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Author Topic: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC  (Read 39503 times)

Samira Kernher

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Re: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC
« Reply #285 on: 04 Oct 2013, 04:34 »

I was rather surprised they turned up, actually. CCP Falcon had mentioned in OOC chat a few weeks before that they weren't allowed to attend player-run events.
Which is why, purely for the purposes of sarcasm, I'm going to pretend that I'm surprised that people are pretending to be surprised about this.

Isn't a pretending thing here. Like I said, I've only been playing for 8 months, so I don't know how things are supposed to be handled.

Quote
Personally I don't really agree with a complete ban of attending player events, but I do think that if they are going to attend player-run events then they absolutely need to handle it in a responsible and equal manner.
They don't have the resources to do this. It's between three and twelve guys (depending on who you ask and what time of day/time of year it is) who have to manage essentially the entirety of the EVE universe's canon. They don't have the time or the money to dedicate to the RP community on this serious a basis and given the current state of it I'm not sure we'd deserve it even if they did.

Well, the live events team on SWG was even smaller (by the end I think it was just one guy, actually), and had to deal with multiple servers instead of just one, but they managed. The EVE team does have a lot of other stuff to manage, admittedly.

I just don't want to see event support completely eliminated. EVE is one of if not the only MMO that still has an events team, and that's one of the biggest draws to the game IMO. They just need to make it equal opportunity for all players, because from what I'm hearing it wasn't and that's definitely wrong.
« Last Edit: 04 Oct 2013, 04:38 by Samira Kernher »
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Andreus Ixiris

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Re: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC
« Reply #286 on: 04 Oct 2013, 04:58 »

Isn't a pretending thing here. Like I said, I've only been playing for 8 months, so I don't know how things are supposed to be handled.
Oh, no, I'm totally aware it's not a pretending thing.

For you.

I just don't want to see event support completely eliminated. EVE is one of if not the only MMO that still has an events team, and that's one of the biggest draws to the game IMO. They just need to make it equal opportunity for all players, because from what I'm hearing it wasn't and that's definitely wrong.
Currently it is equal opportunity. Any player can participate in a live event, which is sometimes pretty ludicrous; the only time I've seen an event actor express even a modicum of discomfort about being in a fleet with someone was when Stitcher was chosen as our cyno pilot for the Combined Harvest event, which was frankly a perfectly understandable - if not strictly logical - concern: "he's Caldari, can we trust him?" Now, with the proper enforcement of rules which were already in place but previously inconsistently enforced, no group of players can accuse the dev team of being biased towards one faction in terms of channel or event attendance because the only channel event actors appear in is run by CCP (meaning players cannot gate access to real-time interaction with the event actors) and the only events the actors appear at are run by CCP (and thus open to all).

If the Amarrians wanted to keep event actor attendance at their events they should have been a lot more conscientious about encouraging event actors to appear at the events of other factions as well. You seem to have a reasonable and balanced outlook on it but the reason I didn't bother speaking out on it publicly before CCP righted their ship by themselves was because I strongly suspected that responses from the vast majority of the Amarrian bloc would probably follow one of three formats:

a. "There is no favouritism."
b. "Take it up with CCP, it isn't our responsibility."
c. "Deal with it."
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Lyn Farel

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Re: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC
« Reply #287 on: 04 Oct 2013, 05:17 »

That's a lot of assumptions that you make.
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Vincent Pryce

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Re: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC
« Reply #288 on: 04 Oct 2013, 05:59 »

Fuck yeah, page 20. Onwards to more bitter derp!

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Andreus Ixiris

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Re: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC
« Reply #289 on: 04 Oct 2013, 06:11 »

That's a lot of assumptions that you make.
Yes. Fortunately, I'm rarely wrong.
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Kasuko

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Re: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC
« Reply #290 on: 04 Oct 2013, 06:14 »

That's a lot of assumptions that you make.
Yes. Fortunately, I'm rarely wrong.

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Mister Screwball

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Re: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC
« Reply #291 on: 04 Oct 2013, 06:17 »

That's a lot of assumptions that you make.
Yes. Fortunately, I'm rarely wrong.
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Andreus Ixiris

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Re: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC
« Reply #292 on: 04 Oct 2013, 06:24 »

That's a lot of empty quoting you're doing.
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Mister Screwball

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Re: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC
« Reply #293 on: 04 Oct 2013, 06:32 »

That's a lot of empty quoting you're doing.

I think you will find that a picture is worth a thousand words.  With this in mind you will be pleased to hear that the individuals you are maligning have in fact posted 72,000 words each (approximately, I didn't time the gifs).  Thats two pieces of literature longer than anything written by Steinbeck.  Doctoral Theses have a word cap of 40,000.  You're welcome.
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Lyn Farel

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Re: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC
« Reply #294 on: 04 Oct 2013, 07:09 »

That said I don't especially disagree Andreus, but outright saying that the Amarrian bloc will deny it at all costs is rather... hazardous.

Edit : nvm
« Last Edit: 04 Oct 2013, 07:39 by Lyn Farel »
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Louella Dougans

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Re: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC
« Reply #295 on: 04 Oct 2013, 07:19 »

Oh, it's Andreus's well-known dislike of amarr players again, seeing pro-amarrian things everywhere.

vOv
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Morwen Lagann

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Re: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC
« Reply #296 on: 04 Oct 2013, 08:13 »

That's a lot of assumptions that you make.
Yes. Fortunately, I'm rarely wrong.

I'll bite. Try these on for size:

Alright, fuck it.

