Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Xepharious]

This summer I'm planning on doing some wormhole stuff with my alt (Aldris Vero) and I'd like to get in touch!

Please do! You don't even have to wait until the summer either, if you are curious or just want to chat about it toss me a PM or check out the website, it's got a lot of great Origin Lore and some decent reading if you are into that sort of thing.

[Utari Onzo]

And so the circle of life activity turns and minmatar RP, atleast on the IGS, is having a bit of an uptick.

Or so I hope it seems!

[Jocca Quinn]

I think we can blame thank Elsebeth for that 

[Mizhir]

I had an interesting talk with Ayallah (Be Kind To Birds) and others about Minmatar RP and Lore, and the issues we face.

[spoiler]Be Kind To Birds [6:16 PM]
I know why minmatar Rp is in such bad shape
No one reads the fucking lore

Mike P [6:17 PM]
Yup

Be Kind To Birds [6:17 PM]
Absolutely no consistency at all to build a community around

Mike P [6:17 PM]
"I will rp based on assumptions and personal narratives"
???

Be Kind To Birds [6:17 PM]
Too real
A possible cause is that there are 8 sources on the cep
And two paragraphs about how the Republic government works
Lore in micro doses vs constant lore updates
Entirely the reason why there is a common and consistent understanding of some factions and a complete ignorance and fevered scrambling around others
Another possibility is the draw of the Mary Sue snowflake champion who had the worst upbringing pity contest to the slave background

Mike P [6:21 PM]
Oppression Olympics

Mizhir [6:22 PM]
Maybe someone can make a easily readable article on the important parts
Tbh I barely know anything about the Republic

Be Kind To Birds [6:23 PM]
It's super dissolved
I have about 6 pages of links referencing the Republic
But I haven't organized it at all
A lot is dead as well.  Many old news articles are dead link
It has helped me a lot but I don't think it's digestible
I'll have to put work into it I think.

Mizhir [6:24 PM]
Well for newer players it may just be too hard to digest

Aelisha Montenagre [6:25 PM]
TBH The Republic economy is likely to be quite interesting

Be Kind To Birds [6:25 PM]
People think the Republic is war mongering and doesn't take care of freed slaves because of oppression Olympic role players

Aelisha Montenagre [6:25 PM]
Materially backed (QUB) and the smallest economy managing to survive in an international clash of titans when you look at what the Federation, State and Empire pour into it.

Be Kind To Birds [6:26 PM]
Meanwhile shakor has created art programs, they are basically fully socialist with civic programs and they prioritize infrastructure

Este DeStirr [6:27 PM]
Seems appropriate to me that a community/tribal culture in a technological society would adopt socialism

Be Kind To Birds [6:27 PM]
The idea that you could house and feed the population of the state from nothing in just 138 years while spending everything on warships is just inane to me :expressionless:
They are very librarian and socialist
Really they are almost Mary Sue themselves in how it's written

Este DeStirr [6:27 PM]
Librarian! At least they are literate

Mizhir [6:28 PM]
Haha

Be Kind To Birds [6:28 PM]
But people still talk about growing up in slims and corruption
Autocorrect, I'm on my phone

Este DeStirr [6:28 PM]
Haha

Be Kind To Birds [6:28 PM]
It's like Rome or Greece tbh

Este DeStirr [6:28 PM]
Me too cannot slack at $dayjob

Mike P [6:29 PM]
Keep in mind that the gallente gave them shitloads of dosh

Be Kind To Birds [6:29 PM]
Very much like Rome with the position of sanmatat
No shit, they literally had nothing after the rebellion
Literally nothing to a multi-planatary multi regional nation
In less time than it took the US to rise to 300 mil

Mike P [6:30 PM]
I know dude, we never got a full figure on their givings

Be Kind To Birds [6:30 PM]
Because no number would be realistic

Mizhir [6:30 PM]
The Jews were also given a country after WW2 and that doesn't mean they are living in mud huts still

Be Kind To Birds [6:30 PM]
No number is realistic

Mike P [6:30 PM]
They also have a knack for making insanely strong ships

Be Kind To Birds [6:30 PM]
Yes Isreal and the Jews are a great example
And a much closer parallel irl than anyone else
People forget they are Scandinavian and African

