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Author Topic: Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen  (Read 3750 times)

Silas Vitalia

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Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen
« on: 30 Sep 2013, 15:31 »

I see your 'balance changes' and 'baby steps' new features, and I will throw this gauntlet in your face.

Time to step up.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0tLbWv5K60
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Karmilla Strife

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Re: Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen
« Reply #1 on: 30 Sep 2013, 17:12 »

That looks amazing.
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Victoria Stecker

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Re: Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen
« Reply #2 on: 30 Sep 2013, 17:46 »

Cannot wait for this. Be warned that the official forums are about as full of idiots as those of any game.

To be fair to EVE though, this won't really compete. From everything Chris Roberts has said, the similarities start and end with "future" and "space ships." Probably a good thing.
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Pieter Tuulinen

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Re: Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen
« Reply #3 on: 30 Sep 2013, 19:11 »

Yeah, at least CCP aren't charging me a hundred bucks to fly a Condor... Just saying...
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Karmilla Strife

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Re: Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen
« Reply #4 on: 30 Sep 2013, 19:33 »

That $15 a month adds up Pieter. Even if you get PLEX, somebody paid. Counting extra accounts and character transfers, I'm nearing the $5000 mark for Eve.
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Samira Kernher

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Re: Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen
« Reply #5 on: 30 Sep 2013, 21:12 »

That $15 a month adds up Pieter. Even if you get PLEX, somebody paid. Counting extra accounts and character transfers, I'm nearing the $5000 mark for Eve.

This.

Remember, Star Citizen is a crowd-funded game. There is no overhead producer doing executive meddling. There is no having to try and appeal to funders (at least, funders that aren't players themselves).

Also, there will be plenty/most of the game available to the average player. But they have to get the development money from somewhere, and if it's not the players then it would have to be a major producer--who would demand Roberts to build the game according to their specifications, which would result in crap.

And as Karmilla said, you're paying $180 per year for EVE as it is.

Since the cancellation of SWG, I'm eagerly looking forward to Star Citizen.
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Pieter Tuulinen

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Re: Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen
« Reply #6 on: 01 Oct 2013, 00:08 »

That $15 (which, by the way, if you buy three months at a time comes out closer to $10 even with my funny Beaver decorated dollars) pays for a mature feature list on a stable platform. It pays for something that actually exists. Granted that CCP are a little wibbly-wobbly on some of their commitments but, in the context of MMO development, it makes Eve roughly as dependable as the half-life of Uranium 235.

In my decade plus as a Developer (we'll leave out the time I spent working for a Publisher) I worked on Seven games. Of those Seven games Four actually made it to release. One was canned in pre-production when the Studio was bought by another company, who decided to move us onto console games. One was canned in pre-production because the concept had been done by someone else better. One was canned in production because the studio went bankrupt (thanks Vivendi).

Of course I had many more  games canned when I worked as Publisher, because that's actually the main function of Publishers, to make sure that games that are financially doomed don't make it out onto the market. You guys are short-cutting that. You've invested MILLIONS (corporately) with almost no due dilligence. You don't know how development is going. You haven't seen the production schedule. You don't know what state the code is in. You haven't seen how the assets are coming along. You have had no input in setting the development milestones. You don't get to see the deliverables.

In Production I've worked as both poacher and gamekeeper. I know a LOT of the tricks  - how to obsfucate missing functionality. How to massage the wording of milestones and how to make your deliverables hint at underlying functionality that doesn't exist. How to cover the exciting stuff in the morning, head out for a subsidised lunch with alcohol in the afternoon (booking at a posh restaurant makes the external producer think you're taking him seriously) where you linger over a few extra beers whilst talking excitedly about all the progress you've made this sprint and then heading back for some sort of abstruse codery meeting in the afternoon which will basically make the man doze off, where you hint vaguely at areas of weakness before demanding the sign off.

I point out that there are lots of tricks in situations where the guy comes to your sanctum sanctorum, pokes around, gets a full demo and, in most cases, leaves with working code, having seen your project plan. In the circumstances you guys find yourselves in you have no written agreements, virtually no hands on the goodies and zero access. It is laughably easy to pull the wool over your eyes, gin up a fancy looking pitch document and produce some bullshots and movies.

