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[Ava Starfire]

To be honest, I dont know?

Ava seems to have plenty of people willing to rip into her, and she rips into people (Meiyi and Sanguina come to mind) whether theyre men or women if she thinks theyre tards.

Of course, people give me a lot of stuff; is this because they know I am a woman IRL?

I clicked "i dont know" because I seriously dont know?

[Natalcya Katla]

I actually haven't gotten this impression at all. In my years of playing Katla, she's been addressed or described in such words as "cold-hearted bitch" (of course), "coward" (well, she won't protest that one), "race traitor" (as though she ever swore an oath of loyalty to her race in the first place), "CONCORD fairy" (whatever 'fairy' means in Syndicate Pikey), "Captain Cardboard" (I used this as an MSN nick for a while), "toaster" (well, naturally) and simply "creature" (used as an address - a favorite of mine). She's also been accused of crimes against nature. And those are just the ones I remember. She's provoked positive reactions from people as well, of course, but I wouldn't say they outweigh the negative ones.

Ruby is more well-liked, but she's gotten her share of condemnation, too, and been denounced as "evil" on several occasions.

And I've seen my fair share of male characters who seem to have no trouble getting positive IC interaction wherever they go. Jude Kopenhagen comes to mind as an example.

One possible explanation for this perception could be that a huge chunk of EVE roleplay (in my experience) traditionally happens in a bar environment, between strangers or casual acquaintances. That's a setting that lends itself naturally well to interaction between genders, or at least along lines of sexual compatibility.

[DeadRow]

And I've seen my fair share of male characters who seem to have no trouble getting positive IC interaction wherever they go. Jude Kopenhagen comes to mind as an example.

wat

[Natalcya Katla]

Tasha Ayanara is another recent example in favor of the argument that playing a female character does not protect you from IC shitstorms over whatever controversial issues you're fronting: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=139086&find=unread

Diana Kim would count as another, I'd say. And historically, both Jade Constantine and Revan Neferis are examples of female characters who've provoked a lot of vitriol from other characters. There are many others, too.

[ArtOfLight]

Nat,

I think the issue is more that female characters are receive a better welcome initially (at first glance, so to speak). In general people seem to be more responsive and kind to female characters until that character proves to be more provocative and irritating.

[GoGo Yubari]

Yeah, there is a big difference. In my experience, it wasn't as huge in Eve - but that may be because it was fairly commonly known that I was a male player behind a female character. However, in instances where it hasn't been clear, the differences have been startling. My female blood elf rogue gets treated VASTLY differently from my male characters.

In short, all the stereotypes and legends are true, eg. a female avatar gets free stuff, makes friends far easier and receives offers - veiled, indirect and joking - for cyber.

I don't think the reasons for different treatment stem from RP or the IC dimension, but the OOC level of omgagirl. It's not really all that different from RL, except the barrier to approach is far lower and every girl is potentially the girl of your dreams when your imagination calls the shots.

It's a little absurd, quite funny and just the way things are, apparently.

[Morwen Lagann]

There was also the case of Elizabeth Vea. The lynching she had to face looks like any gender would have faced the same thing.

Without going into too many details, I feel this needs to be clarified: that so-called "lynching" was earned entirely through Vea's own hard work and effort, and every bit of the response was deserved. She had many opportunities to change her behavior, and pretty much declined them all.

Tasha Ayanara is another recent example in favor of the argument that playing a female character does not protect you from IC shitstorms over whatever controversial issues you're fronting: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=139086&find=unread

With Tasha having turned out to be one of Vea's myriad alts, this result really wasn't too much of a surprise in retrospect.

I think a language barrier is partly to blame for Diana's case. That said, I would happily slap the character with a brick IRL if they tried arguing with me the way they do it on the IGS, perfect English or no.

Not going to touch the examples of Revan and Jade, primarily because that's mostly old(er than me) history. 


Anyway, I said I'd go into more detail earlier:

I prefer to use female characters for RP because I find it a more engaging experience for me. I'm not sure whether it causes a difference in the amount of interaction I get; I can personally state that the reason Morwen tends to shy away from talking to (most) guys is due to the fact that the attitudes just aren't appealing to interact with. There's only so many ways a conversation can go when one side is constantly trying to show off how big his dick is or get laid, which seems to be the prevailing attitude among male characters in EVE that I've witnessed. (That's not to say that it's the only attitude, or that female characters don't exhibit it either, of course, but Morwen's oft-repeated claim that the multitude of bi/lesbian capsuleers is due to the lack of a decent selection of men isn't pulled out of her ass, contrary to the belief of some. )

I've personally steered away from RPing a male character as well because I just don't enjoy it - it's 'different' to me in the wrong ways, whereas RPing a character like Morwen is 'different' in the right ones. It's a little hard to explain.

