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[Desiderya]

What makes you say that's a coup d'état ?

Going above interim government and (appointed) head of parliament to call yourself president, enact reforms, call in new ministers prior to any form of re-election as agreed 24 hours prior with the EU and Russia? Then you got EU saying 'cool, we accept your new goverment' and suddenly everyone's acting surprised at the russians being not cool with this. That's going beyond a need for change and including the people straight into the territory of setting up a new reality for everyone to suck it up or bust, and apparently not everyone was cool with the euromaidan protests, and not everyone is cool with not getting a vote in the current government, hence people feeling left out and being a lot less accepting of current ukrainian politics.

So. Really, when you get down to it, the issue now isn't the validity of the interim Ukrainian government. The issue is that Russia perceives a threat to its interests (in the guise of 'violence against ethnic Russians,' which I've read no reports confirming), and so is using the unrest as grounds to seize territory.

And only 'The good guys' are allowed to have strategic interests and desires, such as the panama canal and all that.

[Jace]

And only 'The good guys' are allowed to have strategic interests and desires, such as the panama canal and all that.

We needed that for strategic swimming purposes.

[Katrina Oniseki]

Nobody really expected Russia to turn the other cheek, did they? If they lose access to Crimea, they lose access to their largest and most important warm water military port. I'm not even sure if they have the capability to replace it. They might lose access to their entire Black Sea Fleet.

We (The U.S.) would do the same damn thing in their position. Don't kid yourselves.

[orange]

I'm not even sure if they have the capability to replace it.

$50 Billion on the Olympics in Sochi (43°35′07″N 39°43′13″E) says they did/do.  For reference Sevastopo (44°36′N 33°32′E).

It can be argued that the Russians always meant to take back Crimea.

We (The U.S.) would do the same damn thing in their position. Don't kid yourselves.

Good thing we have friendly relationships with Italy, Japan, and Bahrain.

[Katrina Oniseki]

We (The U.S.) would do the same damn thing in their position. Don't kid yourselves.

Good thing we have friendly relationships with Italy, Japan, and Bahrain.

As Russia did with Ukraine, up until this revolution.

Let me reword that into a question, since I'm not sure. Didn't Russia have a friendly relationship with Ukraine?

[Morwen Lagann]

The relationship wasn't between Russia and Ukraine as a whole. It was more akin to Russia funneling things to Yanukovich, who then used them to help his buddies, who in turn helped keep him in power, in exchange for Yanukovich keeping buddy-buddy with Russia regardless of what the people felt.

To borrow from a touchy but similar case from recent history, you see the same thing in the US, only instead of Russia and Yanukovich, it's the "1%" and certain parts of our government.

[Jace]

[spoiler][/spoiler]

[Gaven Lok ri]

The relationship wasn't between Russia and Ukraine as a whole. It was more akin to Russia funneling things to Yanukovich, who then used them to help his buddies, who in turn helped keep him in power, in exchange for Yanukovich keeping buddy-buddy with Russia regardless of what the people felt.

To borrow from a touchy but similar case from recent history, you see the same thing in the US, only instead of Russia and Yanukovich, it's the "1%" and certain parts of our government.

This comparison fits my read. Its also worth noting that this is the *second* time Yanukovich has lost the Ukranian presidency due to massive urban uprisings about his corruption.

As for the coup stuff, I don't really buy calling this a coup. Anyone watching the feeds closely at the time could have told you that the abortive deal was a farcical arrangement that wasn't going to be considered good enough by the protests. The total botching of the attempts to break up the crowd and the sheer body count on the side of the protesters basically guaranteed that anything short of a Maidan victory wouldn't be considered acceptable.

I see a protest radicalizing into a revolution after things got violent as a rather different thing than a coup. I also would note that the people who were most keen on coup style (Right Sector and the like) violent takeover *did not* end up in charge in the new government.

[orange]

We (The U.S.) would do the same damn thing in their position. Don't kid yourselves.

Good thing we have friendly relationships with Italy, Japan, and Bahrain.

As Russia did with Ukraine, up until this revolution.

Let me reword that into a question, since I'm not sure. Didn't Russia have a friendly relationship with Ukraine?

