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Author Topic: Your Character's Alignment  (Read 15635 times)

Logan Fyreite

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Re: Your Character's Alignment
« Reply #45 on: 26 Oct 2011, 06:09 »

In fact in general I think that the notion that any persona sees themselves as evil for the sake of evil is absolutely silly.  Those that are evil are generally simply out for themselves with little or no concern for any other, or are so ruthless in pursuing their goals that there is room for no concern for the repercussions of pursuing them.
I agree with this, I took the test everyone else took and received Neutral Good. That's not even close to what I would view Logan as, and not how he views himself.

Difficult to quantify though as anarchists aren't really covered that well in the DnD system as anything other than "chaotic."

Having said that Logan has bonded with most of Stimulus and considers them more of a family than the one that was taken from him, and is loyal to that family to the nth degree, the only detractor being he, and his adopted extended family, are all mass murderers, terrorists, extortionists (hi Bacch) etc.

For that reason I would place Logan under the Neutral Evil alignment with neutral good tendencies for those people he respects/cares for.
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Kaleigh Doyle

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Re: Your Character's Alignment
« Reply #46 on: 26 Oct 2011, 13:17 »

A productive response might be to question the morality of new Eden compared to a medieval fantasy realm, and recreate the questions in a way that's applicable to capsule pilots. Furthermore, could you devise a separate morality system for each culture, as they have their own value system?
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Lyn Farel

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Re: Your Character's Alignment
« Reply #47 on: 26 Oct 2011, 15:39 »

The questions could also be reviewed to match all the 4 factions. Then you would get instead Lawful/Neutral/Chaotic Amarr/Minmatar/Gallente/Caldari :p

And then all the other factions start to complain.  :lol:
« Last Edit: 26 Oct 2011, 15:42 by Lyn Farel »
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Lydia Tishal

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Re: Your Character's Alignment
« Reply #48 on: 26 Oct 2011, 16:37 »

The D&D alignment system is overly simplistic, but I've always looked at the Law/Chaos and Good/Evil "axes" as being Collectivist/Individualist and Empathy/Apathy spectrums.

It is perfectly reasonable for an Amarr slaver and Minmatar freedom fighter to both be lawful good.
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Seriphyn

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Re: Your Character's Alignment
« Reply #49 on: 27 Oct 2011, 03:36 »

Every faction has every alignment, tbh.

Don't even need to elaborate, it's pretty simple to think around.
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lallara zhuul

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Re: Your Character's Alignment
« Reply #50 on: 28 Oct 2011, 07:37 »

Lawful Good, just as I thought.

The questions and the options were well put, for they were easy to modify to the worldview of the character.
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Saikoyu

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Re: Your Character's Alignment
« Reply #51 on: 28 Oct 2011, 13:10 »

Neutral good, which I suppose is fair enough for Sai.  She's more interested in doing what she thinks the right thing is rather than whatever the local law says it is. 
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Esna Pitoojee

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Re: Your Character's Alignment
« Reply #52 on: 29 Oct 2011, 20:31 »

Esna came out Lawful Good, but to be honest I don't think that's accurate.

In-universe, I'd see him as Neutral Good - while he will often subvert rules or local authorities, he does so in the interests of the greater good. Where laws aren't directly damaging to the people, however, he has no issue with obeying them and paying deference to the authorities.


From the context of the modern Western World, however... he's Chaotic neutral at best. He's an immensely rich commander of incredibly rich vessels who buys things and ruins peoples on a whim... even if he tries to do good, he hurts - and kills - a lot of people in the process.
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I like the implications of Gallentians being punched in the face by walking up to a Minmatar as they so freely use another person's culture as a fad.

Milo Caman

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Re: Your Character's Alignment
« Reply #53 on: 30 Oct 2011, 04:46 »

Test came out Chaotic good, but I've always pinned Milo as either Chaotic Neutral or Neutral Evil, as he's generally just out for himself and his close associates/What little family he still has contact with.
I'm not a huge fan of applying alignment systems to EVE, as there's so many shades of grey, but it's interesting to see how your character turns out.
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Rok-Yuni

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Re: Your Character's Alignment
« Reply #54 on: 01 Nov 2011, 05:59 »

Allrighty...

only going to answer for one of my characters here, because i honestly can't decide where the other two would fit..