Mike P [6:31 PM]
The matari are space jews confirmed

Mizhir [6:31 PM]
While I don't RP Miz as a Republic citizen I can certainly see the issues with ppl thinking it is savages

Be Kind To Birds [6:31 PM]
They just make the dumbest racist shit about 3rd world countries the center of their pity party I was a slave argument against amarr

Este DeStirr [6:31 PM]
Like the Jews, o would think that a communal-based society with post-oppression psychology would motivate them to focus on powerful defense and internal infrastructure

Be Kind To Birds [6:32 PM]
It literally killed minmatar Rp miz
Quitters quit for a reason

Mizhir [6:32 PM]
Hopefully I can help kickstart some of the cultural stuff.

Be Kind To Birds [6:33 PM]
I'm going to start writing a lore primer and post it in min ooc

Mizhir [6:33 PM]
That would be sweet

Be Kind To Birds [6:33 PM]
I really really don't think a lot of minmatar rpers know this stuff
I don't blame them, it's so few and far between
Like for example yesterday's article
Caldari title, 70% to 80% about Caldari
Tiny paragraph with important minmatar information at the end

Mizhir [6:34 PM]
Yeah and the Drifter stuff was mostly centered on Amarr

Be Kind To Birds [6:34 PM]
Of course we want to hear about rebuilding and hydrogen weapons
But it is a trend through all of post - FW lore

Mizhir [6:35 PM]
We could really use some more minmatar stuff from CCP

Be Kind To Birds [6:35 PM]
Barely any updates at all as to minmatar lore
Source came out and there STILL was no demographics of the Republic page
Meanwhile the others had theirs for years and were thousands of words long with sub topics

Ché Biko [6:35 PM]
I was wondering about that.

Be Kind To Birds [6:35 PM]
Just over and over forever no lore out there
It's nice because you have elbow room
It's shit because no one can find the 1 ultra important blurb about the Republic that defines the entire narrative
So we get literally years of people spreading false information and buying into it
I guess I bitched about it long enough without doing anything about it though
I'll start cataloging the lore I have saved and try to put it together
It's not like it's a lot, just scattered

Mizhir [6:38 PM]
I think many would appreciate that

Be Kind To Birds [6:38 PM]
No one seems to appreciate me doing it in character lol
Completely counter to the narrative
But Aya is a bitch about it too :kissing:
Anyway[/spoiler]

Tl;dr

• People know little about the lore - it is very scattered and hard to find
• Many other RPers see the Republic as corrupt/warmongering savages - however the Republic is much more than that
• CCP haven't contributed with much either - Most of the news items don't include the Republic that much

Ayallah will hopefully be able to find time to put some of the lore togethe to an easy digestable guide for newer players. I am sure they appreciate any help

[Teinyhr]

I had an interesting talk with Ayallah (Be Kind To Birds) and others about Minmatar RP and Lore, and the issues we face.

[spoiler]Be Kind To Birds [6:16 PM]
I know why minmatar Rp is in such bad shape
No one reads the fucking lore

Mike P [6:17 PM]
Yup

Be Kind To Birds [6:17 PM]
Absolutely no consistency at all to build a community around

Mike P [6:17 PM]
"I will rp based on assumptions and personal narratives"
???

Be Kind To Birds [6:17 PM]
Too real
A possible cause is that there are 8 sources on the cep
And two paragraphs about how the Republic government works
Lore in micro doses vs constant lore updates
Entirely the reason why there is a common and consistent understanding of some factions and a complete ignorance and fevered scrambling around others
Another possibility is the draw of the Mary Sue snowflake champion who had the worst upbringing pity contest to the slave background

Mike P [6:21 PM]
Oppression Olympics

Mizhir [6:22 PM]
Maybe someone can make a easily readable article on the important parts
Tbh I barely know anything about the Republic

Be Kind To Birds [6:23 PM]
It's super dissolved
I have about 6 pages of links referencing the Republic
But I haven't organized it at all
A lot is dead as well.  Many old news articles are dead link
It has helped me a lot but I don't think it's digestible
I'll have to put work into it I think.

