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[Zuzanna Alondra]

Role playing romantic relationships is one of the most interesting and complicated things in any role playing community. 

Lately however there it has seemed to me that I have observed, like the poster of the original thread, that there seems to be a strangely large amount of couples that are lesbian, cross-faction or both when compared to their counter-parts. (Where's the straight and gay couples?)

It made me pause and wonder - alot of female characters are played by men - does this go back to the joke from the girls locker room that men love watching two girls together?

The idea made me wonder as well what type of other relationships are in the RP community from what I see day to day? 

Seriphyn mentioned a few ideas that seem to be missing to his knowledge:

- Powerful Amarrian married couples, a Holder wife and husband who wield power over their domain as king and queen?
- Controversial Gallentean sweethearts, the focus of much fame and media attention. A war hero and his celebrity wife? An older, rich Gallentean businessman with a far too young model for a spouse?
- A Matari clan chief and priestess, being beacons of example and role models for the youth of their clan?
- A married Caldari couple with equal standing as the dastardly duo go from place to place striking deals and trades with various entities?

I personally know of a few "traditional" (I hate that word sometimes) couples if you will, male-female same race.  But they keep to themselves. 

This also brings up the other idea of is alot of romance role play us as the players just playing out our own hidden fantasies?  I know myself historically have been a very quiet person who unfortunately early in my young adult life was told, "If you get a man worked up enough that he wants it - it's cruel to tell them no." and therefore had always wanted to be able to be in a relationship where I felt very much in control. 

This naturally lead to finding great enjoyment in at least trying to play characters that relationship wise are very assertive when they decide they want someone.  It also lead me to making the mild OOC meta-gaming move of avoiding having Zu get "attached" to women - as I personally like my boys - even if Zu very well might on her own been bisexual. 

I also historically personally felt leery of letting my characters get involved with people where I know the player is single and looking or people that I didn't mesh with well on an OOC level - even if my character might of adored them.

Food for thought - add some salt folks.

[Casiella]

I admit to slight metagaming in this area. Note that I have not engaged in this sort of RP in EVE, though I have in other games like SWG, so my comments about my own experiences should be seen in that light. Casiella actually has hacked her implant to, erm, take care of her needs from time to time and shuns any sort of relationship. I might someday explore this with an alt, however.

First, I have never RPed an IC same-sex relationship. I'm just not comfortable with that for myself, though I've had IG friends in all sorts of RP configurations and I even frequently do not know (nor care) about the other player's RL gender or orientation. Despite Evanda once assuming that, being a G.I.R.L., I was almost certainly playing a lesbian, that's not so.

Second, after some bad experiences, I generally do not like any sort of relationship RP without a good bit of OOC communication before. I need to make sure that everyone involved knows "RP != RL" and "IC != OOC". In other words, my character might hit on your character, and might even go further, but that doesn't mean we have any sort of relationship. I'm a happily married man with kids who intends to stay that way. Preferably, the other player is also happy in a RL committed relationship and won't misconstrue anything. The two IC relationships that felt the most "real" for me both occurred with individuals whom I knew to be in marriages, and in one case I even chatted from time to time with one of their spouses.

Finally, if the other player annoys me OOCly, there'll be no IC relationship. This doesn't contradict the previous point. It works with it. If we can't get along, then there's no point in trying to have any sort of fun together.

[Milo Caman]

Some time ago, I Roleplayed Milo in a romantic relationship with another corpmate. (Opposite Sex) It eventually culminated in a FTB near-rape incident in a cargo elevator. I was slightly worried the person I was RP'ing with wouldn't FTB, and it'd be really awkward, and probably not that pleasant.

I think many of the 'same sex' relationships in EVE are often associated with cyber and therefore the stigma and issues surrounding that.

This was during a time where the directorate were worried that RP Dramaz were happening, due to a lot of 'unrealistic' relationships, and (to my utter amazement) I was cited as a good example of a believable one.

[Mitara Newelle]

FTB?

