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[ValentinaDLM]

Farmers contest systems but thry don't bash ihubs. I have FCed a few hub bash fleets and I can't recall a single one I ran being uncontested. Pvpers fought over those systems. My alliance gets about 1/3rd of it's kills in null these days and even the investment in ships is very similar between similar sized groups of you compare hub fleets to entosis fleets. The frig fleets are a function of plexing fleets.

I think there is the rather erroneous idea that farmers flip systems but at least in the Amarr/minmatar warzone farmers just plex up backwater systems and plexing fleets tend to take it to vulnrable. These fleets get Into lots of plex restricted fights. Farmers have a huge impact on holding the warzone and tier, but they don't have that much of an impact on home systems.

[Ria Nieyli]

Well, this has been enlightening.

[Pieter Tuulinen]

There are no tangible consequences for actions taken in the warzone, in the places that should have the most consequences for actions taken there outside of a largely meaningless "whose name is on the system's sovereignty" statistic. Its lack of realism utterly destroys any immersion or suspension of disbelief.

Actions should have consequences. FW lacks the vast majority of those consequences, and on top of that, doesn't have a particularly big impact on the rest of the game at large.

And yet, operating in Low-Sec is, basically, what skulls your sec-status - unless you're happy to wait for neutrals to fire first (which sane people should never be). FW doesn't have NO consequences at all - it's a never-ending war dec against tens of thousands of pilots who can come into your highsec and pop you while you're shopping - no questions asked. It kills your security status. It blocked me from participating in half of the live events, when they used to happen - hell, being a Caldari patriot would have barred me from defending the Caldari homeworld if Veiki hadn't pulled us out of Fac War for the event!

[Morwen Lagann]

I think we both know that you shouldn't be losing sec for shooting neutrals in a warzone, especially not if they come into a plex or FW mission. And the whole tags4sec mechanic negates sec loss and just puts a mildly ISK pricetag on fixing it instantly every one in a while anyway, unlike what it used to be where you had to actually suffer through grinding rats to raise your sec again. At which point you're still not going to be seeing meaningful consequences for your actions in enemy highsec.

FW still isn't having much of an impact on the world at large outside of the color of a system on a map, which is - again -  the crux of my reason for considering it as largely meaningless in the grand scheme of things. You aren't punished enough by the opposing side for taking part. That your primary problems are coming from having low security status don't really invalidate my argument: in fact they strengthen it because those are issues you'd have if you WEREN'T in FW. Just being in FW alone doesn't have significant consequences on its own, which it should.

[Ria Nieyli]

Being wardecced by the other side gives their players the ability to shoot you. Just because they don't hunt you down enough in highsec doesn't mean that the system doesn't punish you enough. This should be a sandbox after all.

[The Rook]

FW still isn't having much of an impact on the world at large outside of the color of a system on a map, which is - again -  the crux of my reason for considering it as largely meaningless in the grand scheme of things. You aren't punished enough by the opposing side for taking part. That your primary problems are coming from having low security status don't really invalidate my argument: in fact they strengthen it because those are issues you'd have if you WEREN'T in FW. Just being in FW alone doesn't have significant consequences on its own, which it should.

By that definition everything you do in EVE is pointless. Plant flags on a random map and get richer - who cares?
What consequences should FW participation entail over any other activity in EVE and why are lowsec docking rights and being open for pvp in highsec not relevant?

[Morwen Lagann]

If you read my previous posts you'd see that my issue there is that the restrictions in lowsec don't carry over to highsec, where you'd think they'd be even MORE important.

[Silas Vitalia]

It's a third rail for a lot of people because it combines all of the game systems that could arguably need some of the most attention  (sov, sec status, farming, lore, in-game consequences, etc), all in one gameplay package.

It's a lot of stuff to unpack, and I imagine not a can of worms that devs arent eager to open and have spill everywhere for want of fixing one part and having it unravel more?

[The Rook]

If you read my previous posts you'd see that my issue there is that the restrictions in lowsec don't carry over to highsec, where you'd think they'd be even MORE important.

I've read your post the first time around, TYVM.
You're at war both in low & highsec. Which means highsec is not safe. There are inconsistencies with docking rights and resulting station games but in the end: Being in FW makes highsec not safe, especially not in non-combat ready ships. By increasing these penalties for one side you'd remove penalties from the other side and achieve nothing but easier carebearing.

[Lithium Flower]

I see a lot of people just straight up listing FW as unimportant. Why? Is there anything meaningful that you can actually do ingame?

You simply could list these people as unimportant, especially if they do it in-character.