Mizhir [6:24 PM]
Well for newer players it may just be too hard to digest

Aelisha Montenagre [6:25 PM]
TBH The Republic economy is likely to be quite interesting

Be Kind To Birds [6:25 PM]
People think the Republic is war mongering and doesn't take care of freed slaves because of oppression Olympic role players

Aelisha Montenagre [6:25 PM]
Materially backed (QUB) and the smallest economy managing to survive in an international clash of titans when you look at what the Federation, State and Empire pour into it.

Be Kind To Birds [6:26 PM]
Meanwhile shakor has created art programs, they are basically fully socialist with civic programs and they prioritize infrastructure

Este DeStirr [6:27 PM]
Seems appropriate to me that a community/tribal culture in a technological society would adopt socialism

Be Kind To Birds [6:27 PM]
The idea that you could house and feed the population of the state from nothing in just 138 years while spending everything on warships is just inane to me :expressionless:
They are very librarian and socialist
Really they are almost Mary Sue themselves in how it's written

Este DeStirr [6:27 PM]
Librarian! At least they are literate

Mizhir [6:28 PM]
Haha

Be Kind To Birds [6:28 PM]
But people still talk about growing up in slims and corruption
Autocorrect, I'm on my phone

Este DeStirr [6:28 PM]
Haha

Be Kind To Birds [6:28 PM]
It's like Rome or Greece tbh

Este DeStirr [6:28 PM]
Me too cannot slack at $dayjob

Mike P [6:29 PM]
Keep in mind that the gallente gave them shitloads of dosh

Be Kind To Birds [6:29 PM]
Very much like Rome with the position of sanmatat
No shit, they literally had nothing after the rebellion
Literally nothing to a multi-planatary multi regional nation
In less time than it took the US to rise to 300 mil

Mike P [6:30 PM]
I know dude, we never got a full figure on their givings

Be Kind To Birds [6:30 PM]
Because no number would be realistic

Mizhir [6:30 PM]
The Jews were also given a country after WW2 and that doesn't mean they are living in mud huts still

Be Kind To Birds [6:30 PM]
No number is realistic

Mike P [6:30 PM]
They also have a knack for making insanely strong ships

Be Kind To Birds [6:30 PM]
Yes Isreal and the Jews are a great example
And a much closer parallel irl than anyone else
People forget they are Scandinavian and African

Mike P [6:31 PM]
The matari are space jews confirmed

Mizhir [6:31 PM]
While I don't RP Miz as a Republic citizen I can certainly see the issues with ppl thinking it is savages

Be Kind To Birds [6:31 PM]
They just make the dumbest racist shit about 3rd world countries the center of their pity party I was a slave argument against amarr

Este DeStirr [6:31 PM]
Like the Jews, o would think that a communal-based society with post-oppression psychology would motivate them to focus on powerful defense and internal infrastructure

Be Kind To Birds [6:32 PM]
It literally killed minmatar Rp miz
Quitters quit for a reason

Mizhir [6:32 PM]
Hopefully I can help kickstart some of the cultural stuff.

Be Kind To Birds [6:33 PM]
I'm going to start writing a lore primer and post it in min ooc

Mizhir [6:33 PM]
That would be sweet

Be Kind To Birds [6:33 PM]
I really really don't think a lot of minmatar rpers know this stuff
I don't blame them, it's so few and far between
Like for example yesterday's article
Caldari title, 70% to 80% about Caldari
Tiny paragraph with important minmatar information at the end

Mizhir [6:34 PM]
Yeah and the Drifter stuff was mostly centered on Amarr

Be Kind To Birds [6:34 PM]
Of course we want to hear about rebuilding and hydrogen weapons
But it is a trend through all of post - FW lore

Mizhir [6:35 PM]
We could really use some more minmatar stuff from CCP

Be Kind To Birds [6:35 PM]
Barely any updates at all as to minmatar lore
Source came out and there STILL was no demographics of the Republic page
Meanwhile the others had theirs for years and were thousands of words long with sub topics

Ché Biko [6:35 PM]
I was wondering about that.

