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Author Topic: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE  (Read 31762 times)

Louella Dougans

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Re: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE
« Reply #150 on: 28 Mar 2012, 11:59 »



saw this, lol'd
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BloodBird

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Re: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE
« Reply #151 on: 28 Mar 2012, 16:14 »

10 pages worth of bitching about the end, impressive. Let's talk about something more interesting and enjoyable; the remaining 95% of the game called Mass Effect 3 that took place before the admittedly shitty ending. Because it was shitty, you all said what is worth saying about it, we all await a fix to it that makes it all better.

Where to start... might as well start with the things that annoyed me, to get the negative things out of my mind. In order of recollection, not how much I like/dislike.

James Vega. Could they come up with a more bastardized amalgamation of all stereotypical american marines ever? Spanish tendencies, testosterone-leaking figure and shape, wears the buzz-cut, thin sweaty short, wears his tags around his neck for display of loyalty to "the core" bitches about his lost companions and his guilt over choosing the mission over his comrades, bitches about leaving Earth and the first when adding one more soldier is the obviously right thing to do, assigns annoying nick-names to people, recklessly Idon'tgiveashitifIdie brave, and so on.

I wanted to be able to enjoy him as a character, but found that I couldn't, he just came off as a completely overdone stereotype to me. This is a shame, he's the only Human team-member AFAIK, and falls into the same pit as Jacob, Miranda, Kaiden and Ashley - comrades that see minimal use. The result? Shepard goes to town with her alien team-mates helping her do the job Alliance Marines should be doing.

The cliché guilt-trip with the damn dead kid on Earth and the ensuing nightmares. Entirely a waste of my time and patience. No, with the estimated 400 or so harvesting ships on Earth killing about 1.8 million Humans EVERY.DAY. my Shepard has more things to worry about than one measly kid not making it out when it's quite likely tens of thousands to hundred of thousands of kids die every day on Earth. When the war with the Reapers is over there will be plenty of space to go around for the survivors as there won't be 11 billion Humans on the planet anymore, but I still have to slow-walk around this over-blown nightmare section caring that this kid got put on fire at the end of it.

Absurd cut-scene animations - Okay, so we just beat a mission and Garrus is covering us with his weapon while we get into the shuttle. Wait, why is he using an Avenger rifle, I kind of gave him a Revenant LMG to mow down reaper scum with... guess he ran out of ammo, or something. The most absurd example would have to be the scene on Mars where you gun down Eva, with the Predator pistol that you did not take with you, replacing it with a light-weight SMG and other weapons. Why oh why could they simply not swap out whatever weapon you were using? All you needed for the scene was 2-3 shots at her to get by. Would it be to hard to animate in the shape and sound of whatever weapon you and companions used in different cut-scenes? Apparently so. This kills a bit of the immersion, tbh.

Final mission is in London. Of course, of course it is, because London is the center of the universe.

Except is isn't really, but I'm sick and tired of this trope. The Reapers could have built their damn tela-pota-towa any-fucking-where on Earth but they had to chose a well-known and oft-invaded-by-aliens-and-the-occult city in a well known nation. Why not the capital of Lithuania, some speck of farm-land deep in China or some other place in Britain or wherever? Well, likely same reason as dangling the soon-to-be-dead little guilt-trap in front of your face; you are supposed to care, and this is just to help you along - after all, who gives a fuck about any other little place when a well-known location in the world happens to be the eye of the storm?

I'm sure there is more but can't recall atm, so let's get to some of the positive things.

Javik. I love him, his entire character-build is just flawless. From his interactions with Liara and her growing disillusion about the Protheans to his companionship on missions and the wonderful way he burned James after the latter inquired about his humor and jokes. I had not laughed that hard in quite some time. Or the first time he meets Tali and his instant response to her question. Priceless. I'm still rather annoyed about the day-1 DLC thing even if the reasons why were explained to me (and the reasons were legit, AFAICT) and I still loved it's content. It was worth the money, even if 800 bioware points wasn't much.

The whole relationship between the Krogan, Turians and Salarians and the missions derived from them. Very nicely done. I loved the fact that I found myself quite literally agonizing over the choice presented to me before and during the last mission on Tutchanka. This whole section felt very well done, and along with the different points of view presented from Eve, the Salerians and the ancient history of the Krogan cemented the entire feel of that section very, very nicely.

