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Author Topic: Discovering and designing characters  (Read 2835 times)

Casiella

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Discovering and designing characters
« on: 11 Apr 2011, 20:49 »

So in the thread on Story lines and player interaction, Ulphus made the (excellent) point that roleplay styles exist on a continuum, such as whether players determine the direction of their characters in advance or not.

In other RP forums for other games, I have often asked the question about whether players discover or design their characters. Of course, the real answer is "yes". :P

But I've found that, although I do both, they present entirely different sorts of challenges and pleasures for me. Conceiving a coherent character for a particular purpose always intrigues me: the Cartel SAR pilot who lives for bacchanalia, the closed-mouth RSS operative seeking the downfall of his people's enemies, the chessmaster power broker, etc. Creating a character with a simple concept and discovering who he is through activity and interaction provides an entirely different sort of fun, one in which I give up at least part of the control to those who interact with me. The questions they ask and the choices they 'force' him to make often lead down different paths than I might have initially imagined, and I love that. These characters tend to stick with me much, much longer, although I don't get that initial rush of having a character coalesce in my mind at the very beginning.

What about you? Do you have a particular style you prefer?
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Esna Pitoojee

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Re: Discovering and designing characters
« Reply #1 on: 11 Apr 2011, 21:29 »

RP, like everything else, is a lot easier to define by what you don't want than what you do. So, for example, I've given Esna a few broad guidelines to run by which I feel will prevent the RP from becoming deprived of any fun for me, but beyond that he operates mainly on his "own" IC experiences. Occasionally I'll still have to step in and add a new guideline, either because some IC factor has emerged that alters my views on some form of RP or simply because I feel that I've found that something isn't as interesting/desirable/drama-free as I'd hoped, and letting it roll on unhindered threatens to kill the fun in my RP.

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Ember Vykos

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Re: Discovering and designing characters
« Reply #2 on: 11 Apr 2011, 22:04 »

Usually I design my characters, but that's mostly because I love character building. I literally have about 20 different character types in my head right now. Anywhere from a pod pilot form of Ke$ha that I made up when I heard one of her songs on the radio to a cartelesque Amarrian holder or possibly an Intaki Syndicate character based off of this clip I saw one night.

When I made Ember I knew I wanted her to be in the cartel from the get go. Retrospectively that was probably a mistake since I controlled her RP to get her there instead of letting her progress like I had initially planed to do. Hopefully I can avoid that with the new character I'm working on, and let her end up wherever she ends up through IC interaction as opposed to OOC desicions.
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Lyn Farel

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Re: Discovering and designing characters
« Reply #3 on: 12 Apr 2011, 02:19 »

Usually I design more than I discover. I design the whole general lines and discover the details and anecdotes, though with Lyn is was a bit more complex because I started to play the game after its release where starter attributes and skills were still tied to the bloodline. So i had to accomodate that, plus that I was not in any RP community at the beginning.
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Laria Raven

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Re: Discovering and designing characters
« Reply #4 on: 12 Apr 2011, 05:08 »

I think I'm much more on the discover side of the equation. I tend to start with very simple, basic backgrounds, and an idea of some early drivers and motivations, and then explore with that, trying to react to what happens while at the same time give the character some plans and ambitions.

I'm also very sparing with my "special" points, preferring everyman characters who are a little out of their depth.

Partly this is as a result of finding that I /can't/ "design" a character - they always tend to change when I start to play them, so I give them a little room to do that as I find the character's "voice" and style.
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Ulphus

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Re: Discovering and designing characters
« Reply #5 on: 12 Apr 2011, 05:20 »

I think I'm much more on the discover side of the equation. I tend to start with very simple, basic backgrounds, and an idea of some early drivers and motivations, and then explore with that, trying to react to what happens while at the same time give the character some plans and ambitions.

I'm also very sparing with my "special" points, preferring everyman characters who are a little out of their depth.

