centeredness, but willing to work within the rules and wthin an organization to achieve her (selfish) goals.

Frustrations are easily overplayed, because the times she isn't frustrated is much less visible. This is partly due to the limitations of text chat. Just happily and sedatedly idling in a channel doesn't give the same impression has happily and idly sitting in the same room with someone.
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Samira Kernher

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Re: The Alignment System Game!
« Reply #83 on: 21 Jun 2013, 02:34 »

Rating some other people now!


Anslo: CN or CG. Does whatever he feels is a good idea. Has few impersonal loyalties, focuses more on those close to him than anything else. Seems to go out of his way to help people, from what I've seen.

Makkal: TN. Breaks quite a few expected social conventions for a member of nobility, and relates with many people of all creeds even if they’re not exactly the kind of people she should be interacting with. Not chaotic, because she does use her status when it suits her.

Pieter: LG.  Obeys orders, has a strong moral code. Typically obeys law before good, but not to the degree of being LN. If he was to drift, he’d drift to NG, not LN, because he’s been consistently more willing to break his ethics rather than his morals when he doesn't have a leash holding him back (Pyre, Samira).

Silas: LE. Silas is someone who has very particular goals and very controlled methods of achieving those goals. When she does appear more chaotic, it seems to be more of a very deliberate act rather than something she actually believes in. The person she appears in conversation is inherently deceptive, but people eat it right up because she's pleasant and genteel. Could be NE, but the question would be whether she would break her own laws for benefit. It’s clear she will break “the” law, but she doesn’t respect “the” law, she respects Silas’ law. Would she betray Silas’ law for Silas’ benefit? Hm.

Katrina: LN. Classic bureaucratic Caldari, does not fall under the altruistic Ishukone idea and rather embraces the, “we don't give good deeds for free,” belief. Never trust the liberal bearing gifts and all that.

Saede: TN. Pragmatic. Law and order has its uses, chaos has its uses, good has its uses, evil has its uses. Has “good” goals, but a very cold and logical mindset that embraces inhuman means of achieving those goals, much like Nation. From what I’ve seen of her she strikes me as the kind of person who believes that the ends justify the means should the opportunity present itself, and could easily drop to NE once said opportunity arises.

Aldrith: TN or NE. Ends justify the means is not the mindset of a good person.  Aldy will do whatever it takes to save the galaxy from itself. Prefers law, but isn’t beholden to it. Prefers good, but quickly calls upon evil the moment good isn’t a suitable solution. Key question to determine if he is TN or NE is largely a matter of numbers—he has the capacity for evil and has done evil, but does he do it often enough to be evil? Either way, he certainly isn’t good.

Gwen: TN. Gwen is good-hearted, but being good requires action, not just heart. Leans lawful, but doesn’t seem beholden to it. Could easily be NG if she developed an active drive to do good, but so far she seems concerned primarily with observing the universe and contemplating her place in it.

Lunarisse: LG. Strong attention to proper tradition, to the point of sometimes getting a bit self-righteous. Shows a great willingness to help other people, often offering the moment she meets someone new.

Nicoletta Mithra: LN. Strong attention to tradition and her own personal ethical code, which at times splits from “the” law but that she holds to as strongly as any law. Haven’t seen anything yet to make me call her Good, since Good requires action. Recall having to pressure her into giving advice to a new pilot because she was too bitter to bother because the person, “probably wouldn’t listen anyway.”
« Last Edit: 21 Jun 2013, 02:56 by Samira Kernher »
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Andreus Ixiris

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Re: The Alignment System Game!
« Reply #84 on: 21 Jun 2013, 03:11 »

I'd probably classify Andreus as Neutral Good when he's in a good mood and Chaotic Neutral when he isn't. Chaotic Good doesn't suit him - he doesn't think humanity or posthumanity is responsible enough to handle complete freedom, but he's seen bad people hide behind the letter of laws, codes and guidelines while fundamentally abusing their spirit way too many times to have complete trust in them, either.
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Nicoletta Mithra

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Re: The Alignment System Game!
« Reply #85 on: 21 Jun 2013, 03:59 »

Gwen - CG

Katla - LE

John - LN?

Andreus - CN with tendencies to E


Interesting to see LG applied to Amarrians at all, what with the whole slavery as part of religious beliefs thing.

I think the general consensus is to ignore the objectively dubious aspects of a given culture, and to take people as they stand within that culture (or from the character's perspective).  Slavery is acceptable and not a moral black spot from an Amarrian perspective, hence it doesn't shift things.  Reppy is a Holder, but I don't consider her being a slave owner to be worth points in any particular direction - maybe even worth a few good points, considering her somewhat liberal attitudes.

I'd also consider that slavery is a wide field within Amarrian society, e.g. it is to an great extent as much part of the penal system of Amarr as prisons and penal labor is today in many countries (e.g. the US). I don't see why an Amarrian in favor of penal slavery would be any less 'good' than some US-citizen who's in favor of penal labor.
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Samira Kernher

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Re: The Alignment System Game!
« Reply #86 on: 21 Jun 2013, 04:22 »

Andreus: TN seems rather fitting. Believes in good, but understands that occasionally harsher methods need to be used to safeguard it (thus supported Black Eagles IIRC). Believes in freedom, but understands that too much freedom leads to destruction of society. In both cases, one has to avoid going too far in the other direction, lest they become something like the Empire.
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Lyn Farel

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Re: The Alignment System Game!
« Reply #87 on: 21 Jun 2013, 06:22 »

Interesting to see LG applied to Amarrians at all, what with the whole slavery as part of religious beliefs thing.

Slavery = evil is a western concept.

Good vs Evil in the D&D alignement looks more like selfless paragon vs self interest to me.
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Samira Kernher

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Re: The Alignment System Game!
« Reply #88 on: 21 Jun 2013, 06:36 »

Interesting to see LG applied to Amarrians at all, what with the whole slavery as part of religious beliefs thing.

Slavery = evil is a western concept.

Good vs Evil in the D&D alignement looks more like selfless paragon vs self interest to me.

DnD scale is an objective western morality scale. It's about actions. Slavery counts as an evil action. Likewise, personal sacrifice is a good action. In both cases, it takes more than one evil or good action to determine someone's alignment.

"Even if slavery, torture, or discrimination are condoned by society, they remain evil. That simply means that an exalted character has an even harder road to follow. Not only must she worry about external evils like conjured demons and rampaging orc hordes, she must also contend with the evil within her own society." - Book of Exalted Deeds

The DnD scale is not designed to be subjective. It's built to be a classic black and white scale. The Amarr Empire is a Lawful Evil society by the DnD scale. There's nothing wrong with that.
« Last Edit: 21 Jun 2013, 06:45 by Samira Kernher »
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Havohej

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Re: The Alignment System Game!
« Reply #89 on: 21 Jun 2013, 06:47 »

Interesting to see LG applied to Amarrians at all, what with the whole slavery as part of religious beliefs thing.

Slavery = evil is a western concept.
So?  I'm a western man.  Besides, I reject your premise on two grounds.

First, the western world practiced slavery longer and more efficiently than any other region, in more than one form.  Also, I strongly doubt that if you questioned someone in, say, Bangladesh or Yemen about the subject you'd hear many people extolling its virtues.  So really, what "slavery = evil" is is a modern concept.

Second, in every version of D&D, as Samira points out, slavery is considered an evil act.  Western morality scale or not, it's certainly evil in the context of this discussion (i.e.: D&D alignments applied to internet spaceships).

Finally, Samira, you are awesome for having the Book of Exalted Deeds near at hand.  (unless you cheated and googled it, in which case, gg)
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