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[Saikoyu]

So I have recently hit a bit of a dead end as to what I should look towards getting next in the way of a lvl 4 capable ship.  I will always go back to a Rattlesnake for afking because it does the job and I like it, but it is so slow doing the job.  I'd want something faster, some thing I actually have to fly and not just park somewhere and launch drones and missiles. 

So, I'll start by saying what I am not looking for.  I am not looking for maximum isk per hour in a lvl 4 mission runner ship.  I have other ways of making isk besides missions.  I am not looking for something pimped out to the max, I like T2 just fine for most things.  And I am not looking for something slow and afk worthy, I know how to fit a Rattlesnake and it is fine for that. 

What I am looking for is something that I can log in, get a mission and fifteen or so minutes later I am flying through a field of wrecks.  Also, something that looks nice, but I think Minmatar looks nice, so that's up for debate.  And fun as well, something that I have to fly, and demands somethig of my mind. 

Given all of that, what do people think would be the best ship and fit for lvl 4s?  I have heard about the Machariel and the Vargur, which seem like solid choices, but I like oddball fits in the name of speed and firepower. 

Bonus points if you can think of a PvE Hyperion that does the above. 

[Casiella]

Why not a Phoon?

[Kohiko Sun]

Tenguuuuuuuu!

It's very fun to be something the size of a Machariel's engine while orbiting that same Machariel at 500m while it and 12 of its friends are trying to blob you to death.

[Katrina Oniseki]

All four T3s require attention, with the slight exception of the Tengu. The Tengu is very easy to fly and permatank, but not overpowered enough that you wouldn't have to pay any attention to your ship when fit with only T2. I highly recommend deadspace mods for your primary tank, whatever that may be. (Shield boosters, armor reps, speed mods)

T3s are small, lively, and gorgeously built machines of death. Stunningly effective, and flexible, they can be fit to require some skill to fly well, or can be fit to be a lazy AFK boat by overtanking the crap out of them.

They even have some flexibility to try and put some real effort into trying to use odd setups... like a railgun Tengu. It can be done, but it will require your attention to fly and win.

If you have the ISK to throw down for a Vargur or Mach, you have the ISK to throw down for a basic T3 build.

I might suggest a HAM Tengu, since I am Caldari. Brutal DPS and requires some piloting skill to pull off well. Watch out for webs, etc...

Or maybe a blaster brawler Proteus? Lots of ideas.

[Kazzzi]

Gank pulse fit, single rep Apoc, Navy Apoc or Paladin. You can't permatank most missions so you must kill quickly, thereby demanding a bit of attention, but you can still finish pretty much every mission solo and in a decent amount of time.

[Esna Pitoojee]

Gank pulse fit, single rep Apoc, Navy Apoc or Paladin. You can't permatank most missions so you must kill quickly, thereby demanding a bit of attention, but you can still finish pretty much every mission solo and in a decent amount of time.

Similarly, the Abaddon (although it's a bit lower on the DPS, a bit more forgiving on the tank, and requires nigh-perfect cap skills to use effectively). If you have a good bit of ISK to throw down and some time to crosstrain, the Nightmare is an option as well.

[Ghost Hunter]

Nightmares never go wrong, but ymmv.

I run a Tachyon setup, which requires a particular attention to detail. A Mega Pulse with Scorch is more standard, and can run quite efficiently.

[Crucifire]

What are peoples' experiences running L4's with HACs?

I don't care to train BS because I don't expect to PVP in one very much, and a T3 is way down the road. Ishtar is probably an obvious pick and people use the Vagabond plenty but what about the other HACs?

[Katrina Oniseki]

I'd say they could all be reasonable L4 ships, with the possible exception of the Eagle and Diemos. I'm not sure what sort of DPS/Tank you could come up with using those two.

[Casiella]

Muninn looks like a hell of a gunboat... not sure about tank, but you get 25% to projectile RoF and damage, plus 10% per HAC level to optimal and 7.5% to tracking speed. EM/Thermal armor resists are pretty cool, so depending on your rats, you could do well with it, I'd tend to think.

[Ghost Hunter]

What are peoples' experiences running L4's with HACs?

I don't care to train BS because I don't expect to PVP in one very much, and a T3 is way down the road. Ishtar is probably an obvious pick and people use the Vagabond plenty but what about the other HACs?