From link.

Following the breakup of the Soviet Union, Moscow refused to recognise Ukrainian sovereignty over Sevastopol as well as over the surrounding Crimean oblast, using the argument that the city was never practically integrated into the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic because of its military status.

 ...

The Russian society in general and even some outspoken government representatives have never accepted the loss of Sevastopol and tend to regard it as temporarily separated from the homeland. In 2008, Moscow Mayor Yuriy Luzhkov declared that Sevastopol "should again be a Russian city" and appropriated $34 million for "the support of compatriots abroad."

[Desiderya]

This comparison fits my read. Its also worth noting that this is the *second* time Yanukovich  has lost the Ukranian presidency due to massive urban uprisings about his corruption. 

As for the coup stuff, I don't really buy calling this a coup. Anyone watching the feeds closely at the time could have told you that the abortive deal was a farcical arrangement that wasn't going to be considered good enough by the protests.

yes, but the protest wasn't universal, not by far. There's been a massive disparity between west ( up to 80% approving of the movement ) and east ( in parts below 20% ).
While they generally seemed to agree that the former president was bad and would get behind replacing and reelecting they're not in agreement with the euromaidan  movement and their other political goals. The revolution in kiev has set a reality without including those significant portion of the Ukraine,  hence coup d'état. No wonder they think of russia as the lesser evil now. And they are sceptical of that putin, too.

[Nmaro Makari]

Ukrainians Rush To Join Military

Russian propaganda and Ukrainian rumour fuel anger and hate in Crimea

[Akrasjel Lanate]

Estonian Foreign Minister Urmas Paet and Catherine Ashton about information which confirms the rumours that the snipers were employed by the leaders of Maidan.

[Victoria Stecker]

Estonian Foreign Minister Urmas Paet and Catherine Ashton about information which confirms the rumours that the snipers were employed by the leaders of Maidan.

IIRC, they didn't confirm the rumors that the snipers were employed by Maidan. They confirmed that there were rumors and they should be investigated. Not the same thing.

I can't actually check that link from work, but that came up yesterday and the video description was rather misleading.

To make things more interesting, the legislature Crimean region has voted to leave Ukraine and join Russia, and the west is pointing out that they don't have the authority to do that.

[Lyn Farel]

Tbh even if it goes against international law and poses a problem of authority, I don't even see why they are trying so much to deny them that. What makes Ukraine and the west care so much for the Ukrainian flag over Crimea ?

What makes you say that's a coup d'état ?

Going above interim government and (appointed) head of parliament to call yourself president, enact reforms, call in new ministers prior to any form of re-election as agreed 24 hours prior with the EU and Russia? Then you got EU saying 'cool, we accept your new goverment' and suddenly everyone's acting surprised at the russians being not cool with this. That's going beyond a need for change and including the people straight into the territory of setting up a new reality for everyone to suck it up or bust, and apparently not everyone was cool with the euromaidan protests, and not everyone is cool with not getting a vote in the current government, hence people feeling left out and being a lot less accepting of current ukrainian politics.

Unless I have missed something, that's a rather biased point of view. To my limited understanding the deal specified that power had to be handed to parliament with a new transitory unity government to be formed, until anticipated elections happen in late 2014.

Parliament proceeded to broke the deal only by a time margin by making new elections actually happen right away rather than in late 2014, probably at the same time bypassing that planned "unity government". This is the real contentious point to me.

Nobody ever stepped up to the presidential throne and called oneself president... You may call it a con/show, but it still was a perfectly valid democratic election validated by the parliament, which had the power to do so (which was unwise imo considering the deals made with Russia).

[orange]

At this point, I don't think the deals between Russia and the Ukraine are worth the electrons/ink&paper they were made on.

The concerning part about Russia taking Crimea is what happens when Russia also decides it wants to be contiguous and annexes parts of Lithuania?  Or it wants to control at least one side of the Gulf of Finland and annexes parts of Estonia?

If the West cannot get Russia to respect the sovereignty of a state that 4 years ago was invited to join NATO, then what happens if Russia decides to push it?

Or at least that is my concern, because Article 5 commits Europe, Canada, and the United States to war if Russia gets ballsy.