[John Revenent]

I don't notice a difference (When I play either). I usually only RP a male in any game, I think it mostly has to do with the personality of the character. Female characters tend to act differently then male one, so in the end its what the person is comfortable with. When I make IC interactions with John, male, or female they are treated the same respect.. well depending if he can take them seriously or not.

vOv

[Makkal]

I have a theory - it's pulled from ass-space, so make of it what you will.

In most MMORPGs, the women are mostly played by men. And men usually RP women because they're not interested in 'stereotypically male' behavior. Women are allowed to have a greater emotional range and aren't immediately tossed into a more-badass-than-thou competition.

And it becomes a cycle of sorts. If you're a guy and you want to play someone who's friendly or someone who doesn't irritate others, you feel it's easier to play a woman. People get used to women being the friendlier characters, so they treat them nicer and are more tolerant of them.

Though I do think the original post overstates the case. There are a few Amarr women who come into the Summit, demand people call them Lady, and almost always end up in a fight about something or another.

[Matariki Rain]

I'm told, by some male friends who play female characters in other, avatar-based MMOs, that their choice was motivated by the desire to have something pleasant to look at if they were going to be spending that many hours watching its rear view.

This might not have anything to do with choices in EVE, where you're as likely to be looking at the rear view of a Drake...

[Lyn Farel]

There was also the case of Elizabeth Vea. The lynching she had to face looks like any gender would have faced the same thing.

Without going into too many details, I feel this needs to be clarified: that so-called "lynching" was earned entirely through Vea's own hard work and effort, and every bit of the response was deserved. She had many opportunities to change her behavior, and pretty much declined them all.

Well yes, I never said the contrary. IC consequences and all that. It was just an example. But I could very well take Lyn instead, a lot of people want to slap her as soon as she opens her mouth.

Of course, it has only been true for the last year or so since it was quite different before. People actually found her interesting, clever, and endearing, with a few exceptions. Maybe because she started to aggro the Amarr bloc in the first place, so people liked it ? But no, I think it was more tied to the fact that she mostly dealt with people with few friends, relations, or not very famous in the community. Recently she has started arguing with people that are more appreciated or have strong ties in the community, and the result is totally different. Where she was seen as intelligent and fresh before, she is now seen as the lecturing ass of the IGS.

I think a language barrier is partly to blame for Diana's case. That said, I would happily slap the character with a brick IRL if they tried arguing with me the way they do it on the IGS, perfect English or no.

You might have put the finger on something. I have a hard time sometimes to be more diplomatic than I already am, OOCly or ICly, and it might well be because of that. Sometimes you just can't find another way to say things, or you just do not "hear" it the same way a native would. This may also be why I quite like Diana's character. Well, I wouldnt like her OOCly ofc, but the character in itself is quite good in her own way.

( I usually have more trouble with constantly whining characters... but nobody likes whiny emo characters, be it in a novel or ICly, they are annoying as hell)

I prefer to use female characters for RP because I find it a more engaging experience for me. I'm not sure whether it causes a difference in the amount of interaction I get; I can personally state that the reason Morwen tends to shy away from talking to (most) guys is due to the fact that the attitudes just aren't appealing to interact with. There's only so many ways a conversation can go when one side is constantly trying to show off how big his dick is or get laid, which seems to be the prevailing attitude among male characters in EVE that I've witnessed. (That's not to say that it's the only attitude, or that female characters don't exhibit it either, of course, but Morwen's oft-repeated claim that the multitude of bi/lesbian capsuleers is due to the lack of a decent selection of men isn't pulled out of her ass, contrary to the belief of some. )

I've personally steered away from RPing a male character as well because I just don't enjoy it - it's 'different' to me in the wrong ways, whereas RPing a character like Morwen is 'different' in the right ones. It's a little hard to explain.

I think I couldnt either play a male character in eve. Maybe because I do not feel like playing male characters in very realistic settings (I mean, unlike adventures, great sagas and the likes where playing males suddenly becomes a lot more interesting for me).

I can agree that a good part of the male characters are dicks, but I still think it is overexagerated to say that all of them are. As I already said, a good part of female characters are just whores or phantasms directly coming out of nerd fantasies, but nothing really sounding like a real girl. And a lot of them also are male disguised in females, meaning females litterally behaving like males.

Also, I know quite a lot of male characters that do not fit to your description.

[ArtOfLight]

Well yes, I never said the contrary. IC consequences and all that. It was just an example. But I could very well take Lyn instead, a lot of people want to slap her as soon as she opens her mouth.