Unit XS365BT ... Strongly Lawful Neutral.

oh... and ghost.. since 3rd edition the DnD alignment system is no longer subjective. good is good, evil is evil... even if they think they are doing the good / right thing.... ergo.. kuvie's little band be evil.. those lovely people at CCP even said so.

as for my opinions on faction alignments...

well..

Amarr - LN leaning towards LE. while some of their methods are undoubtedly evil, they are used for supposedly good ends... basically the majority of the Amarr are imho LN... however they are let down by the ruling class, who are primarily LE, due to the institutionalised use of slavery / Vitoc / TCMC's

Caldari - LN, leaning towards LE. As with the Amarr, the ruling class let down the majority of the caldari people, who are law abiding, hard working types... their leaders are callous, uncaring (for anything other than their own profit margins) and calculating.

Gallente - Neutral. a freedom loving people who at times even flaunt their own laws, the gallente are imho predominantly neutral, the idea CCP seem to like reinforcing is a remarkably hedonistic people, living for the moment, and the comforts of family and home above most other things. Their leadership changes too often to be a remarkably strong influence on the people as a whole, leaving that role to the media...

Minmatar - NG leaning towards CG. While not a lawless people, they are a disparate group, laws are different for each tribe, and likely each sub-group within the tribes, however, the underlying rules are simple, family and tribe first, help those around you, and retrieve your enslaved brethren.

all that said, as seri wrote, each of the factions contains all 9 alignments, in varying amounts. though on the alignment spectrum it does seem that CCP have given the caldari and amarr the short end of the stick... (if this wasn't an online game that is... the internet does always seem to bring out the worst in people... whereas i have noticed that in single player environments, most people don't like to be the bad guy...)
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Kybernetes Moros

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Re: Your Character's Alignment
« Reply #55 on: 01 Nov 2011, 10:27 »

I'm just going to echo what others have said RE: the alignment system, really -- EVE intentionally plays up the shades of grey deal. Granted, some factions may be darker or lighter shades than other, but something to try and draw a dichotomy between "good" and "evil" just doesn't seem to fit EVE for factions, let alone characters that are (usually, anyway) orders of magnitude more complex as people.
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BloodBird

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Re: Your Character's Alignment
« Reply #56 on: 01 Nov 2011, 18:29 »

Neutral good. Lawful evil fits far more right now considering the man's world-view, situation and many ideas for what is acceptable actions.

This makes him a tad better than most of the chaotic/evil eggers about, as I'm sure most player's toons would arrive in the mostly-bad end of the alignment, given EVE's grim-dark universe. Far as the D&D alignment chart is concerned, there are no good guys in EVE. We would need an entierly differnet chart tailored for the reality of the EVE universe.
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Jonny Damordred

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Re: Your Character's Alignment
« Reply #57 on: 01 Nov 2011, 21:56 »

Chaotic Good
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Aria Jenneth

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Re: Your Character's Alignment
« Reply #58 on: 01 Nov 2011, 23:41 »

While I don't think the D&D alignment system really applies all that well to Eve (moral grays, lack of great cosmic wheel, oversimplistic, yadda yadda) ...

Aria Jenneth: lawful neutral with chaotic evil tendencies, dedication to order and clarity undermined by a thread of vicious, contrary stubbornness and perversity. Not complete, but accurate as far as it goes.


Edit:

Rok-Yuni - about the factions ...

I think that actually all four of the empire factions are aspirationally good, and this is one of the places where the "wheel" cosmology breaks down: every empire faction looks "good" from its own point of view, and you can easily write an impassioned defense of any of them in good faith from a member of the society.


Amarr: Lawful good.

"The one hope of peace, order, and prosperity for mankind is to be restored to the service of God, the all-powerful, all-knowing, and all-benevolent. This is the one hope, the one light, of the universe; all who stand outside are, tragically, lost. Our methods appear harsh, even wicked, to outsiders: we enslave their people, break down their cultures, and press them unwillingly into God's service. What they fail to understand is that this is their only hope; they are strong-willed, and set in their ways. Therefore, as sad as this duty may be, it is only by being broken, by losing their identities and their will, that they can be saved from the illusions that only lead them into torment, chaos, war, and, eventually, damnation.

"It is not for ourselves, but for the good of all humanity, that we must be unwavering in our devotion, though they may name us monsters for it. The future of our species, and of our very souls, depends on it."


Caldari: Lawful good (inward; lawful neutral re: outsiders, as the Caldari themselves would probably admit with a shrug).