Be Kind To Birds [6:35 PM]
Just over and over forever no lore out there
It's nice because you have elbow room
It's shit because no one can find the 1 ultra important blurb about the Republic that defines the entire narrative
So we get literally years of people spreading false information and buying into it
I guess I bitched about it long enough without doing anything about it though
I'll start cataloging the lore I have saved and try to put it together
It's not like it's a lot, just scattered

Mizhir [6:38 PM]
I think many would appreciate that

Be Kind To Birds [6:38 PM]
No one seems to appreciate me doing it in character lol
Completely counter to the narrative
But Aya is a bitch about it too :kissing:
Anyway[/spoiler]

Tl;dr

• People know little about the lore - it is very scattered and hard to find
• Many other RPers see the Republic as corrupt/warmongering savages - however the Republic is much more than that
• CCP haven't contributed with much either - Most of the news items don't include the Republic that much

Ayallah will hopefully be able to find time to put some of the lore togethe to an easy digestable guide for newer players. I am sure they appreciate any help

Oh damn, it would be so nice to have some kind of centralized compendium about Minmatar lore, even I am quite often lost on Minnie lore and I'm a person who memorizes lore wikis for a hobby... Well, actually it's that I can only retain information that is absolutely no use in the real world like song lyrics and movie quotes, so there's that.

But yeah, both old and new roleplayers surely would give you their left kidney if you wanted it if you can get a good Minnie lore primer / link collection up somewhere.

[Mizhir]

I think it will mostly include the history of the Republic and any other information about the Republic itself. The Lore and culture stuff is something way to diverse and open to truely catch in a lore primer. But that is where our creativity comes in

[Xepharious]

In response to a major theme if Mizhir's slack convo:

Lets all agree to promote those Minmatar RP threads which don't focus on the oppression and pity but rather on the growth and how they are forwarding the culture. It can be as easy as engaging with RPrs who chose this direction.

I've fallen into the pity party with Xeph too, albeit in the opposite direction of playing up how good he had it while technically a slave.

Idea: along with building a resource, lets outline some high functioning Minmatar cities/cultural centers which are doing well. This may give new RPrs at least an option other than the base line "oppression' narrative which the game mechanics have traditionally pushed.

What about some planet which has an idealic, if a little simple, tribal culture. Make the planet enjoyable, a haven, something worth defending where most of the people there haven't been heavily scarred by the wars or previous slavery. Maybe they were granted the land by some [considered insane] Amar lord who went batty just before the planet was recaptured and willed all lands to his slaves who he treated well. 

I'm just tossing out ideas, I realize this sounds a little pushed, but some of us have more experience in what is possible (read, have spent more of our lives buried in EvE) and if we use the player fiction to establish at least another option then newer RPers may be willing to choose that option over 'omg, look at how scarred I am'

(<.< and no, I'm not exactly volunteering to write something.... I'm still waiting for people to realize how many PF liberties I took in Sunswept and quest after my blood and salt...)

[Teinyhr]

^ Just so happens my fleshing out my character's clan deals entirely with rebuilding society and recovering what was lost, if I'd just get around to writing the damn thing... At least I guess I have one more reason to put more effort into it.

[Casiella]

I haven't been roleplaying in months. Were I not so bad at hauling, I'd roll up a Thukker freighter pilot. 

[Xepharious]

Were I not so bad at hauling, I'd roll up a Thukker freighter pilot.

I didn't realize that being a freighter pilot was an RP requirement... but now that I think of it, I suddenly realize why everyone else seems to have so much more consistent time for RP... they ain't shootin' someone at any given moment! (head canon)

(Borrowing from a YouTube comment)
╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻ FLIP THAT TABLE.
┻━┻ ︵ ヽ(°□°ヽ) FLIP THIS TABLE.
┻━┻ ︵ ＼( °□° )／ ︵ ┻━┻ FLIP ALL THE TABLES
ಠ_ಠ Son.
ಠ__ಠ Put.
ಠ___ಠ The tables.
ಠ____ಠ Back!
ಠ_____ಠ NOW! (╮°-°)╮┳━┳ ┳━┳ ┳━┳ ┳━┳

[Ché Biko]

Damn, Xeph is onto me...

