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[Shintoko Akahoshi]

+1 to everything Makkal says here.

Plus a little more:

• Don't be afraid to lose. A lot of people are, but you can get some really good RP out of losing a struggle (physical, political, economic, what have you). Occasionally (or frequently) failing at something ICly also helps develop your character, which is always a good thing.
• You are not your faction. A lot of people play characters that are really only extensions of their faction. Some (like Diana Kim and a lot of the Amarr RP pilots) pull it off really well, but they do so because they still give their characters depth and complexity.
• Never think of your character as static. There are people who do play fairly cardboard, unchanging characters, but they typically either play a lot of characters (and thus have each for fairly specialized RP) or end up putting them to bed once the situation that they can play to changes. If you let your character develop over time and be changed by the things that happen to her, you'll enjoy some pretty complex RP.
• Don't be afraid to try something new. You're doing this with your knightly order, and you're doing it fantastically.

And yes, let's chat sometime about Fed RP, with the caveat that Shin isn't exactly a model citizen. Perhaps we can link our RP... 

Oh, and as a postscript, I'd been meaning to mention this to you after reading your swordplay fiction: I happen to do classical and historical fencing, and I have access to a bunch of really talented people from one of the last remaining living traditions (i.e.: we can trace our instructional lineage back to when instructors were teaching people to fence as preparation for fighting duels) of the art. I'd be happy to talk about anything fencing related with you.

[Makkal]

Thank you...this actually helps.

Awesome.

And please don't take anything I say as an indication that your character is wrong or bad. I think you're doing a good job so far, and I hope you're enjoying playing out your character's early capsuleer years.

[Repentence Tyrathlion]

Someone swore by the Red God, but Steff didn't react to that, though blooders tend to be a big deal in the setting. (Though perhaps that's just my perspective because Makkal is my only character.)

It goes in phases with the pirate factions.  For a long time the Blooder/Sabik side was effectively dead (publically, anyway, couldn't speak to any closet ones), with the Cartel (thanks to Naraka) and Guristas (Veto) being the big flag wavers.  Nowadays it's mostly Sansha (for obvious reasons) and Blooders (Silas and her one-psycho parade) that have the most prominence.

To Steffie: as an addition to Makkal and Shin's comments, here's mine (to be taken with a sizeable helping of salt).  The use of drama and arcs.

It's very easy to create bad drama.  A number of people indulge in creating convoluted plot arcs, myself included, and there are good ways and bad ways of doing it.  Just be careful of railroading (naming no names, but I can remember one such which lost almost all support because the instigator wasn't getting the result they wanted), and of creating drama 'just because'.

Conversely, that doesn't mean that either are innately bad.  As Morwen can attest, I've produced a lot of both, but it's never produced any bad feeling OOC - which I put down to a light touch.  Bad shit happens, let's see who gets involved and what they do!  Let it evolve, have a backup plan in case nobody puts the pieces together (but don't commit to it), and don't get too wound up about it.  A huge amount of Reppy's character development has come from me being enormously mean to her and seeing how she and those around her bounce around.  Who knows?  You might end up running into someone who'll take things out of your hands and sending the arc in unexpected directions (as happened with my most recent plot arc).

[Anslol]

+1 to Makkal and Shin.

I remember talking to you OOC too about your organization. As we said, acting on goals is very important. The idea about basing the Order around the PIE model is probably a great way to get you off the ground. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of Fed RP'ers new and old came to the Order to further its goals as opposed to sticking to the current Blaque/Roden scene. The Order, to me anyway, is very much what the Federation had set out to be in terms of preserving actual honor and morality, as well as learning and accepting new cultures. That, combined with a solid framework from PIE, would get you a great start.

The key is that this isn't going to happen overnight. Corporations are never built in a day, a week, or even a month. It takes months to really get people, and lots of work to get them to wanna join in the first place. You already have some goals in mind for the Order, so try this.

Make a two column list of the goals you want in descending order of feasibility/scale. Start with small scale and go down to large scale. Make the list as long as you want. Once done, use the second column to write down immediate in-game actions and steps you can take to meet those goals, and how long you want to give yourself to meet them. Be realistic. Don't say "OBTAIN 20 MEMBERS IN 1 WEEK." That's just setting yourself up for disappointment.

Just take some time, don't rush, and carefully think about what you want your corp AND your character to represent and stand for. Once you decide, stick with it no matter what. Even if takes more time than you had planned, even if you bleed members, even if you get into IC fights. If you're happy and excited about this idea, you glue yourself to it and plow through. In the end, that persistence will be rewarded with a good corp and close friends. And don't think TOO much into IC interactions. Don't let them sway you or make you question your goals too much, lest you switch opinions every other day.