[Milo Caman]

FTB?

Fade to Black

[Casiella]

Fade to black.

[Mitara Newelle]

Ah! Thank you!

Also, the known tally of 'traditional' couples is +1 if someone is keeping track as Mit is involved with a Ni-Kunni male.

[Seriphyn]

Indeed, the issue is that many of these same-sex relationships have a vast amount of cyb0rs in them. It's mostly male-male player, but I have come across the odd male-female player in a same-sex female character config (there is a big trend of female players behaving bi-curiously in EVE RP). I mean, RP is RP, it should be fun, right? If people enjoy RPing that, that's ok. Just the issue is what it means for the image of EVE RP overall.

I'm sure there are plenty of straight couples in EVE RP, but I would like to see them RP more publicly? It would be nice to contribute to realism, or something...

As Casiella brought up, I think the biggest thing is the giant questionable morality that is brought up in that area. Hell, FTBing fixes a lot of these problems, and both players being male I think also fixes it....I dunno, it's one of those things we don't talk about much as RPers, but when we do, it all gets very awkward...

[Laerise [PIE]]

Not to sound arrogant, but if people don't bother me with what they do in private I couldn't care less what they do.

Right now I can only think of one example of this alleged "space lesbian" relationships, and that one's so well known and, to me, annoying, that I'll happily regard it as the exception from the norm.
But then, maybe its just because the amarrian RP scene which I frequent is a lot more pious about these things, privacy and all that.

[Ulphus]

I'm running two relationships at the moment, one M/F and the other F/M.

In both cases, the other player is female.

There is a significant amount of "fade to black" involved

There's also a certain amount of "Fade up from black" for the after-snuggling and relationship building conversation stuff.

I don't completely understand what Seri means by

I'm sure there are plenty of straight couples in EVE RP, but I would like to see them RP more publicly? It would be nice to contribute to realism, or something...

Do you mean that they should be doing more PDA? Or hanging out in bars where you can watch? Or just having more of a presence so people know that there are IC-hetero couples out there?

[Casiella]

Seri, can you elaborate on the issues of questionable morality and things you feel need 'fixing' in this area?

[Seriphyn]

Do you mean that they should be doing more PDA? Or hanging out in bars where you can watch? Or just having more of a presence so people know that there are IC-hetero couples out there?

The third thing, I think. Presence. The F/F couples roleplay everywhere in public, that's fine, but let's see some straight couples with the same amount of presence.

And I approve of FTB. cyb0rz RP has a horrid trend of destroying any other meaningful RP between players/characters. At least, talking from personal experience.

@Casiella

When a single guy ERPs with a married woman, or two married players do so, it just seems a bit dodgy? I don't know myself, I have chosen to ignore these issues and just go with it anyway :S...kinda bad idea. These moral issues seem to be alleviated with FTB and players of the same sex.

[Casiella]

Let me say this as politely as I possibly can.

Seri, you may wish to rethink whether the RP of others behind closed doors (whether they choose FTB or to RP more details) really should present any problems you feel anyone else should "fix". Frankly, it's none of your (or my) damn business what they do. Certainly it's not my business what you do, heh.

But I do not believe that spending time and energy worrying about other people and their approaches to RP relationships (or RL relationships, for that matter) is something useful in any sense.

I have a lot more to say here, but I can't think of how to do so within the guidelines for the site, so I'll leave it there for now.

[Shalee Lianne]

Why does anyone expect realism in a spaceship game?  Rp should be fun, interesting, and keep those who are doing the playing intrigued.

I personally don't want a normal boring relationship in RP.  Thats what real life is for.

[Seriphyn]

If you checked out RP in more public channels, you will see that these issues aren't necessarily private. If they were, it wouldn't have been brought up. Hell, I think even Verone came out in the OOC channel with similar views one time...

@Shalee. Point, but some of this stuff turns me off. F/F couples? Great. F/F couples making out in a bar channel? Not great. In fact, the same goes with M/F couples. Like that IRL too. Get a room!