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[Havohej]

Time Magazine earlier this year had an excellent article, something like 37 pages?, on the US healthcare system and exactly why it is the way it is.  It's too long to go into here, but basically, US laws involving free trade are abused by wealthy private interests and as these interests are large-scale funders of Washington, attempts to fix the laws fall flat on the House and Senate floors.

Welp.

[Tiberious Thessalonia]

For a less flamebaity response,

It would actually be cheaper for you guys in the states would be paying LESS taxes for your healthcare AND not going backrupt every time you broke your leg if your heathcare industry was not profit focused.  Like every other civilized country in the world.

[orange]

Can we get a thread split to discuss the problems of the US Health Care System and the challenges in reforming it?

[Vikarion]

Nope, the US has ridiculously high costs on standard non-invasive medical procedures.

I had a comparison, but I lost it.

If you have insurance, the hospitals make a huge mark-up, and the insurance companies say "yeah, we''re not paying that much" and negotiate it down to something reasonable. If you don't have insurance, the hospitals take you for everything they can.

On the other hand, they have to take you in in an emergency.

[Vikarion]

When I dislocated my shoulder as a kid, my parents waited a week, then brought me to a chiropractor who shoved it back in on the bench. When I somehow injured myself as a kid so that I was urinating blood, I just had to wait it out. When I broke my nose while swimming, I simply waited until it stopped bleeding, then went back to swimming. When I got bronchitis, I simply waited until it got better. Took about a year before major wheezing when I breathe out stopped, but I'm better. When I got a root canal, the painkiller failed to do anything (a common problem for me), but I had the dentist go ahead anyway.

The human body is tougher than it seems.

Ah, the famous American rugged individualism. I.e. Don't got cash? Suck it up and live with it. He said to someone with life-threatening disease or injury.

You know, every time minus the nose and dental problems, you we're basically rolling a medical dice in a game that is not that difficult to loose.

In real simple terms, you got lucky.

We're all going to die someday. But, actually, I was sort of commenting on Lyn Farel's post, to wit, that you don't have to immediately run to the emergency room at every sniffle. Which Lyn agreed with.

And, yes, I think that there's some major potential for abuse with American attitudes for health care. It may surprise you, but in some areas, at least, Americans tend to treat their insurance as essentially a free ticket to everything from acupuncture to elective plastic surgery, which some states mandate insurance companies must cover.

In America, health insurance companies tend to have a profit margin in the low single digits, unlike some other companies. Since businesses seek the most profitable business model, this suggests that any additional attempt to provide health care to the American people is going to result in a net rise in premiums.

I'm not actually opposed to the ACA...yet. I certainly don't care for Republican policies either. I just tend to think that schemes by the well meaning tend to result, all too often, in rather nasty outcomes. Consider the effect that the political drive to get lower-class people into houses had. Theoretically laudable goal, bad execution.

The problem isn't that people don't have health care, or that they don't have a house, it is that they don't have enough money.

[Vikarion]

Wow. Well this became political overnight. I suppose my situation does serve as a good example.

To Vikarion; while I do appreciate the offer of support, I can probably manage to scrape together the money for a clinic visit myself if I can find one of the low in-come places like what was talked about earlier on in the thread. The problem is that while the visit itself might be $100, doing anything about the issue is not going to be that cheap. Doing anything but talking to a doctor is going to be expensive.

For example, $3,000 for an X-ray was the price quoted to me back in 2005, and we all know they're going to want to do one. $120 for two Tylenol pills (not a whole bottle). If they give me a chest brace, that costs more. If they vote for an MRI, that's even worse than the X-ray. All of that adds up very quickly during treatment, and it's a horrifyingly deep hole of debt to be in for something that may just turn out to be, "You probably sprained a muscle, just rest and make sure you take full breaths for a few weeks." As Ollie and others have said, even if it's a cracked rib, there isn't anything that can be done about it except treating the symptoms (pain), and reducing physical exertion there.

You might be surprised. Ask the docs if there's any way you can get an x-ray for cheap. Also, as far as pain meds go, they're relatively less expensive if you get them from a pharmacy. After my wisdom teeth were removed (surgery I paid for out of pocket), I was able to get Norco (essentially codeine pills, but stronger than normal) from a pharmacy at probably $1-2 a pill. Not bad, considering they lasted for eight hours (well, for most people - my body tends to ignore them pretty quickly). If pain is a problem, something like Norco can make life much easier.