"The universe is a vast place, and harsh. As it was with our heroic ancestors, if we are to survive, we must, first and last, look after our own. It is only through hard work, respect for tradition and authority, and obedience to our superiors that we can secure our place. Through this-- through cooperation and dedication to the common good-- we can secure a future, for ourselves and for our descendants.

"As the universe is harsh, so are the tasks facing us. To meet the challenge, we must order our society for optimal efficiency. There are those fit to lead, those fit to follow, and those unfit for either purpose. It is the business of our educational systems, and of our corporate meritocracies, to distinguish each from the others. Those who can be of service to their communities, their corporations, and their fellow Caldari as a people are placed so as to best aid in those roles.

"It is true that those who cannot serve their fellows, for whom no productive place can be found, sometimes fall by the wayside. It is a hard truth, but if we are to build a nation worthy of the heritage of the Raata, it can be no other way. Provide for those you care for, and help them to find a place. Failing that....

"We must remember, always, that what we do is for the sake of our children, and our children's children, down the cold corridors of time. Though the winter winds may howl beyond our walls, we must stand the test and feed the fires that warm us, together, united, for the sake of all Caldari."


Gallente: Neutral good.

[Insert your own impassioned, pro-representative democracy, pro-human rights, pro-civil disobedience (by other cultures' dissidents), possibly more than slightly libertarian-flavored screed here]


Minmatar: Lawful good.

"A thousand years ago, the vile Slavers descended from our ancestors' skies.

"These invaders took our land, yes, but it was not our land that they wanted. They wanted ourselves, our lives, our souls, bound into their service and the service of their god. To do this, they took our bodies and then set about destroying everything else about us.

"They tried, and tried their damnedest, but we survived. We persevered. Much was lost. And now, we are free! Free to follow our own ways, our own gods, our own leaders! Free to be as our ancestors were once before, to recover the old ways, the old laws!

"Much has been lost. The Amarr took our culture, our gods, our people. Even now, many of your own blood labor in their fields. Many more, twisted by a life in servitude worship the Amarrian god, the god of slavers!

"These, all of these, will be restored to us. This war will not end until our brothers and sisters are back among us. Those we have lost to the slaver god, we will have back-- and as for our lost traditions, our archaeologists learn more of our past with every passing day.

"The Gallente have been friends to us, it is true, but they are not of us, and they do not understand. They have lived easy lives, and however horrified they may be by the Amarr, they have never carried the burdens we have. Nor can they see the value, the importance, of what was stolen from us.

"Our beliefs, our traditions, our tribes, our way of life. Our form of government. All that we have lost, we must reclaim; only then, only when we are, once again, entirely ourselves will we be truly and entirely released the curse, the blight, the Amarr placed on our ancestors.

"Only then, when we are once more the tribes of Matar, entirely and fully, will we be truly free!"


The other factions seem like more of a mixed bag. SoE: clear Neutral good, in much the same way as Amnesty International: naiive, maybe; bad, no. ORE strikes me as having no special aspirations as a civilization: it's mostly a corporation that doesn't much like having its neck breathed down by other interests. So, probably Neutral. Same with InterBus.

Jove? ... Probably wistfully LG with regard to their own, could be almost anything with regard to others.

Then you've got the pirate factions: even more of a mixed bag. The Guristas strike me as aspirationally chaotic, with motives ranging all up and down the moral scale from "freedom fighter" (good) to "murderous thug" (obviously, evil). The Angel Cartel's leadership is apparently exceptionally ruthless (so, evil), but the organization itself is all about the internal law and order, so it could be cast as a LN version of the Caldari (with cheerfully LE attitudes towards the rest of the universe). The Blood Raiders, and Sani Sabik in general, are essentially cults of personal power in one way or another, so they'd be nigh-on unique in being outright aspirationally evil.

Meh. Being as the "great wheel" doesn't allow for nationality, this all doesn't really work very well, but it's a fun exercise in any case.
« Last Edit: 02 Nov 2011, 18:51 by Aria Jenneth »
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Seriphyn

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Re: Your Character's Alignment
« Reply #59 on: 03 Nov 2011, 14:36 »

Another thing to consider is combining alignment (or intent is better in EVE's case) with personality. For example, Seriphyn came out as Lawful Good (or sincere/selfless in EVE's case) yet publically he is quite aggressive and brash (his private personality I don't really publically disclose so that folks can explore it in RP). Similarly, you may have "Evil" characters (selfish, power-seeking in EVE's case) who will be a lot more nicer, polite and friendly than Seriphyn.
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