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[Seriphyn]

A problem with immersion and believability with me in EVE, and I think a few others too, is how when it gets down to individual interaction in bars and other places, everything and everyone seems to be Western, or, in EVE case, Gallente. Not really anyone's fault, since everyone here is pretty much of a Western disposition.

I don't know if anyone here has much experience in foreign cultures, but let's use an example of Amarr. I have a rough image of what a non-Westernized, traditional bar in Iran is like. Men sitting at tables in a quiet environment, probably no bar of any kind, being served by a waiter. I imagine a Caldari bar would be the same too.

I mean, hell, just like IRL, I imagine these cultures to be totally, totally different, but the bars RP'd in EVE pretty much seem indistinguishable. Skyhook, PVBOS Grill, Last Gate...

Not to mention, a lot of the female characters are RPed like the Ethnic Gallente female desc of being vibrant and girly girl and that. My point is, is where is the cultural flavour and variety in EVE RP?

I could elaborate but I think people know what I'm talking about

[Casiella]

I actually get more frustrated by everyone RPing in bars. Most people don't frequent them IRL, or at least not all their lives, so why should we always hang out there IC?

And I sort of don't understand how Amarrian and Caldari social settings would resemble each other...

[Seriphyn]

And I sort of don't understand how Amarrian and Caldari social settings would resemble each other...

Well, moreso in the fact that neither of which would be remotely anything Gallentean/Western.

Gallentean cultural permutation that's hammered around in PF could be dramatic license, though.

I'd like to be able to walk into an Amarrian bar and be like "Right, okay, I'm RPing Amarrian now"

[Jozana]

I agree with you Seri, but it's not something that's easily changed unfortunately.

Of those even willing to go another way and start RPing in a different manner, there will also be people who don't want to swap in what they've already created for that. In other words people may be like "Hey you're right, but I'd be willing to give it a spin to RP like a true Amarrian or anything, but........ not with this character.".

You have a perfectly valid point, but changing it will be hard.

Edit: In fact let me make that intention a bit clearer: It won't just be hard, imho it's quite an unreasonable expectation.

[Casiella]

Personally I have RPed in a few unmistakably Minmatar establishments. I suspect that conveying diverse atmospheres presents far more difficulty than one might suppose. Otherwise, why not do it yourself?  

[orange]

I am pretty sure most of the places you described are run by criminally aligned organizations.

I have a rough image of what a non-Westernized, traditional bar in Iran is like. Men sitting at tables in a quiet environment, probably no bar of any kind, being served by a waiter.

The West (and Gallente) has (have) these too.  They are Private Clubs, where old powerful men sit around in comfy chairs and smoke cigars and discuss how to make it illegal to have new-fangled dance clubs, where the waiters are half nude and sucking on lollipops.

In the non-Western world, like Tehran, Beijing, or Dheli the younger/edger demographic is going mix the energy found in a western bar/club with their own cultural preference.

The bars/clubs you listed are just that - edger establishments on the fringes of their society.

[Alain Colcer]

Amarr hang out in bars? i thought their RP channels were temples or some sort of grand religious building to gardens and all.

[Jozana]

Amarr hang out in bars? i thought their RP channels were temples or some sort of grand religious building to gardens and all.

lol

I do believe even Amarr visit bars at times, yes.

[Boma Airaken]

Frankly I am kind of confused with, and slightly sick of, the forced anthropology I see with the races in eve. Caldari HAVE to be a bunch of green tea drinkers? Why are we constantly assigning cultures to the bloodlines that HAVE to resemble their supposed old earth counterparts? Is it because people need a sense of familiarity? They seem to resemble the Japanese and therefore have to BE Japanese? Myabe i am crazy, but I just don't get it.

[Benjamin Shepherd]

Why don't we make a solution and start up a new channel that serves as another social gathering? Alcohol isn't so important that we have to meet new people there, and show off our pirate pecs.

[scagga]

The Crying siren, Grey seams and other Ammatar establishments may have been a taste of something different.

Hrr

Re: Socialising in Amarr/Persian style:

Use grades of veiled politeness for every mood and enact humbleness competitions.  Put out imbricate tables, coloured glass tea cups and generous portions of various rarities - that are repeatedly offered from one patron to another to insist that they indulge ever more.  Talk about food, a lot, and the food you used to eat, and whom were good at preparing it.  Bring on seemingly sincere discussions of people's health, their families, their family histories, how their families interweave and reminisce over points of interest repeatedly.  Never discuss politics if you aren't alone.  Never discuss religion in the presence of unfamiliar company.  Never confront others in polite company.  Never make repeated eye-contact to females (and wtf are they doing there without a chaperone?).

Show an appreciation for fine handicrafts (carpets in particular), spend time describing their origin and the purity of the sourced requisite materials.  Show appreciation for successes of people in the fields of science, literature related to theology of shared interest or ethics and morality. Show appreciation of plays on words, tell stories and describe something unusual.  Show evidence of esotericism, a little subtle boasting when in the company of friends.  Compliment intensely, in a superfluous manner, never insult directly. Avoid intoxicating drinks.  Tea and opiates on the other hand, are acceptable in the more liberal circles.  

Bored or interested?

