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[Synthia]

*

CTCS?

Words and deed have consequences. Characters in this game get in trouble because there are *rumors* about them, let alone them posting on the IGS about their hanging out with Angels.

That said, I see no reason to not deal with a possible OOC grudge OOCly. The problem is more that people deal with these things in a non-constructive way.

CTCS = Church of the Crimson Saviour. Our corporation.

[admin]Havo wuz here.[/admin]

[Vikarion]

Well, the problem a lot of Caldari - and others - have with I-RED is that it largely seems like you've made sure to stick a knife in everyone's back. Yes, you've been fair to everyone, perhaps, but they're still not going to be happy. For the Caldari in particular, shooting STPRO members while bluing Gallente militia corps is something that's going to take a LONG time to live down, even if you've changed policy since.

I'm well aware of what caused the current trend, but thank you for taking the time to post!

That horse is faking it, I swear! 

Anyway, I have no OOC grudge against I-RED, even if I thought the Luminaire thing was a giant pile of [REDACTED] with [NO, SERIOUSLY, NO POSTING THAT] topped by sprinkles of [WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH YOU?] and that certain devs should [DON'T EVEN THINK ABOUT SAYING THAT].

On the IC side, my character is simply getting tired of certain Caldari who are "elsewhere" when it comes to the war going on like they are the arbiters of all goodness and justice.

[Katrina Oniseki]

Well, the problem a lot of Caldari - and others - have with I-RED is that it largely seems like you've made sure to stick a knife in everyone's back. Yes, you've been fair to everyone, perhaps, but they're still not going to be happy. For the Caldari in particular, shooting STPRO members while bluing Gallente militia corps is something that's going to take a LONG time to live down, even if you've changed policy since.

I'm well aware of what caused the current trend, but thank you for taking the time to post!

That horse is faking it, I swear! 

Anyway, I have no OOC grudge against I-RED, even if I thought the Luminaire thing was a giant pile of [REDACTED] with [NO, SERIOUSLY, NO POSTING THAT] topped by sprinkles of [WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH YOU?] and that certain devs should [DON'T EVEN THINK ABOUT SAYING THAT].

On the IC side, my character is simply getting tired of certain Caldari who are "elsewhere" when it comes to the war going on like they are the arbiters of all goodness and justice.

I have no idea what you're talking about. I keep thinking I got your post, but then I'm like... no I'm still confused.

Anyways, IC is IC.

[orange]

Caldari: various Patriot corporations that seems to be birthing and dying at a fast rate

LDIS has been around a while and generally opposed I-RED in political RP, to include decrying their presence in Providence, arguing that the State needed them in Black Rise. (Which puts LDIS in an odd position today.)  That was the foil, Ishukone vs Lai Dai, competitors.

Or would you prefer: "Caldari Should Be One Monolithic Entity, Not Competing Methods To The Same Goal"

Even more amusing is that for the longest time we were some of the only Caldari saying anything about Heth, doing anything about Heth, and then when it's suddenly popular to go against Heth... we're told we weren't there for any of it, and that we just hid in syndicate the whole time. What the fuck?

I realize I am responding to a rant, but bullshit.  I argued with Van Cleef, Svetlana Scarlet, Kyoko Sakoda, etc about the extent of Heth's power in 2008 (I was proven wrong in the past 6 months) and back-referenced the IGS conversations when it was brought up again for on the order of 3 years.  I-RED was another "loyal-opposition" entity, opposing Heth's desire for revenge against the Federation and ignoring the needed changes the CPD brought to the megas.  I attempted to walk the tight-rope of Patriot, but not Provist, surrounded by those vocally opposing the State's new direction.

In other words, the view from the other side isn't pretty either.

[Galen Darksmith]

Agree with Dex.  CAIN is (was? Been a while) pretty predominantly Patriot (with a pretty outspoken Liberal, granted ), and even served in STPRO a while, but claiming that the did anything but detest Heth from the word go is pretty silly.

Also, what happened with CVA and I-RED?  Last I knew, I-RED was a Holder in Providence.

[Katrina Oniseki]

Also, what happened with CVA and I-RED?  Last I knew, I-RED was a Holder in Providence.

Ask John.

[Katrina Oniseki]

stuff

I was going to reply in detail to your post, but I'll just back down and admit I've crossed a line again with my bitter posting.

I have a (possibly unfair) axe to grind with Patriot roleplayers. As a Liberal roleplayer, my entry into the RP scene was immediately met with both sides drawing a battle line in the sand OOC and IC for me. I was brought up to speed on all the OOC bad blood and such, and I've made some of my own, and by now I've simply been marinating in in the bitterness for too long. I'm bitter about it, and it shows in my posts.

I've already posted more than I should, so I'll take my leave now.

Oh, and... I apologize for upsetting, accusing, and blaming others in this thread. 

