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[Silver Night]

I've never been in Caldari FacWar, but I don't think that makes Silver less Caldari than people who have. I've even actively worked for the Minmatar and Sansha in the past. 

Are there situations where to others someone's claims on a faction might ring hollow? Sure

Is that remotely possible in Ava's case? Theoretically, but it would take a lot more than leaving EM/Fac War. You've probably killed more Amarr ISK in a frigate than most people will ever do in any ship, for one thing.

[Nissui]

As a newcomer, color me confused. Is "Minmatar" being used in the strict sense of "loyal subject of the empire (Republic)"? I can't recall, but I believe the game asked you to choose a race, then a bloodline and gender. I wasn't asked to choose a character loyalty.

Trillions of baseliners, each walking their own varied paths, some tiny portion of which lead to demigodhood. Once you enter the pod, though, you must all think and act the same.

 

[Vincent Pryce]

As a newcomer, color me confused. Is "Minmatar" being used in the strict sense of "loyal subject of the empire (Republic)"? I can't recall, but I believe the game asked you to choose a race, then a bloodline and gender. I wasn't asked to choose a character loyalty.

Trillions of baseliners, each walking their own varied paths, some tiny portion of which lead to demigodhood. Once you enter the pod, though, you must all think and act the same.

 

You choose your loyalties down the line. You will be questioned about them, constantly especially if you portray your choice differently of what others perceive to be the 'right way'. Some just really want to make it into a game of Black and White in many occasions.

[Silver Night]

As a newcomer, color me confused. Is "Minmatar" being used in the strict sense of "loyal subject of the empire (Republic)"? I can't recall, but I believe the game asked you to choose a race, then a bloodline and gender. I wasn't asked to choose a character loyalty.

Trillions of baseliners, each walking their own varied paths, some tiny portion of which lead to demigodhood. Once you enter the pod, though, you must all think and act the same.

 

You choose your loyalties down the line. You will be questioned about them, constantly especially if you portray your choice differently of what others perceive to be the 'right way'. Some just really want to make it into a game of Black and White in many occasions.

Of course, fucking with those people can be part of the fun, if that's your cup of tea.

[Morwen Lagann]

As a newcomer, color me confused. Is "Minmatar" being used in the strict sense of "loyal subject of the empire (Republic)"? I can't recall, but I believe the game asked you to choose a race, then a bloodline and gender. I wasn't asked to choose a character loyalty.

Trillions of baseliners, each walking their own varied paths, some tiny portion of which lead to demigodhood. Once you enter the pod, though, you must all think and act the same.

 

You choose your loyalties down the line. You will be questioned about them, constantly especially if you portray your choice differently of what others perceive to be the 'right way'. Some just really want to make it into a game of Black and White in many occasions.

Of course, fucking with those people can be part of the fun, if that's your cup of tea.

There are some VDs that cloning won't get rid of.

[Nicoletta Mithra]

"Minmatar" is said in many ways...

[kalaratiri]

I'd like to note that I only just read your thread on the IGS Ava, and that I consider it an instant classic.

Carry on.

[Merdaneth]

So, let me ask this; are there reasonable standards, to which the community can hold someone who expects to be seen as a member of a faction "in good standing" and where is the line? At this point, Ava's "minny cred' is pretty well established, frankly, but three people have now made the comment, IC, that somehow she is all bad and not Minny for daring to leave faction warfare/EM.

At what point do reasonable expectations just become derp?

I always reverse this position: Merdaneth defines what it is to be Amarr. If Merdaneth changes, then what it means to be Amarr changes along with him.

Most fun thing is: if you RP it well, you can make such a position work in EVE.

Does Ava feel she is a good Minnie? If she does, then behave that way and challenge those who doubt you, if that matters to Ava. If it doesn't matter to her, why care? If she doesn't feel she is a good Minnie, and people call her out on that: again, no problem right?

Some people felt Midular was a good Minnie, others didn't. There is no reasonably expectation which can declare Midular a good Minnie or not. I suggest simply not caring  about it as a player.

[Aldrith Shutaq]

Aye, absolutely nothing wrong with the tribalism that occurs with loyalists. It's completely natural, human and an accurate portrayal of how people actually act when someone's 'loyalties' are called into question. There will always be the peanut gallery calling for people to be lynched for sneezing with the wrong accent. Conversely, there will always be reasonable people who see people for who they are beyond the labels attached to them.

[Desiderya]

Of course you can attack someone for not being in FW and question his loyality - in character. I know, this is tricky to draw the line, but in the end 'being loyal' means doing something. Personally I prefer to have some ingame metrics/ways to do that, because only posting on the forums how perfect one is while spinning ships in the station is kind of 'meh'. Work on furthering the agenda of your given faction, and that's it. A trader trying to compete with Jita on a market might do this for his own economic benefit, but it can be also claimed that he's doing that to weaken the influence of the State on the Capsuleer market (and I think it can be assumed, that non-capsuleer trade is hot in the areas frequented by us elitist jerks, too).
In short, there are plenty of ways to paint your ingame activities into a certain light. (4TH, for example, can be validly attacked ICly, but they can also really claim to develop space to strengthen Caldari/state interests in that area for ze future. ) If you're not doing anything meaty, then you might be better off calling yourself an enthusiast and not a loyalist.

[Vic Van Meter]

Wait a minute, isn't the "Matari" label pretty much given to any Matari anywhere?  Like, Matari in Gallente space or Amarrian slaves are all still Minmatar and are all still technically under the "protection" of the Republic?

In that case, there isn't anything Ava can do to make herself un-Matari.  She's definitely still more Matari than an Amarrian slave that knows nothing but the Amarrian Empire.

[Merdaneth]

She's definitely still more Matari than an Amarrian slave that knows nothing but the Amarrian Empire.

Of course not. The one who willingly turns away from her heritage is much more of a racial traitor than those who have no choice but to do so. 

One can make arguments either way, but that is part of the fun of it, and it doesn't really matter either way. You cannot control how others perceive you, just how you perceive yourself. Besides, if all the mud people have to sling towards you is leaving FW, then you tend to be in a pretty good position.

[Vic Van Meter]

I'm being facetious.  If those Matari aren't real Matari, there's no real justification for the war against the Amarr.

[Makkal]

So, let me ask this; are there reasonable standards, to which the community can hold someone who expects to be seen as a member of a faction "in good standing" and where is the line?

Neither communities nor the people within them are rational entities and so any reasonable standard that may exist would quickly be trampled upon.

The best you can hope for is clearly articulated standards. I'd say the conservative Amarr bloc is the best in that regards, though I've heard many Amarr players/characters complain about said standards. Gallente seem to have the loosest standards; there's less demand that you behave a certain way and adhere to a specific ideology in order to be a 'good Gallente.'

Both Caldari and Minmatar look a bit thorny to me.

I suspect for the Minmatar, the problem is that you're in a cultural conflict with your own center (the Republic). The lack of social authoritarianism means a lack of shared (imposed) viewpoint, which leads to different groups of Minmatar clumping together and coming up with their own model of good Minmatarness.

[Pieter Tuulinen]

If we're being honest with ourselves, all you need to do in order to be a paid-up Caldari Loyalist is work within one of the Megas. If you do that, you're Caldari. If you don't do that, you're really not. That's how the culture works.

Does that mean you have to be in FW? No. But FW is one of the least contentious ways to fly the flag. That said, all you really have to do is claim to be a subsidiary or a contractor for one of the Okusaiken...