And the offer remains open.

P.S. What large city do you live near? Might be able to find a few places.

[orange]

Despite my desire to see a thread split,  here are some videos about the US Health Care.

Why Are American Health Care Costs So High?

Bigger Pizzas: A Capitalist Case for Health Care Reform

To put it another way, stop attempting to appeal to some people's humanity and appeal to their greed.

If the American Health Care system was radically reformed (made socialist) the broader US economy could improve as companies large and small could start to focus resources (money) that they currently spend on employee health care on other things.  All without raising taxes.

Warning: it likely will result in the collapse of the medical insurance industry.

[Arista Shahni]

Find someone with the stethoscope who can listen to make sure it isn't walking pneumonia.  I assume mom could, if she had a stethoscope.

Otherwise idk.  I fight with companies trying to get 'the rest' of their money all the time.  I let the bills sit.  i already pay 300 for medicare and medicare supplement insurance. 

Even with insurance I go only when 1000% necessary for stuff, cause in my situation every year they assume an angelic host came and healed me, and so I need do have Dr's fill out paperwork that says, "Nope, she's still as fucked as she was, if not worse."

Yay 'murica.

[Katrina Oniseki]

Back from work today, with good news!

The pain is significantly better already, which means (thankfully) that it's probably just a sprain. If I had a fractured rib, I imagine I'd still be in quite a lot of pain. The whole fractured rib thing was really the result of my employer mentioning it. The conversation went something like this:

"Well I probably sprained it. It's not like you can break a rib by coughing, lol"
"Yes you can."
"I can?!"
"If you have a fractured rib, you need to fill out a work incident report and go to the hospital..."
"Well hold on, how do I know I broke a rib?"
"You don't, which is why we're going to fill out this report and send you to--"
"Wait a minute, if we fill this out, I can't come back to work until a doctor clears it as healed right?"
"Correct."
"Which for an uninsured person, if I can't find a doctor to do that, I lose my job."
"..... correct."
"No thanks. I did not break a rib picking up a rotisserie chicken."
"Are you sure? You have 24 hours to file if you change your mind tomorrow."
"I'm sure for now. I'll let you know tomorrow morning."

So, I needed to ask some questions about how serious a broken rib is, if I needed to risk my job filing a report and seeking worker's compensation to get treated, and basically where to go. Come morning, my chest was feeling a lot better (admittedly under the influence of some leftover pain meds from a while back). After working the shift, with my chest still feeling much improved long after the meds wore off, I'm fairly convinced that it was a sprain.

Which means I made the right call by not filing the report. If I was still feeling terrible and in great pain, I would have had to make that difficult decision to risk my job on it, but I'm glad I don't have to.

Since my medical issue is mostly resolved, I think we can let this thread continue as a political discussion if people are so inclined.

[Tiberious Thessalonia]

Glad to see you are doing better, Kat <3

[Vikarion]

stuff

That's...cool.

[Gottii]

As someone whos broken more than a few ribs in his day, I can pretty much tell you what the doctor would have said to you.

"Well, that sucks dude, heres some pain meds."  Unless you've like, punctured your lung or something, theres not much to do.  Sometimes a brace or bandage to isolate torso movement, but even that is of limited effectiveness.

Just be happy you didnt fracture your sternum, that heals, like, never.  Between a fullback's helmet and another dude's elbow two days later, it got busted up, and it never really healed.  I can still feel it going low on a pushup or something. Cartilage doesnt like to regrow.

[Pieter Tuulinen]

I'm glad you're doing better, Kat. I still say that when people can't get basic medical care (including PREVENTATIVE MEDICINE) then society as a whole suffers.

Frankly, I don't care WHICH system gets used provided it delivers that endcase.

Also, I am not speaking from the bench either. Former rugby player and some time in the Army means that I have wrecked ankles, knees, shoulders, wrists and all the small bones in one hand. Plus numerous concussions - all of which I had checked out. Soft tissue injuries can be every bit as bad as a broken bone. Take 'em seriously.

[Arista Shahni]

Hooray!  Glad its not a ball of pneumonias.

[Katrina Oniseki]

Thanks everybody, for all the support.

« Last Edit: Today at 05:48 PM by Vikarion »

Thank you for the compliment.