Partly this is as a result of finding that I /can't/ "design" a character - they always tend to change when I start to play them, so I give them a little room to do that as I find the character's "voice" and style.

^^This

I think I don't disagree with any of it.
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Vieve

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Re: Discovering and designing characters
« Reply #6 on: 12 Apr 2011, 06:29 »

Celeste (on purpose) and Sabi (accidentally) were designed.  Despite what it may look like from the outside, they've more or less stayed within the parameters of their original design.

Until, eh, about a year ago, Vieve was designed by other people.  I guess you could say that I discovered what she was via her interactions with those individuals.   
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Kybernetes Moros

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Re: Discovering and designing characters
« Reply #7 on: 12 Apr 2011, 10:49 »

Personally, I've enjoyed the 'discover' approach. Whether I'm any particular authority on this with Kyber being my first and thus far only RP character is a different matter, but it seems to me that if I were to try and design a character, I'd end up moving away from the specification in a matter of weeks anyway.

Besides, rolling with the punches, as it were, can have some fun results; a good while before the live events kicked off, a few things happened that made me think "huh, the Nation and Kyber would be a pretty good fit in quite a few ways" and perhaps make that route a choice in the future. A few weeks / months later, the Sansha pop along and start doing their thing, which eventually results in the thoroughly unexpected (for me initially, at any rate) outcome of Kyber pulling up stakes and joining them.

If that would have happened had I designed him beyond a few really general ideas of how he'd act and then dived into RE-AW Public (maybe EM Public?) a month or so after joining EVE, creating background and future as I went along, pretty much, I dunno. Designing a character as an experiment in the practice would be something I'd quite like to try at some stage, but alas, :alts: and :money:.   
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Orthic

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Re: Discovering and designing characters
« Reply #8 on: 12 Apr 2011, 12:48 »

Because of how much I love designing anything, I designed each of my characters with a decent amount of detail and care.

Because my own mind when playing the characters refuses to behave properly, I end up discovering that what I planned has little impact on what actually happens. Of the four to six RP characters I have, only one or two are predictable to me, because they are basically just me in capsuleer form. The rest have a habit of surprising me.

So yeah... tried to design them because that's just what I do. Have been discovering how wrong I was about them ever since.
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Saede Riordan

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Re: Discovering and designing characters
« Reply #9 on: 12 Apr 2011, 12:57 »

Most of my RP comes from the discovery approach. Like, I'm RPing, I decide that Nikita needs to have a ptsd flashback, and a whole bit of background about that even emerges.
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Bong-cha Jones

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Re: Discovering and designing characters
« Reply #10 on: 12 Apr 2011, 19:37 »

I mix and match.  I designed Simon to an extent, mostly to make sure that Simon-c's desires matched Simon-p's capabilities.  Simon wasn't built to be the kind of guy who'd want to head a null-sec alliance and fc a dreadnought fleet on pos bashes, because I just don't have the time for that sort of thing.  I also started out with the statement "Simon-c is a Federal Loyalist."  To be honest, a lot of the 'discoveries' are hardly surprising:  I like Duvolle and, big coincidence, so does Simon-c.  We're both interested in trade and industry.  We both like dabbling in exploration and wormholes.  And so on.

On the other hand, I thought Simon would be a lot less libertarian than he is, and I certainly didn't expect him to develop a crush on a prominent Angel capsuleer.  I never expected that he'd be the sort of person to say 'I don't believe a word you're saying, but that doesn't mean we can't have a pleasant conversation'.  So, while he's often predictable to me, he's more than capable of surprises.
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Matariki Rain

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Re: Discovering and designing characters
« Reply #11 on: 13 Apr 2011, 18:44 »

Although Ulf and I both tend to describe our roleplay preference as "develop in play" I'm going to make the case here that well-chosen design helps.

Design is what sets up the initial conditions and acts as a springboard. It's the starting point for a character journey: the point from which you can change. It also describes the points where you review the past for consistency and plot-hooks and do some prep and world-building for the future. Design is more like writing or reading fiction.