That and the high cost of entry BEFORE you actually get anything for your money is what's put me off Star Citizen. I've worked with some of the gurus from Chris Robert's time. Men who were legends in their own lunchtime. It makes me nervous.

Now, I am categorically NOT saying that I think he IS doing these things to you. I'm just saying it happens and it happens more than you think. Even to professionals. And that turns me off of the project. If it turns out to be awesome then I'll probably buy it and be right there with you all. Once I've seen it running and read about five reviews. And heard what you all have to say about it.
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Katrina Oniseki

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Re: Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen
« Reply #7 on: 01 Oct 2013, 00:31 »

Thank you Pieter, for finally putting some reality into this fantasy.

Lyn Farel

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Re: Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen
« Reply #8 on: 01 Oct 2013, 02:22 »

Oh please, like if publishers were parsing the actual code or contents of the games. That's not what they are interested in. The only thing you have to do is to show them shiney powerpoints and videos to reassure them that your game is on the right track at each milestone. Producers are producers, they are no game devs and usually know next to nothing at game development, minor a few, scarce people. What they know very well, is the game market and industry. I may not have yet worked on 6-7 titles but I still see how it works (be it with Focus or Ubisoft). Maybe different experiences though vOv

On another note, though, I do not like either the lack of control on crowdsourced games, but eventually it boils down to the same thing : you have a high rate of failure with them, but you also have a high rate of being canned with a producer. I  don't trust game studios alone and I don't trust producers more. I actually trust more internal producers working in the studios insides.


____________________________


More on the subject though, as long as most of the ships and actual content of the game does not need to be paid 100€ more than the base price of Star Citizen for every ship and gun, or that you need to pay unexpected money more than the base price of the game, i'm happy. As long as i'm not paying for a blatant pay to win (like Eve btw), i'm ok.

I'm still happy to donate a few pennies to projects I find worth it, like Star Citizen, and that's a bet and investment, nothing more, nothing less.
« Last Edit: 01 Oct 2013, 02:27 by Lyn Farel »
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Myyona

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Re: Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen
« Reply #9 on: 01 Oct 2013, 02:57 »

I will buy it when it is released. Perhaps try the demo first.
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Seriphyn

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Re: Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen
« Reply #10 on: 01 Oct 2013, 03:13 »

I think the key difference is that EVE is a game set in space, while Star Citizen is a space game.
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Elmund Egivand

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Re: Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen
« Reply #11 on: 01 Oct 2013, 03:41 »

I think the key difference is that EVE is a game set in space, while Star Citizen is a space game.

Most of the very interesting things in EVE had nothing to do with undocking at all. I doubt Star Citizen allows someone to screw many people over without ever undocking.
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Victoria Stecker

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Re: Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen
« Reply #12 on: 01 Oct 2013, 07:31 »

Yeah, at least CCP aren't charging me a hundred bucks to fly a Condor... Just saying...
Quote
That and the high cost of entry BEFORE you actually get anything for your money is what's put me off Star Citizen. I've worked with some of the gurus from Chris Robert's time. Men who were legends in their own lunchtime. It makes me nervous.

Best I can tell, a copy of Star Citizen will set you back about $30 (right now), and there's no subscription fee after that. Sure, they're offering other stuff for more money in order to raise the capital for the game ($20.5m and counting). But there is no "high cost of entry." There's just the option to give them more money to support the game, in exchange for which they'll give you some ships that you can otherwise acquire through normal play.
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Anslol

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Re: Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen
« Reply #13 on: 01 Oct 2013, 10:34 »

Eh, Star Citizen is Freelancer while Eve is Homeworld if you can herd the guns in the right direction. Two different games imo. One won't kill the other vOv
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Lyn Farel

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Re: Hi Rubicon, It's me, Star Citizen
« Reply #14 on: 01 Oct 2013, 11:36 »

Homeworld ?  :eek:
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