The Quarian/Geth war and it's events. I loved every second, and hope to alter my desperate last actions to salvage the situation. Honestly, the entire part of the game going over these two's history was amazing - diving into the Geth's memory, seeing the past, weighting the opinions and deeds of both towards each other... the best, and worst, part was the end. Originally I tried to salvage the situation and get both the geth and quarians with me. Good of all, right? That failed, but I did not know that until I had unceremoniously chosen the geth and saw what became of the flotilla and Tali. Few other games have created a reaction like that, fighting off that sinking feeling in my gut while asking myself "What have I done?!" as if I'd just killed someone. Loading back to see the alternative, losing the geth and Legion was not in anyway better, it was in fact just as bad. Having to chose between them was in fact quite agonizing, and I loved it for it.

There is more, but I'll leave it at this for now. I wonder what people think of the rest of the game, in all honesty.
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Gottii

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Re: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE
« Reply #152 on: 28 Mar 2012, 19:57 »

My ending didnt have to pick between the Geth or the Quarians.  I had both actually. 

EDIT: the fact that I only have one ending is a huge indictment of this game.  I normally run through like three endings of the first two MEs before I was happy.  Now?  No interest in playing it again, even though 99% of it was great.
« Last Edit: 28 Mar 2012, 19:58 by Gottii »
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Lyn Farel

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Re: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE
« Reply #153 on: 29 Mar 2012, 05:58 »

10 pages worth of bitching about the end, impressive. Let's talk about something more interesting and enjoyable; the remaining 95% of the game called Mass Effect 3 that took place before the admittedly shitty ending. Because it was shitty, you all said what is worth saying about it, we all await a fix to it that makes it all better.

Where to start... might as well start with the things that annoyed me, to get the negative things out of my mind. In order of recollection, not how much I like/dislike.

James Vega. Could they come up with a more bastardized amalgamation of all stereotypical american marines ever? Spanish tendencies, testosterone-leaking figure and shape, wears the buzz-cut, thin sweaty short, wears his tags around his neck for display of loyalty to "the core" bitches about his lost companions and his guilt over choosing the mission over his comrades, bitches about leaving Earth and the first when adding one more soldier is the obviously right thing to do, assigns annoying nick-names to people, recklessly Idon'tgiveashitifIdie brave, and so on.

I wanted to be able to enjoy him as a character, but found that I couldn't, he just came off as a completely overdone stereotype to me. This is a shame, he's the only Human team-member AFAIK, and falls into the same pit as Jacob, Miranda, Kaiden and Ashley - comrades that see minimal use. The result? Shepard goes to town with her alien team-mates helping her do the job Alliance Marines should be doing.

Yeah, though weirdly enough he did not annoy me as much as Miranda for instance, or even Jacob, considering how dumb the answers the latter gave me. I was ok with James because somehow he was not making his way on the foreground himself as much as the other ones. I found him pretty retired at times, which was welcome.

Also, I am not that harsh with Kaiden and Ashley. I think they still perform OK as characters, even if sometimes built on cliché (like the whole series anyway).

The cliché guilt-trip with the damn dead kid on Earth and the ensuing nightmares. Entirely a waste of my time and patience. No, with the estimated 400 or so harvesting ships on Earth killing about 1.8 million Humans EVERY.DAY. my Shepard has more things to worry about than one measly kid not making it out when it's quite likely tens of thousands to hundred of thousands of kids die every day on Earth. When the war with the Reapers is over there will be plenty of space to go around for the survivors as there won't be 11 billion Humans on the planet anymore, but I still have to slow-walk around this over-blown nightmare section caring that this kid got put on fire at the end of it.

Oh yes, that was annoying. I facepalmed everytime I saw that.

Absurd cut-scene animations - Okay, so we just beat a mission and Garrus is covering us with his weapon while we get into the shuttle. Wait, why is he using an Avenger rifle, I kind of gave him a Revenant LMG to mow down reaper scum with... guess he ran out of ammo, or something. The most absurd example would have to be the scene on Mars where you gun down Eva, with the Predator pistol that you did not take with you, replacing it with a light-weight SMG and other weapons. Why oh why could they simply not swap out whatever weapon you were using? All you needed for the scene was 2-3 shots at her to get by. Would it be to hard to animate in the shape and sound of whatever weapon you and companions used in different cut-scenes? Apparently so. This kills a bit of the immersion, tbh.

It has been the case since ME1. Here in ME3, it doesnt do it 100% of the time, which is at least better...

Final mission is in London. Of course, of course it is, because London is the center of the universe.