Of course, it has only been true for the last year or so since it was quite different before. People actually found her interesting, clever, and endearing, with a few exceptions. Maybe because she started to aggro the Amarr bloc in the first place, so people liked it ? But no, I think it was more tied to the fact that she mostly dealt with people with few friends, relations, or not very famous in the community. Recently she has started arguing with people that are more appreciated or have strong ties in the community, and the result is totally different. Where she was seen as intelligent and fresh before, she is now seen as the lecturing ass of the IGS.

Personally, I find that the issue most people take with Lyn isn't whom she's arguing with but what she's arguing about and how she goes about arguing. To put it simply, she seems to find anything she can argue about and argue it with anyone at any time about any subject and seems to ignore the responses of whom she's arguing with our completely take them out of context in order to keep arguing them.

Please don't take this is an attack on you or your character, it's merely my perception and why my characters have personally stopped talking to her in the past.

I can agree that a good part of the male characters are dicks, but I still think it is overexagerated to say that all of them are. As I already said, a good part of female characters are just whores or phantasms directly coming out of nerd fantasies, but nothing really sounding like a real girl. And a lot of them also are male disguised in females, meaning females litterally behaving like males.

Also, I know quite a lot of male characters that do not fit to your description.

Just to clarify, Morwen didn't say "all of them were dicks," she said "a good majority" of them, which you agreed with.

[Lyn Farel]

Well yes, I never said the contrary. IC consequences and all that. It was just an example. But I could very well take Lyn instead, a lot of people want to slap her as soon as she opens her mouth.

Of course, it has only been true for the last year or so since it was quite different before. People actually found her interesting, clever, and endearing, with a few exceptions. Maybe because she started to aggro the Amarr bloc in the first place, so people liked it ? But no, I think it was more tied to the fact that she mostly dealt with people with few friends, relations, or not very famous in the community. Recently she has started arguing with people that are more appreciated or have strong ties in the community, and the result is totally different. Where she was seen as intelligent and fresh before, she is now seen as the lecturing ass of the IGS.

Personally, I find that the issue most people take with Lyn isn't whom she's arguing with but what she's arguing about and how she goes about arguing. To put it simply, she seems to find anything she can argue about and argue it with anyone at any time about any subject and seems to ignore the responses of whom she's arguing with our completely take them out of context in order to keep arguing them.

Please don't take this is an attack on you or your character, it's merely my perception and why my characters have personally stopped talking to her in the past.

Well, it may be an OOC issue then. I do not even understand why OOCly. But this is not the thread to speak about it anyway.

I can agree that a good part of the male characters are dicks, but I still think it is overexagerated to say that all of them are. As I already said, a good part of female characters are just whores or phantasms directly coming out of nerd fantasies, but nothing really sounding like a real girl. And a lot of them also are male disguised in females, meaning females litterally behaving like males.

Also, I know quite a lot of male characters that do not fit to your description.

Just to clarify, Morwen didn't say "all of them were dicks," she said "a good majority" of them, which you agreed with.

Yes indeed, and this is why I don't understand why talking to women is somehow better than men considering female characters suffer from the same amount of issues than male characters.

[GoGo Yubari]

I have a theory - it's pulled from ass-space, so make of it what you will.

In most MMORPGs, the women are mostly played by men. And men usually RP women because they're not interested in 'stereotypically male' behavior. Women are allowed to have a greater emotional range and aren't immediately tossed into a more-badass-than-thou competition.

And it becomes a cycle of sorts. If you're a guy and you want to play someone who's friendly or someone who doesn't irritate others, you feel it's easier to play a woman. People get used to women being the friendlier characters, so they treat them nicer and are more tolerant of them.

Though I think your theory ignores the primary fact that men just treat women/girls differently (and even perceived females, as the case here may be), with a lot of supplicating behavior in order to earn approval, I think there's something to your theory in regards as to why there's plenty men playing female characters so there could be some of that going on as well, certainly.

My thinking on that says there's two behavioral things going on:

The first is in accords with archetypal behavior: to be "cool" a male has to act a certain way, while a female can act another way and still be "cool", and most folks want their characters to be "cool". That's not to say it's impossible to be cool in another way, just that it is usually more difficult and requires originality along with good execution.

The second is the players just wanting to play with different gender roles, the traits in relevance of which you elaborated.

[Lyn Farel]

To be honest I don't think it is the same for a majority of people, but I tend to consider characters the same way an author does. I do not care at all if it is a male or female, I just choose to play one or the other depending on what I want to do and what I have in mind.