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[Lyn Farel]

Yeah, that was my feeling too...

Though how many are you in your fleets ?

[V. Gesakaarin]

I tend to be solo, duo or at most 4-6 man frig/dessie fleet in FW.

I think the preponderance of frig/dessie pvp is what most people complain about the most with FW to me. If you don't have the mindset for it, or don't enjoy it, then I don't think that's a problem with FW myself.

There's lots of different types of PvP in Eve, and just as I find the concept of gatecamping, capital fights, and BC+ fleets with the convenience of bubbles in nullsec pretty boring just as others probably find FW frig/dessie PvP boring because most of it is in the actual hunting, the baiting, and the ganking.

[Desiderya]

Small scale (Frig/Destroyer/Cruiser) allows one to be more aggressive, which in turn leads to people generally taking more risks, which then leads to more explosions. FW enviroment (taking part in it adds blues, more legal targets and some monetary benefits) in lowsec acts as a good catalyst for fights, as the visible plexes are a much easier way to find people being active and allow shaping the possible battlefield through warp-in advantage, plex sizes and 'warp anomaly' around acceleration gates.

[Makoto Priano]

I'd also say that a major part of why FW is frig/dessy dominant is because T1 frigs can enter plexes of all sizes. As mass increases, you start being locked out of plexes. vOv It's similar to WH space's focus on T3s and AHACs.

That said, KAT! <3

That is all.

Well, not all all. I find MorLag's comment on PYRE about spot on. Also, visibility definitely feeds into the critique. More IGS/Summit/lounge /emote presence leads to more conflict.

That said, aside from killboards and FW, there aren't many public ways to demonstrate loyalty. Sure, there're events, but most of the recent events have frankly been terrible-- to the point that I no longer feel bad that my being in the US means they're never accessible to me. Noone can see Mak's 9.6 Caldari State standing and 9.95 Ishukone Watch standing, but they can see Joe FWarrior's Strike Commander standing from cloaky stab plexing. Further, because most players have incursions and L4 missions down to a science, there's very little risk and it seems there's at least a little bit of derision on the IGS toward people trying to use missions as a way to say, "Hey, I'm loyal!" "Killing baseliner ships? Please."

So, anyway, I wouldn't worry about it. Reputation comes with time, and I'd say you have it. Frankly, when I was starting back up, Kat's role as I-RED spokeskitten was a tiny bit daunting.

[Katrina Oniseki]

That said, KAT! <3

Oh I've got some new plans for you, Little Miss Honeybun. You just wait'n see. ♥

(No Really, I do. Fancy I-RED plans for all to see!)

[Lyn Farel]

Noone can see Mak's 9.6 Caldari State standing and 9.95 Ishukone Watch standing, but they can see Joe FWarrior's Strike Commander standing from cloaky stab plexing. Further, because most players have incursions and L4 missions down to a science, there's very little risk and it seems there's at least a little bit of derision on the IGS toward people trying to use missions as a way to say, "Hey, I'm loyal!" "Killing baseliner ships? Please."

There are so many arguments in favour of why actually doing pve is one of the most significant proofs of loyalism... Killing capsuleer ships is pointless, they are immortal, and not even actually part of the enemy faction.

NPC ships are. Kill them and you directly kick a faction where it hurts, and that's not even speaking about the ensued standing penalties / gains in consequence. PvE is one of the only activities that are directly linked to the actual NPC world. The one that actually matters to me, but that's precisely it : it is because that is what matters to me, a roleplayer, that I will naturally add more emphasis on it in terms of significance.

[Katrina Oniseki]

There are so many arguments in favour of why actually doing pve is one of the most significant proofs of loyalism... Killing capsuleer ships is pointless, they are immortal, and not even actually part of the enemy faction.

NPC ships are. Kill them and you directly kick a faction where it hurts, and that's not even speaking about the ensued standing penalties / gains in consequence. PvE is one of the only activities that are directly linked to the actual NPC world. The one that actually matters to me, but that's precisely it : it is because that is what matters to me, a roleplayer, that I will naturally add more emphasis on it in terms of significance.

Exactly. It's the one of ultimate hypocrisies of EVE RP, imho.

I don't even bother trying to show off my mission work or standings with anyone these days, because I know it will just be dismissed. It isn't difficult to do in gameplay compared to PvP, so it's summarily ignored by many PvPers because "lol carebear". There are even some characters I've encountered that dismiss missioning AND nullsec in the same breath. Predictably, they were in the militia.

Now, there are a LOT of characters I've met, and players, who are willing to throw you a bone and nod their head in respect at your dogged determination to expel the neverending invasion of deadspace pirates in highsec via L4 agents. There are a lot of players and characters who'd do the same about nullsec service, acknowledging that it in fact a very dangerous place to fly and you've got some guts for fighting the good fight out there for your faction. I'm not saying it's a widespread issue of hypocrisy, as honestly... most of the people who have that issue are not those I RP with anyways.

I think a lot of this issue would be solved by the introduction of ranks or decorations for PvE. I can imagine the rage on General Discussion already because of this, but I think the removal of publicly visible standings for players really hurt the RP scene and PvE in general. You can't even prove (without showing screenshots) that you have a certain level of standing with an Empire.