Just my .02 isk.

* Anslol flails into the sunset

......................\o)

[Steffanie Saissore]

Thank you...this actually helps.

Awesome.

And please don't take anything I say as an indication that your character is wrong or bad. I think you're doing a good job so far, and I hope you're enjoying playing out your character's early capsuleer years.

Thanks, and I am enjoying the experience and just need to relax a little bit.

[Steffanie Saissore]

Thanks to all for input/advice.  First to explain a couple of things (and forgive me if I wander a little):

The Red God thing...part of that was more the player not really sure what it is and it is a shortcoming I have when it comes to lore.  I want to be playing and that part of the brain sees reading up on stuff that may or may not be relevant to be taking away from time that could be spent playing.  That said, I have been doing some reading (having two monitors has helped curb the 'wasting time' perception).  I do know I need to read more, EVE has a rich history.  The other issue was, when I saw it mention, because I didn't really know what was going on, I defaulted to "observe the reactions of others"...and then in the course of a minute that incident seemed to just get brushed over and I still didn't know how Steff was going to react.

Shin, the offer regarding fencing info will be useful, though not sure how much sword-use will happen   I have a couple of friends in a club called the AES which practice the Western European sword-fighting techniques.  It is fascinating to watch.

Drama...I've been thinking about that a lot lately and right now my gut-feeling is that I'm precariously close to that ledge of "too-much-bad-shit" with Steff.  I don't want to handwave it away, but at the same time, I'm getting to the point where I want to sit her down and tell her to grow up.  So, with that in mind, I've started sketching out in my head (which is probably a bad place to keep sketches by the way) the course to resolving some of her angst issue and having it seem plausible.  I'm just not sure if I want to have it revealed in conversation in game or write it out and place it here Backstage.

Playing to Win (or Being Afraid to Lose):  I would like to think I'm not afraid to lose.  I think Morwen mentioned somewhere that one of the things that had been endearing about Steff was the two day period where I lost somewhere in the order of 6 Algos-destroyers and the conversation around that.  I do want to succeed and I do suffer from a personality quirk where I demand of myself absolute perfection the first time I attempt anything, but given that I haven't rage-flipped my desk and done a format c:\ on my computer tells me I have a handle on that situation.

I am also not worried all that much about the success of the corp/order.  I may be going about it the wrong way and it is because of that I haven't been all that public about the order.  I realize that I could (and maybe should) simply just keep to a code of conduct/honor and not be working on setting up a corp.  On the flip side, I've been enjoying piecing things together and building it.

And this is where I am probably at a disconnect between RP, 'mechanics', and the EVE community; I'll try to explain.  The primary reason for the order is an RP thing that, as I think about it, would work wonderfully in a work of fiction.  I want to have something in place where other characters, not just those I interact with on a constant basis, can see what Steff is trying to do and either challenge her to back up her claims or even call BS.  I think part of it stems from seeing too many cases where someone says "my character has a code of honor" and does nothing to define it so other characters/players/GMs have no way of holding that character to account.

I probably could just put her vow up on IGS and call it a day, but I also didn't want to hide behind the shield of an NPC corporation...if someone (or a group) wants to declare war, oddly, I want to give them that option.  Don't like the Order, then do something about it.  I know I have made it known that I'm not a big fan of pvp, and am not that good at it (at least from my experience in other MMOs...EVE being different, I don't know).  That said, I have been thinking about it and realize that it has the potential of really messing things up (from a financial point of view), I am not going to shy away from it.  Not necessarily going out looking for pvp, but if someone comes knocking, I'm not going to hide from it.

Still, I am sitting here and am wondering if I should move forward with a corp or just shelf it and put the history, the vow, and code up on IGS for public consumption and proceed to just RP the whole thing and if people are interested in it going from there.

Did I mention I have a tendency to over-analysis every option to the point where I almost can never make a decision?

Anyway, thank you for the input, the offer for assistance, and other advice.  I am going to continue developing and pushing Steff and I am enjoying the whole thing (and will scale back the bittern00b).

[Ché Biko]

Still, I am sitting here and am wondering if I should move forward with a corp or just shelf it and put the history, the vow, and code up on IGS for public consumption and proceed to just RP the whole thing and if people are interested in it going from there.

I formed a corp along Ché's principles. I wrote a corp charter, a recruitment ad, an announcement that my movement was formed. Never published any of it, and the only applicant I had was some fickle DUST soldier that probably didn't even read a letter of the corp description.
Still, despite that I never started actively recruiting like I planned to, I don't regret it. Ché is at home in his own corp like he had been in no other. Would Ché like some company? Sure, but being able to live according to his own code has been good for him.