[John Revenent]

Agree with Dex.  CAIN is (was? Been a while) pretty predominantly Patriot (with a pretty outspoken Liberal, granted ), and even served in STPRO a while, but claiming that the did anything but detest Heth from the word go is pretty silly.

Also, what happened with CVA and I-RED?  Last I knew, I-RED was a Holder in Providence.

Unpaid dues by CVA which was fine until they called us liars. So we enjoy mutual KOS standings. There was a big IC thingy on IGS about it a few years back.

[Galen Darksmith]

stuff

I was going to reply in detail to your post, but I'll just back down and admit I've crossed a line again with my bitter posting.

I have a (possibly unfair) axe to grind with Patriot roleplayers. As a Liberal roleplayer, my entry into the RP scene was immediately met with both sides drawing a battle line in the sand OOC and IC for me. I was brought up to speed on all the OOC bad blood and such, and I've made some of my own, and by now I've simply been marinating in in the bitterness for too long. I'm bitter about it, and it shows in my posts.

I've already posted more than I should, so I'll take my leave now.

Oh, and... I apologize for upsetting, accusing, and blaming others in this thread. 

I'm confused at this OOC bad blood between Liberals and Patriots you mention.  I definitely must have missed something, because in my experience with a Patriot group employing a Liberal spokeswoman, there was definitely no bad blood there.  Nor between CAIN and I-RED, thought this was pre-CVA, so again I might have missed something.

On the other hand, shooting at State assets...yeah, I can see how that might get you labeled a traitor.   

[Vikarion]

I have no idea what you're talking about. I keep thinking I got your post, but then I'm like... no I'm still confused.

Anyways, IC is IC.

Clarification: I really didn't like the Caldari Prime storyline, amongst other things. As for my character, he doesn't think that I-RED or Stitcher have all that much of a right to talk about how they opposed Heth, when (from his perspective) they haven't done a lot for the State or the Megas in any case.

[Mithfindel]

I don't want to backseat mod, but the "how to oppose Heth" discussion could use its own thread, if we're willing to discuss it. As for the topic, RP crowds typically are somewhat capable of creating drama. And someone will get OOC angry at some point. And that's how things go. The EVE "RP community" (using the term very freely) feels, at least for a casual player, to be somewhat mature in handling this.

I-RED shooting the titan would be probably explainable IC as Ishukone already playing on the background preparing to take hold of Caldari Prime. I do seem to remember that at least once, I-RED was remote repairing the (LCO) titan. As for the letters of marque, both my IC and OOC view is kind of pointless. (Though OOC, it is still a nice mechanic and could serve a role.) That is, as long as it is a perpetual stalemate. If there were signs that one side would have a shot at capturing and holding a while theatre, then there might be an IC reaction.

[Korsavius]

I have no idea what you're talking about. I keep thinking I got your post, but then I'm like... no I'm still confused.

Anyways, IC is IC.

Clarification: I really didn't like the Caldari Prime storyline, amongst other things. As for my character, he doesn't think that I-RED or Stitcher have all that much of a right to talk about how they opposed Heth, when (from his perspective) they haven't done a lot for the State or the Megas in any case.

Well I hope he also realizes that I-RED is a subsidiary of Ishukone. Thus, we answer to Ishukone first, and the CEP second. Ishukone tasked I-RED with securing it's assets in Syndicate and promoting free trade in the region and adjacent regions, so that is what we do. Ishukone has no interest in the current FW scene, so we do not have any intentions of getting involved in that [censored]. Glad I could clarify. 

As for the topic, personally I think it is stupid to hold OOC grudges. I hold none myself, and I don't plan on starting. This is a game, I play it to have fun and make space explosions. IC grudges and drama is always fun though, but people have a tendency to let that IC drama leak into OOC, which is always no fun and quite stupid.

[Shiori]

IC grudges and drama is always fun though, but people have a tendency to let that IC drama leak into OOC, which is always no fun and quite stupid.

Not just empty quoting. It's an unfortunate tendency that in many cases has to be consciously checked, or it'll creep in and ruin the fun of everyone involved.

[Pickled_Prawn]

Off Topic:
Some people characterize best when they have an emotional stake in what they're doing IC.

On Topic:
I think grudges and what not are a valid and vital part of Role Playing, 'fluffy bunnies' gets old fast.
That said though, there are a number of ways you can play out being antagonistic and not all of them are "Rawr! I smash!". There are also a number of degrees to which your PC might 'resist' the spread of another's ideology.

For example, two PCs who oppose Angel Cartel philosophies, one vocally denounces the Cartels and constantly calls for crusades to root out pockets of Cartel operation. The other might 'politic' about with an interest in getting corrupt government officials with links to the Cartels exposed or fired and make sure as widely as possible that Cartel sympathisers are widely thought with a number of negative social traits firmly in mind.

[Lasairiona]

I think there are many that can't make the distinction between OOC and IC. I've seen it happen in my RP before, as many of you know. It shouldn't happen, but it does.