But then again, I've seen characters/players dismiss the standings mechanic completely as nonsense too, so even if we could show them off, I suspect there would always be plenty of folks who just ignore them and still say you're a carebear who isn't fighting the good fight.

[kalaratiri]

There are so many arguments in favour of why actually doing pve is one of the most significant proofs of loyalism... Killing capsuleer ships is pointless, they are immortal, and not even actually part of the enemy faction.

NPC ships are. Kill them and you directly kick a faction where it hurts, and that's not even speaking about the ensued standing penalties / gains in consequence. PvE is one of the only activities that are directly linked to the actual NPC world. The one that actually matters to me, but that's precisely it : it is because that is what matters to me, a roleplayer, that I will naturally add more emphasis on it in terms of significance.

Exactly. It's the one of ultimate hypocrisies of EVE RP, imho.

I don't even bother trying to show off my mission work or standings with anyone these days, because I know it will just be dismissed. It isn't difficult to do in gameplay compared to PvP, so it's summarily ignored by many PvPers because "lol carebear". There are even some characters I've encountered that dismiss missioning AND nullsec in the same breath. Predictably, they were in the militia.

Now, there are a LOT of characters I've met, and players, who are willing to throw you a bone and nod their head in respect at your dogged determination to expel the neverending invasion of deadspace pirates in highsec via L4 agents. There are a lot of players and characters who'd do the same about nullsec service, acknowledging that it in fact a very dangerous place to fly and you've got some guts for fighting the good fight out there for your faction. I'm not saying it's a widespread issue of hypocrisy, as honestly... most of the people who have that issue are not those I RP with anyways.

I think a lot of this issue would be solved by the introduction of ranks or decorations for PvE. I can imagine the rage on General Discussion already because of this, but I think the removal of publicly visible standings for players really hurt the RP scene and PvE in general. You can't even prove (without showing screenshots) that you have a certain level of standing with an Empire.

But then again, I've seen characters/players dismiss the standings mechanic completely as nonsense too, so even if we could show them off, I suspect there would always be plenty of folks who just ignore them and still say you're a carebear who isn't fighting the good fight.

Dedicated Minmatar loyalist, 8.37 Khanid Innovation standing.

 

[Morwen Lagann]

Noone can see Mak's 9.6 Caldari State standing and 9.95 Ishukone Watch standing, but they can see Joe FWarrior's Strike Commander standing from cloaky stab plexing. Further, because most players have incursions and L4 missions down to a science, there's very little risk and it seems there's at least a little bit of derision on the IGS toward people trying to use missions as a way to say, "Hey, I'm loyal!" "Killing baseliner ships? Please."

There are so many arguments in favour of why actually doing pve is one of the most significant proofs of loyalism... Killing capsuleer ships is pointless, they are immortal, and not even actually part of the enemy faction.

NPC ships are. Kill them and you directly kick a faction where it hurts, and that's not even speaking about the ensued standing penalties / gains in consequence. PvE is one of the only activities that are directly linked to the actual NPC world. The one that actually matters to me, but that's precisely it : it is because that is what matters to me, a roleplayer, that I will naturally add more emphasis on it in terms of significance.

Jesus fucking christ, this. THIS.

There's a number of reasons I often don't discuss mission-running IC, or play down the amount that I actually do, but the "lololol PVE you suck and contribute nothing to the world get out and PVP or kill yourself IRL srsly" attitude is a pretty big one.

Dedicated Minmatar loyalist, 8.37 Khanid Innovation standing.

 

100% my fault, and fucking proud of it. :3

[V. Gesakaarin]

So where's the thread where you can post screenshots of your standings to prove to others how you've worked so hard doing level four missions to be a loyalist?

[kalaratiri]

So where's the thread where you can post screenshots of your standings to prove to others how you've worked so hard doing level four missions to be a loyalist?

Tada!

[V. Gesakaarin]

So people complain that FW is terrible because there's no objectives and no conclusion to it etc. Then say that running highsec missions for hours on end doing the same repetitive missions while shooting at AI is their idea of interactive and engaging RP as a "loyalist"?

Okay then.

Why not just be honest and say you want to be recognized and validated as a loyalist while spinning ships in station then?

[John Revenent]

I would like to see anyone dictate to me that I am not a loyalist. I view anyone who RP's as a Caldari Loyalist as a Caldari Loyalist, I don't question it because its not my place. Dex, Diana, Pieter, Vikarion, and Katrina are all loyalists because they all support the State in their own way.

I-RED may not be viewed as loyalists in the eyes of many, but that doesn't matter to us because in the end we know where our loyalties lie. I-RED cannot join FW because of our industrial base which is quite larger then most would think, it is just heavily regimented and secure unlike most industrial organizations. We are in Syndicate because Ishukone wishes it, what you believe is your own right.

For the newer RPers I would ask you do some background checks on organizations before you dictate to them how to be loyal, I-RED has done more then most for the State even if it heavily involves backroom deals.

[Sofia Roseburn]

(citation needed)

[Makoto Priano]

Even more hilarious coming from a Sansha RPer.