All the HACs are viable with the possible exception of the Eagle, who simply just lacks damage output. HACs and T3 share the same boat in that they both tank the same way: with speed and active tanking. T3 just do it easier since their bonuses are more multiplicative.

The issue with HAC missioning is that you have to more carefully manage aggro, if you go over your defense cap you will exploderize very quickly.

[Vincent Pryce]

HACs don't quite cut it apart from Ishtar and to a degree Vaga. Most can't handle/deal enough dps to make it worthwhile, I mean sure you can do it but it takes only one fuck up in aggro and poof you'er dead. Not really worth the effort unless you really want to micromanage.

Commandships work decently, especially the Sleipnir and Nighthawk. Sleipnir eats ammo like nobodys business and requires some aggro management. While Nighthawk will tank the end of the world if need be, it does really minuscule dps. But not much will kill it.

Mach's are pretty bad ass because they do all that you want essentially. DPS, agility and speed even if you armour tank one. They do come with a pricetag of 800mil or so for the sheer hull and cross training two races of battleships.

One of my personal favourites is my Loki, it relies wholly on it's speed and small sigradius and it has dps to take down most missions quick and easy. Downside is that it can eat thru 5 to 6k rounds in the harder missions.

Speed and Hyperions don't really go hand in hand unfortunately but you can do decent blaster hyperions for DPS, downside is that you might have to resort to Null quite a bit, and that in turn is not very cost effective. Some Rail Hypes seem to work nice but they are armour tankers and with that territory comes the pain of being bulky and slow.

If you have the isk to burn and the skills to fly, I would definitely say go for the Machariel. The hull works just fine with pure t2 fit, though I am sure there will be some special snowflake pretending to be important by giving you grief over not putting deadspace mods on it.

[Saikoyu]

Thanks for the answers so far, if there are more out there please keep them coming. As a general note I should add that cross training is not a problem for me really.  In a fit of something a while ago, I ended up training all racial battleships to V.  The rest of the skills are not far behind.  And to answer some comments so far for myself:

I have tried the 'phoon, but never for the speed side of things, and long before the boost to autocannons.  Honestly it always reminds me of the doomsday machine from that episode of star trek, and I always promised myself that if I ever PVP'd, that would be the ship to do it in.  Maybe I should look at going for PvE as well.

Honestly, T3s would be an interesting idea, but the sight of the Tengu just makes me want to smack my head in.  Again, my personal set of taste.  The Loki is almost the same, very few of the configurations look nice to me.  And the Legion as well, the only configurations that look nice to me are best for exploration, not lvl 4s.  The Proteus does bear looking into though.

I guess the Hyperion will end up a hanger queen, too pretty to not get, to useless to fly.  Maybe when they fix hybrids she'll turn into something grand.

Never liked the Apoc hull, but the Abaddon might be something.  Nightmare, I still waver on, never can decide it its Borg like sexy or Borg like creepy.  and of course, the Varg and Mach.  Hmm, I think I just expanded my list instead of shrinking it.  Of well, what else are MMO millions for?

[Ghost Hunter]

Thanks for the answers so far, if there are more out there please keep them coming. As a general note I should add that cross training is not a problem for me really.  In a fit of something a while ago, I ended up training all racial battleships to V.  The rest of the skills are not far behind.  And to answer some comments so far for myself:

I have tried the 'phoon, but never for the speed side of things, and long before the boost to autocannons.  Honestly it always reminds me of the doomsday machine from that episode of star trek, and I always promised myself that if I ever PVP'd, that would be the ship to do it in.  Maybe I should look at going for PvE as well.

Honestly, T3s would be an interesting idea, but the sight of the Tengu just makes me want to smack my head in.  Again, my personal set of taste.  The Loki is almost the same, very few of the configurations look nice to me.  And the Legion as well, the only configurations that look nice to me are best for exploration, not lvl 4s.  The Proteus does bear looking into though.

I guess the Hyperion will end up a hanger queen, too pretty to not get, to useless to fly.  Maybe when they fix hybrids she'll turn into something grand.

Never liked the Apoc hull, but the Abaddon might be something.  Nightmare, I still waver on, never can decide it its Borg like sexy or Borg like creepy. and of course, the Varg and Mach.  Hmm, I think I just expanded my list instead of shrinking it.  Of well, what else are MMO millions for?

VS

[Saikoyu]

Well, personally for sexy I was going with her, and creepy would be Borg queen, but to each their own.