Except is isn't really, but I'm sick and tired of this trope. The Reapers could have built their damn tela-pota-towa any-fucking-where on Earth but they had to chose a well-known and oft-invaded-by-aliens-and-the-occult city in a well known nation. Why not the capital of Lithuania, some speck of farm-land deep in China or some other place in Britain or wherever? Well, likely same reason as dangling the soon-to-be-dead little guilt-trap in front of your face; you are supposed to care, and this is just to help you along - after all, who gives a fuck about any other little place when a well-known location in the world happens to be the eye of the storm?

Art.

More seriously, it makes sense artistic direction wise. It maybe does not make a lot of sense besides, but it does for art. Choosing the asshole of the world as a location would have been... Weird. For the scenario, you just ruin the climax, or at least do not maximize it, if the location has no meaning for us, humans. Choosing any other capital of any country would basically get us back to the same point, where it would have been "why X and not Y?", especially if the trope was a city like NY that have been done and redone countless times thanks to hollywood. Well at least, to that why X and not Y question, I think I can propose an answer, for what it is. They were looking for a dark setting fitting with the apocalyptic atmosphere, almost black and white, they wanted. The London architecture style is the key for me. It is dark and sharp in its own way. There is almost something goth and historic in it you do not generally find elsewhere. Of course, this is choice, and other choices could have been made with a little work, but this one works.



The whole relationship between the Krogan, Turians and Salarians and the missions derived from them. Very nicely done. I loved the fact that I found myself quite literally agonizing over the choice presented to me before and during the last mission on Tutchanka. This whole section felt very well done, and along with the different points of view presented from Eve, the Salerians and the ancient history of the Krogan cemented the entire feel of that section very, very nicely.

The Quarian/Geth war and it's events. I loved every second, and hope to alter my desperate last actions to salvage the situation. Honestly, the entire part of the game going over these two's history was amazing - diving into the Geth's memory, seeing the past, weighting the opinions and deeds of both towards each other... the best, and worst, part was the end. Originally I tried to salvage the situation and get both the geth and quarians with me. Good of all, right? That failed, but I did not know that until I had unceremoniously chosen the geth and saw what became of the flotilla and Tali. Few other games have created a reaction like that, fighting off that sinking feeling in my gut while asking myself "What have I done?!" as if I'd just killed someone. Loading back to see the alternative, losing the geth and Legion was not in anyway better, it was in fact just as bad. Having to chose between them was in fact quite agonizing, and I loved it for it.

There is more, but I'll leave it at this for now. I wonder what people think of the rest of the game, in all honesty.

Nothing to add really, this is mostly how I felt it too, even if I did not tried the "choose between the quarrians and the geths" possibility.

But as I said somewhere in this topic, the art and screeplay was a lot better than in the previous titles and the setting was more, more mature and serious.
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Seriphyn

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Re: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE
« Reply #154 on: 29 Mar 2012, 10:04 »

I'm just glad James Vega didn't say "ese"

Also, I really didn't think London was a cliched choice at all, considering it's always some boring, grideron American city. As Lyn said, the London architecture really played into the feel of the last mission.

It's also a War of the Worlds nod (Reapers and their trumpets).
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Random Sentience

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Re: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE
« Reply #155 on: 30 Mar 2012, 02:45 »

The cliché guilt-trip with the damn dead kid on Earth and the ensuing nightmares. Entirely a waste of my time and patience. No, with the estimated 400 or so harvesting ships on Earth killing about 1.8 million Humans EVERY.DAY. my Shepard has more things to worry about than one measly kid not making it out when it's quite likely tens of thousands to hundred of thousands of kids die every day on Earth. When the war with the Reapers is over there will be plenty of space to go around for the survivors as there won't be 11 billion Humans on the planet anymore, but I still have to slow-walk around this over-blown nightmare section caring that this kid got put on fire at the end of it.
Well, to be fair, the whole world could be burning and I could focus on doing what I needed to do for the greater good. Suffering in Africa, the homeless, same thing... I continue to live my life. If my son or daughter (or even the crazy good-for-nothing kid I've only seen while he tags my front door) is injured in front of me, that will scar me. If I find out a child I know is starving or being abused, I'm going to do something.

There's some psychology mumbo-jumbo that explains it all, and some evolutionary biology papers and market research backing it up. Also, they don't put video of kids starving on those "feed the children" commercials just because they can; there's quantifiable data (and cold hard cash) showing that it's more effective than spouting off statistics.

Yes, it's cliched, but it's cliched because it works (generally speaking).

