Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Ashar Kor-Azor]

I would suggest that rather than tearing down other people's analogies, you find more useful ones. "I think a better analogy would be..."

So you decided that the post had nothing really wrong with it, but you couldn't leave it in the thread with your suggestion appended? Or you used soft language when you meant to dictate to me that I could not simply contribute by pointing out a lack of worthwhile content, but also needed to fill the gap immediately - even if the gap was one I did not see as worth filling?

I'm not fond of how the content in question withstood the scrutiny of the board for a day, with participating moderators active in it, before it was suddenly overhauled. Are you of the opinion that you need both faster response time and more willing moderators?

[Silver Night]

[mod]If you feel there is a lack of worthwhile content, but don't have any of your own to contribute immediately, please refrain from posting.[/mod]

On the subject of moderators: Mods are volunteer staff. We are not always all available all the time, and occasionally some of us do participate in discussions that later are moderated, in which case if at all possible we avoid moderating that thread. I think that for a few volunteers on the internet, a day or two is a reasonable response time.

Also, some discussion often takes place before moderator action is taken, particularly large, involved action as there was in the thread in question.

[Mizhara]

I am far more offended by the 14 removed posts thing. I didn't get a single post modded! This is an outrage!

But on that note, could you please expand on Morwen's post being modded? I didn't quite get why it was moderated or which rules it broke.

[Silver Night]

I was a little on the fence about that myself. However, I think it's dangerous territory to start suggesting someone does something for OOC reasons IC - even if they do talk about doing it OOC. I hope that if Morwen feels like it, he'll re-post an edited version.

[Casiella]

To clarify, there was significant staff discussion regarding the topic in question because we wanted to make sure we didn't overreact, moderate the wrong posts or the right posts for the wrong reasons, etc.

I'd rather things take a few extra hours, particularly given the TZ spread here, than have a knee-jerk reaction that pisses people off for avoidable reasons. (Sometimes it's unavoidable. )

[Ashar Kor-Azor]

Assuring each other you didn't overreact in private and then cutting a thread in half instead of locking and shitcanning the whole thing without so much as first dropping in a warning beforehand out of fear of acting improperly does not strike me as reasonable given the outcome mentioned in the original post. If that's the way policy revisions have gone in my absence, we're well on our way to repeating the mistakes that make our community record with OOC forums so great, only much faster.

I don't know when you guys started taking notes from the Wikipedia Review. If people can't identify something as lower quality thinking, what will occur when you demand they have a positive point of view on two diametrically opposed choices? On a genuinely negative choice? They just get run out of town by moderators that drop threads into bins without warning after a day of timid silence?

Oh, don't tell me, you're going to mod my post instead of making any sort of explanation of your ruleset that doesn't refer me back to the FAQ, specifically the culture section, which has changed when the administrator and not the userbase wishes it to change.

I guess a few months was a nice run.

[Casiella]

Believe me, my initial reaction was far stronger but I intentionally deferred to Silver because I felt that I was overreacting.

Your comments and criticisms are noted, Ashar, and I appreciate your forthrightness.

[Mizhara]

I'm not exactly someone who find this board's moderation and rules to be suitable for an Eve community or on the internet even, but that's needlessly harsh, Ashar. You're making assumptions about what the 'community' wants and should try to see it from their side of things.

Some of these moderators should never have gotten their position considering their low thresholds for turning good and interesting threads into smoldering ruins, sure... but you're taking things a little too far.

[Silver Night]

The Culture section and FAQ haven't changed since the inception of the board, so I'm not sure what you're referring to?

Enforcement has remained the same, and if anything become perhaps slightly more permissive over time. Noone demands that you have a positive view on everything, but if all you have is negative views, then you are welcome to keep them to yourself. On the other hand, alternative views are welcomed.

That is, you might just explain how you might do something differently rather than attacking how other people do things. Very often 'lower quality thinking' is a matter of opinion and perspective, and as such pointing it out (particularly couched in the terminology of fact, i.e.: 'This is lower quality thinking') is a recipe for exactly the sorts of things that this board was created to avoid.

I've yet to see any issues of contention in the discussion of Eve RP that weren't subject to at least two valid interpretations. Not everyone needs to believe all interpretations are valid, but we do sort of require that everyone respect that other people might disagree and still feel their position is valid.

[Jade Constantine]

I imagine most of the moderators here will remember my quite stern criticisms of proposed culture of backstage moderation back in the planning phases, and its been interesting for me to see the evolution of the community here. On the whole I have to say I'm quite impressed you guys have held it together and kept an even hand.

The forum today works. It allows people from all interests in Eve RP to post, respond, publicise their events and endeavours and disallows all flamebait and cloaked trolling.

You chose a highly moderated and controlled culture and ran with it, and while it does disallow certain kinds of discussion (honest or otherwise) I think on balance it has to. When this kind of ruleset comes into play then no-one can be allowed to get away with gaming the system and using dense rhetoric or complex language saying "your RP is wrong!" regardless of their role amongst the founding fathers.

So well done Backstage moderators. You managed to implement a fair and equitable forum that does what it says on the tin.

I'm happy to eat a little humble pie on that score

[scagga]

The culture is quite NRDS here eh? 

[Jade Constantine]

The culture is quite NRDS here eh? 

That is certainly one way to put it. But seriously, yes, it is a culture of personal discipline and quite a lot of self-control. I find it all a bit Shogun 2 actually

[Mizhara]

Discipline and self-control?

* Mizhara snerks.

Naw, we just got moderators on a hair trigger and the Catacombs populated almost exclusively by posts from me, Ashar and Boma.

[Z.Sinraali]

I'm inclined to think that discipline and self-control, being qualities that lead primarily to non-action, are difficult to quantify.

[Casiella]

Naw, we just got moderators on a hair trigger and the Catacombs populated almost exclusively by posts from me, Ashar and Boma.

Everyone has different thresholds, and clearly the intended moderation guidelines here require a response that will differ significantly from, say, Fark.

Also, I have to note that I just reviewed the archives and I see very few moderated posts attributed to you. In general, the sorts of folks who don't like the culture we promote here tend not to come here in the first place. If someone doesn't want to follow the guidelines for Backstage, then that seems like the right decision. After all, it's why I don't visit 4chan either...