[Casiella]

I didn't mean it's a requirement. I meant that it's an interesting archetype to me, but I've found that (short of maybe joining something like Push Industries) I end up making poor choices in my hauling.

Regardless, I'm out in nullsec these days (Casiella is relegated mostly to being my Jita alt) and thinking about how best to integrate RP into that, beyond just making a living and fending off PL.

[Ayallah]

Lets all agree to promote those Minmatar RP threads which don't focus on the oppression and pity but rather on the growth and how they are forwarding the culture. It can be as easy as engaging with RPrs who chose this direction.

I've fallen into the pity party with Xeph too, albeit in the opposite direction of playing up how good he had it while technically a slave.

Idea: along with building a resource, lets outline some high functioning Minmatar cities/cultural centers which are doing well. This may give new RPrs at least an option other than the base line "oppression' narrative which the game mechanics have traditionally pushed.

What about some planet which has an idealic, if a little simple, tribal culture. Make the planet enjoyable, a haven, something worth defending where most of the people there haven't been heavily scarred by the wars or previous slavery. Maybe they were granted the land by some [considered insane] Amar lord who went batty just before the planet was recaptured and willed all lands to his slaves who he treated well. 

I'm just tossing out ideas, I realize this sounds a little pushed, but some of us have more experience in what is possible (read, have spent more of our lives buried in EvE) and if we use the player fiction to establish at least another option then newer RPers may be willing to choose that option over 'omg, look at how scarred I am'

At a certain point about there was a kind of a surge of that.  Samira famously portrayed a slave who preferred slavery to freedom, Elsebeth famously portrayed a minmatar who came from a wealthy family and Ava/khalisa defined an entire period of time with her rich cultural rp and worldbuilding.  It was also a time of a lot of 'pirate' and republic haters, (IC and or OOC,) including many who portrayed it the best. 

I say that because while it is always good to promote things, having the contrast of people who stood against them is where RP happened.  When it came to oppression there were some who portrayed it with a passion and fervor to the point that everyone became sick.  Just as others portrayed living in the republic so well everyone became interested.   

Both sides are valuable in balance, but they need to be based in the same story.  At the time they were not.  There is room for every play style and portrayal but they both need to be grounded in accuracy. 

Take for instance the US, you can easily write about a poor upbringing or being a heir to billions.  We know both exist side by side and that contrast can be used as a narrative tool to make some truly compelling stories out of what would be simple ones.

It does NOT work when one side insists that there are no rich and the other is trying to insist that the culture is dead.   We need a common framework, not just to only promote the positive tbh.  A common story to tell.  A common universe to share. 

[Pieter Tuulinen]

Yeah, it really hurts that the demographic data isn't there. There's nothing concrete to point at beyond the general impression of fractured politics, crap infrastructure and refugee camps. Basically an entire section of space that resembles a gypsy campsite (and not the picturesque sort with the horse drawn wagons).

But then, you have to remember some of the concrete achievements, the size of the warmachine constructed and maintained and so on, and so on. I think the problem is that there's ANOTHER impression that, basically, the Gallente parachuted in and helped them build up and dumped all this money into their system, and they basically remained in squalor as they built battleships - totally ignoring the fact that Somali Pirates can't build battleships, so the Matari CAN'T have a society like that...

[Arnulf Ogunkoya]

I think the problem is that people who are used to life in one country (or state) on one world have difficulty getting the diversity of societies that exist on multiple worlds in multiple solar systems. Plus stations and various deep space colonies and outposts. Plus ship based societies like the Thukker.

This is possibly related to the pulp SF meme of single environment planets.

Of course it is possible for Minmatar society to encompass thriving communities and squalid refugee camps and a diaspora that is more Minmatar than the people back on Pator (on a tangent I wonder what the Matari equivalent of green beer is). But for anyone that hasn't experienced the breadth of lives lived on this world it is, perhaps, a strain to accept that emotionally as well as intellectually.

Also. This game is often about conflicting ideas. So possibly accepting an "opposing" idea is true can be a challenge.