EDIT: Also, the kid is probably supposed to represent the faceless masses (also represented in the nightmares as the "shadows"/"whispers"... there's a whole mixed dream symbolism thing going on there that I just try and nod, smile, and continue on as if it didn't happen, because DAMN Shepard is one messed up dude/dudette).
« Last Edit: 30 Mar 2012, 02:49 by Random Sentience »
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Graelyn

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Re: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE
« Reply #156 on: 30 Mar 2012, 15:58 »

I loved the dream sequences.

So Suck It.
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BloodBird

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Re: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE
« Reply #157 on: 30 Mar 2012, 19:25 »

I loved the dream sequences.

So Suck It.

A bit more elaboration on the why would be nice, so get to it ;)
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GoGo Yubari

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Re: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE
« Reply #158 on: 30 Mar 2012, 19:38 »

The dream sequences are indeed pretty cliche and I took them as such, but as I like to say "everything in this game is a scifi cliche in a playable format" so it doesn't put me off the game.

For a Renegade or one struggling with/incorporating Renegade inclinations Shephard, the kid can be seen to represent his innocence. You are trying to save him in the beginning and he runs away, raising the question "are you a monster?" I found that rather compelling, in fact. I guess for the Paragon he's more about the humanity you are out to save.
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Graelyn

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Re: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE
« Reply #159 on: 30 Mar 2012, 19:39 »

When you see the kid in the beginning, he TELLS you the part of the ending that drives people crazy.

"You Can't Save Me."

You can't. Him, or the galaxy as you know it.

Chasing him through the whispers of (all dead) compatriots from the three games was an attempt to save him anyways. You still can't. Everything goes into the fire. Everything.

When the last of these sequences showed Shepherd joining him (happily) in the flames, I knew the ending that was coming for the game. The hows and why and particulars were yet to be explained, but I knew: You can't save this galaxy of yours, and you can't save yourself.

Usually, dream sequences are simply used to build drama and give portents of doom. This was a correct prophecy of doom, handed to you, making you walk through it. Three Times.

Also, I loved the music.  8)
« Last Edit: 30 Mar 2012, 19:41 by Graelyn »
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GoGo Yubari

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Re: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE
« Reply #160 on: 30 Mar 2012, 19:41 »

Yeah, Graelyn, stick it to 'em! It's lonely in this thread being one of few who didn't go ballistic at the ending.  8)
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Graelyn

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Re: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE
« Reply #161 on: 30 Mar 2012, 19:43 »

Don't get me wrong, I UNDERSTAND the rage at the ending.

I wish there was more choice. I really do.

What I don't think is that the ending I got had no place there. In many places the game was literally beating you over the head with the outcome. The whole Orgs v Synth was a weird way to get to that point tho. The other glaring inconsistencies bug me too.

Still, EVERYTHING IS REBOOTED/KILLED/PURGED IN FAVOR OF NEW PARADIGM shouldn't have been a massive surprise.
« Last Edit: 30 Mar 2012, 19:45 by Graelyn »
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GoGo Yubari

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Re: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE
« Reply #162 on: 31 Mar 2012, 09:23 »

Yeah, I agree. If I hadn't seen it coming, I might've been more disappointed. That said, the ending suggested by the Indoctrination Theory would be magnificent.
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Lyn Farel

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Re: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE
« Reply #163 on: 31 Mar 2012, 18:38 »

[irrelevant]
« Last Edit: 01 Apr 2012, 04:41 by Lyn Farel »
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BloodBird

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Re: Mass Effect 3 - SPOILERS INSIDE
« Reply #164 on: 05 Apr 2012, 05:30 »

So I've come to realize that once you complete ME3 once, the percentage of Paragon/Renegade you got is solidified and unchanging. It appears to be completely impossible to take a character that has already run through ME3 once again and changing the morality percentages; if you had 50/50 Paragon/Renegade but want to change this to say, 100% Paragon, you can't. No matter what you do, no matter what choices you make the messages that pop up with morality score is a lie; your morality bar will not change. At all.

So when I ran through the second run hoping to tweak the bar slightly to get a few options available that were unavailable in the first run, I soon found that I was wasting my time. The only way to get a different mix would be to re-start a fresh run with a stock or imported toon, once again.

And I really wanted to know how things went with peace between the Geth and Quarians, too. Oh well.

Maybe in a couple months will I run a fresh toon through the game, because the morality won't change on a second run and neither can you alter class, even if you changed classes between ME2 and ME3. At least this point makes more sense...
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