[Boma Airaken]

Why don't we make a solution and start up a new channel that serves as another social gathering? Alcohol isn't so important that we have to meet new people there, and show off our pirate pecs.

I think it has to do with the fact that except for a few individuals, the idea of sitting around with a bunch of ultra religious bastards drinking mint tea and discussing the merits of increased restrictions on the showing of ankles, is quite fucking boring.

The bar and alcohol environment is universal when it comes to socialization. Look up Three Sheets with Zane Lamprey. It is everywhere, in every country, and every culture. Just because a minority of teetotallers and uptight bastards don't participate, doesn't mean the majority doesn't either.

As far as the cigar lounge fat cat thing, that was what Kanpuu Elite was about, and it was a great channel before I closed it. But making it public would have defeated the purpose. Myself and the regulars sure as shit didn't want some sub-billionaire frigate jockey just walking in and trying to fake it.

[Boma Airaken]

The Crying siren, Grey seams and other Ammatar establishments may have been a taste of something different.

Hrr

Re: Socialising in Amarr/Persian style:

Use grades of veiled politeness for every mood and enact humbleness competitions.  Put out imbricate tables, coloured glass tea cups and generous portions of various rarities - that are repeatedly offered from one patron to another to insist that they indulge ever more.  Talk about food, a lot, and the food you used to eat, and whom were good at preparing it.  Bring on seemingly sincere discussions of people's health, their families, their family histories, how their families interweave and reminisce over points of interest repeatedly.  Never discuss politics if you aren't alone.  Never discuss religion in the presence of unfamiliar company.  Never confront others in polite company.  Never make repeated eye-contact to females (and wtf are they doing there without a chaperone?).

Show an appreciation for fine handicrafts (carpets in particular), spend time describing their origin and the purity of the sourced requisite materials.  Show appreciation for successes of people in the fields of science, literature related to theology of shared interest or ethics and morality. Show appreciation of plays on words, tell stories and describe something unusual.  Show evidence of esotericism, a little subtle boasting when in the company of friends.  Compliment intensely, in a superfluous manner, never insult directly. Avoid intoxicating drinks.  Tea and opiates on the other hand, are acceptable in the more liberal circles.  

Bored or interested?

Utterly boring for only one reason. Too much resemblance to oh I don't know, Iran? I can go there in RL for that. I don't want to experience Iran in space.

[Dex_Kivuli]

Hmm... I dunno. Maybe I'm out of the loop, but the main Caldari RP channel for me is the Heiian College.

Also, I haven't been there in a while, but the Caldari also have the Tea House:

Tea House

A massive wooden floor austerely decorated in Caldari fashion, with some heavy concrete vases here and there holding kresh branches. There are some tatamis lying on the floor for the guests to sit on. The feeling of austerity is reinforced by the sound of deep solemn drums played by a hidden sound system. A hanging scroll displays an exquisite calligraphic work that reads: "True tea is made with water drawn from the depths of mind"

Seems very Caldari to me. Quiet reflection, connection to the ancestors.

And besides, it's a good place to give poison tea to people who let down the corp.

[scagga]

The Crying siren, Grey seams and other Ammatar establishments may have been a taste of something different.

Hrr

Re: Socialising in Amarr/Persian style:

Use grades of veiled politeness for every mood and enact humbleness competitions.  Put out imbricate tables, coloured glass tea cups and generous portions of various rarities - that are repeatedly offered from one patron to another to insist that they indulge ever more.  Talk about food, a lot, and the food you used to eat, and whom were good at preparing it.  Bring on seemingly sincere discussions of people's health, their families, their family histories, how their families interweave and reminisce over points of interest repeatedly.  Never discuss politics if you aren't alone.  Never discuss religion in the presence of unfamiliar company.  Never confront others in polite company.  Never make repeated eye-contact to females (and wtf are they doing there without a chaperone?).

Show an appreciation for fine handicrafts (carpets in particular), spend time describing their origin and the purity of the sourced requisite materials.  Show appreciation for successes of people in the fields of science, literature related to theology of shared interest or ethics and morality. Show appreciation of plays on words, tell stories and describe something unusual.  Show evidence of esotericism, a little subtle boasting when in the company of friends.  Compliment intensely, in a superfluous manner, never insult directly. Avoid intoxicating drinks.  Tea and opiates on the other hand, are acceptable in the more liberal circles.  

Bored or interested?

Utterly boring for only one reason. Too much resemblance to oh I don't know, Iran? I can go there in RL for that. I don't want to experience Iran in space.

It is evident from your previous post that you find Amarrian conservativism, inalienably and legitimately latent within the gamme of EvE cultures, to your subjective distaste.

However:

In construing an Amarrian cultural environment, it is not necessarily a question of what representation of Amarrian culture one likes, in my opinion.  Rather, it is more a question of what representation of Amarrian culture could be considered by the most scrupulous collection of minds, to be accurate post-examination of available canonical material.

If indeed it were surmised that Persian culture bears semblance to aspects of Amarrian culture, notwithstanding the interest that a mentionable proportion of EvE-playing population has in and pleasure that they derive from emulating it, it would not be a fair statement to use an objective tone to deride it.

(recognise that the next statement is in jest...) The alternative is globalisation, or more aptly universalisation of Gallentean hedonistic, degenerate and etoh-drinking ways.