Haha, I'm not sure if this helps you in anyway, or if I would suggest you follow in my footsteps, but I felt compelled to leave this here.

[Shintoko Akahoshi]

I'm just going to comment on a few things here inline:

The Red God thing...

I don't see a problem with Steff not having a problem with this. There are probably more Sani Sabik in the Federation than any other nation outside of the Amarr Empire. I doubt that they're exactly common, but those that come to the Federation do so because there's more tolerance for them.

Playing to Win (or Being Afraid to Lose):  I would like to think I'm not afraid to lose.  I think Morwen mentioned somewhere that one of the things that had been endearing about Steff was the two day period where I lost somewhere in the order of 6 Algos-destroyers and the conversation around that.  I do want to succeed and I do suffer from a personality quirk where I demand of myself absolute perfection the first time I attempt anything, but given that I haven't rage-flipped my desk and done a format c:\ on my computer tells me I have a handle on that situation.

I'm actually talking more towards the IC/RP side of things - are you willing to RP in a story where your character comes out the loser? A surprising number of people aren't.

I probably could just put her vow up on IGS and call it a day, but I also didn't want to hide behind the shield of an NPC corporation...if someone (or a group) wants to declare war, oddly, I want to give them that option.  Don't like the Order, then do something about it.  I know I have made it known that I'm not a big fan of pvp, and am not that good at it (at least from my experience in other MMOs...EVE being different, I don't know).  That said, I have been thinking about it and realize that it has the potential of really messing things up (from a financial point of view), I am not going to shy away from it.  Not necessarily going out looking for pvp, but if someone comes knocking, I'm not going to hide from it.

That's one way to go about it. As Che said, however, another option is to keep it a little more quiet. Let the principles of your order come through in your actions. You'll have plenty of opportunities to talk to people about it ICly through day to day RP.

[Steffanie Saissore]

Playing to Win (or Being Afraid to Lose):  I would like to think I'm not afraid to lose.  I think Morwen mentioned somewhere that one of the things that had been endearing about Steff was the two day period where I lost somewhere in the order of 6 Algos-destroyers and the conversation around that.  I do want to succeed and I do suffer from a personality quirk where I demand of myself absolute perfection the first time I attempt anything, but given that I haven't rage-flipped my desk and done a format c:\ on my computer tells me I have a handle on that situation.

I'm actually talking more towards the IC/RP side of things - are you willing to RP in a story where your character comes out the loser? A surprising number of people aren't.

To that, yes, I am willing to RP in a story where the character comes out the loser.  Sure, I prefer an ending where the good guy (or girl) conquers the BIG EVIL and lives happily ever after with their mate, and I have characters where I want to win, Steff is one of the few characters I've played where I can see the two paths clearly and either one works for me.

Now, I'd be blind if I didn't acknowledge the fact that things will happen that could change the course of her story and development that I never saw coming...and I'm cool with that too.

So, basically, in a very long-winded and roundabout way, I am saying that, at the end of the day, I (the player) have no problem with seeing Steff lose in the end.  I'm actually kind of curious to see what would happen if she failed...how would she respond to it, how would she move on, or would she?

As for the order...well, still two minds about what I want to do with it.  I think, once I have detailed more of the background and wrapped up a few other things in Steff's background, I'll likely put set of links in the OP and in her Bio page and will proceed from there.

[Lyn Farel]

I think some players are rather afraid no to play the loser, but to play a pariah. I know I rather like situations where I play a character facing difficulties (like the PIE ball thing was completely unexpected RP drama that was lolsome to endure), but I also know that I can be afraid to play a character that loses all friends of contacts and ends up as a pariah / laughing stock / whatever. Because that's terrible for RP eventually, and it's definitely not fun. There is a big difference in terms of fun between a marginal and a pariah (not a villain) that everyone despises.

but not Lyn 'slightly heretical beliefs.'

She is not even heretical -_-

[Makkal]

On an OOC level, I have no idea what that was about, so I guessed based on what the characters were saying.

[Steffanie Saissore]

This is a link to a short story that wraps up a piece of Steffanie's past: Revelations

[Lyn Farel]

On an OOC level, I have no idea what that was about, so I guessed based on what the characters were saying.

Mostly bad IC blood between both parties in the past.

[Katrina Oniseki]

Steff is good peoples. <3

I like having a moderate voice around here. Too many extremists!

[Esna Pitoojee]

I understand Steff finds the Esna creepy.

This amuses me.