Development is what happens and changes once you let the character loose in the world. It's also what you improvise on the fly because you suddenly need to have a childhood memory to share or a "yes, and..." response to something that's happened in your world. Development is more like improv theatre.

The characters of mine who've been most successful have tended to have decent helpings of both.

Too much design without enough scope for responding and changing leads to inflexibility and railroading. If this is done really well it can be kind of fun in a set-piece fashion, but usually it makes me think "Uh-oh, pre-scripted plotline ahead. Let me know when you're done and looking to play with other people, 'kay?"

At the other extreme, starting with a blank or near-blank page can be enormously exciting because you have to wing everything. We were several sessions into one freeform game when the GM said "And with your third sword you...", "What!? I'm holding three swords?", "Yes, you're holding the third sword in your tail, silly" and the world suddenly shifted. (It turned out that we were post-apocalyptic rats.) Develop-in-play is where you get to spin stories as you speak or type or banter, inventing/discovering things as you go.

Develop-in-play can also easily run out of momentum when there's nothing new to bounce off: you generally need some prompts, hooks or personal drivers to keep a character moving rather than floating through life reacting to what comes along. You also need to be getting out there and roleplaying in ways which meaningfully develop your character, which can be quite tricky if you're starting out or still building a social network.

One of the approaches I've liked for character generation in what's essentially a develop-in-play game is "write 100 words about your character" with the expectation there you'll put hooks and ambiguities in the description which you won't know the answers to when you write them. Minimal design, but enough to give you nudges and quests and such later on.

When Ulf and I play in a shared background we tend to develop separately but check in now and then for some story-reconciliation and design. We both have characters from the Atamahara clan, for instance, which has had phases of conscious design connected by a lot of independent free-form development. We've got a pretty good shared shorthand of tropes and expectations, and our interactions with people who don't share those nudge us to extend and develop our play.

There are reasons you might want to do a strongly designed character. A character that's primarily designed and unchanging can be a good foil or straight-person. If you need a certain viewpoint to respond to or your group enjoys a certain style of repartee, you can have hours of amusement without needing much in the way of character development. If you need the character to play a certain in-game role, too, you might want a reason they stay being an interstellar trucker or pay a dividend to another character or whatever.

In general, though, I tend to value journeys and quests and "How did the main protagonist grow and change in the course of this arc?". This can lead to a problem in open-ended RP: what do you do when you've changed a lot, found a setting where you're comfortable, and have settled down with a mortgage, kids and a nice little extraction plant on a planet? The typical responses are to throw in some drama to upset that balance or to turn into one of those reliable designed characters that has it all basically worked out. I'm pondering this a bit at the moment.

In summary, I strongly recommend develop-in-play underpinned with enough design to make deep, interesting and consistent worlds and people.
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hellgremlin

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Re: Discovering and designing characters
« Reply #12 on: 14 Apr 2011, 16:02 »

This could have gone in the infiltration thread as a nugget of sagely advice:

The only difference between a good corp thief, and a roleplayer, is: the corp thief creates more characters. (oh and also uses them to rob people.)

*istvaan explodes into a cloud of shrieking bats*
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Matariki Rain

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Re: Discovering and designing characters
« Reply #13 on: 14 Apr 2011, 16:10 »

The only difference between a good corp thief, and a roleplayer, is: the corp thief creates more characters. (oh and also uses them to rob people.)

Because the corp thief is roleplaying OOC as well as IC?
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hellgremlin

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Re: Discovering and designing characters
« Reply #14 on: 15 Apr 2011, 14:02 »

Yup. Infiltrating roleplayers is extra fun, because then you have to create a character (the player) and then have that character create a character of his/her own (the avatar) to play as. You can even make little connections between the two, and when your target discovers the connections, they end up reinforcing the target's positive opinion of your infiltrator.
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