If you know your devs, you'll know that one of the devs in the EVE Illuminati is in charge of "Amarrian" event actors and PF - which is a wide net which also includes Khanid, Ammatar, SoE and the Blood Raiders.

Did anyone think to ask why PIE's event got an actual Amarrian actor visiting it, but the Federation Day event only got an SoE actor? Esna's suggestion that we got a FedNav actor is misinformed - I was there for the entire length of Federation Day (I had to be - I was DJing) and the only reason we got a visit from an event actor at all is because we began making noise in various channels about the fact that PIE had got a visit from an event actor and we hadn't. You could call this "manufactured outrage" on our part, and to be fair it probably was, but it worked - yellow text appeared in Dodixie local for all of, what, five minutes, if that? The funny thing was, when the event actor turned up, it was SoE, which are a group which has basically nothing to do with the Federation. This makes absolutely no sense unless you consider that the event actors for SoE are controlled by the same dev who does the event actors for Amarr and the Blood Raiders. The dev who does the event actors for the Federation is an entirely different person.

When you look at event actor attendance at player-run events, a distinct pattern emerges.

So I'm just going to come right out and say it - Amarrians were the ones benefiting almost exclusively off event actors attending their events and hanging out in their channels. Why are Minmatar, Caldari and in particular Gallente roleplayers collectively less upset about the event actors not coming to our events or channels anymore? Well shit, how would we even know something had changed? It'll basically be exactly the same for us as it was before. The only visible change that's occured from our perspective is that players are no longer able to gate access to the channels where the event actors usually hang out, which is a benefit to everyone equally.

Well, of course, except for the gatekeepers. But you don't know any of them, do you? ;)

First off, Esna's not misinformed. He was referring to a previous Federation Day, just like others have several times before him in this thread.

Second: The reason there was an SOE actor at the Federation Day event is because the person who organized the event explicitly asked for an SOE actor. Furthermore, the Live Events team has more people on it than are able to participate with proper speaking roles. If someone who is responsible for one or more actors is not available at the time of the event you're planning, that's your problem, not theirs. The person responsible for the Fed actors likely wasn't available that day due to having a real life outside of the office, and the person(s) responsible for the Amarr and SOE ones were.

It should be noted that for the PIE anniversary event we had sent out direct invites to the developer actors at least a month in advance. I don't know if the Federation Day crew did the same, but if they hadn't then this would be a factor to consider.
We did. The dev running the Federation event actors apparently follows the rules a bit more closely than the one running the Amarrian event actors, because we got a polite "sorry, appreciate the invite, but can't." This is precisely the same response that the PIE ball and its attendees should have received. In point of fact, the surprise to me was not that the PIE ball got an event actor and we initially didn't, it was that our campaign of somewhat-phony outrage actually managed to cause the dev enough concern that they actually bothered to send us an actor at all.

Again, the reason there was an SOE actor at the Federation Day event, is because the person who organized the event explicitly asked for an SOE actor. And for the absence of a Fed actor, it clearly couldn't possibly have been a schedule conflict on their part, nope, not at all.

I also find it interesting for you to say that Amarr get more. We haven't even had a single Amarr live event this year
Live events aren't relevant to this discussion. Those are not player events. This entire conversation we're having revolves around event actor attendance at player events, which to the (thankfully) limited extent that it happened favoured Amarrians. The entire reason for the rule about not showing up at player events or in player channels to begin with was CCP's desire to not appear to show favouritism. It should not have happened and no longer will.

As stated before, if only one of the people who is authorized to 'play' the part of an actor in answering mails or showing up to events - CCP-hosted or not - is available, then the onus is on your end to try and find a time that works for the actor(s) you want to appear, not to throw a fit when the people who are available show up to events scheduled when they're available just because they're not your event.

Now, I can't speak for past years, mind, but for this one we've certainly been on the backburner compared to everyone else.
In past years? In past years there was a live events team called AURORA, which was infamously shut down for disproportionately favouring Amarrians - it was to the point where it was actually discouraging roleplayers in other factions. If you want to know why there was an almost year-long period where I was literally the only active Federal roleplayer in the entire game, this was one of many contributing factors.

I would wager good money that the AURORA debacle is a major contributing factor in - if not the sole reason for - the "don't involve live event actors in player channels or events" rule.

AURORA's problem was not favoritism toward a specific faction based on story arcs or events. It was people inside it cheating and giving information about the events to other parties that allowed them to be 'pushed' to those volunteers' player-characters' benefit.

Furthermore, your apparent position that live events and player events are (or should be) wholly separate from one another is not a good precedent to set in a world where we're supposed to be able to cause ripples, not just react to ones caused by CCP.

Live events very frequently spawn or influence player events. Sometimes these player events influence the world and are reflected in the news - Federation Day has had a number of articles over the years, my "Hearth and Home" relief project got a mention in a news article, SYNE's Seyllin Conference has had a few articles about it, etc. - and sometimes they even spawn events and story arcs, as Soter (and probably others in GMVA) did with their petition for an explanation after the events in Evaulon.

The Amarrians have had absolutely NO live events since last year, and that's questionable at best considering that the only event I can think of actually involved Blood Raiders faffing about in highsec and then moving on to Oyonata where they got smashed in (there was a minor thing for people collecting Navy tags for the Blood Raider actors as well, but no actual 'event' behind it afaik). On the other hand, the Caldari have had this huge arc with the destabilization of Heth's Provist regime and its fall to the CEP, they also shared the Caldari Prime arc with the Gallente, who shared the Midular/Colelie arc with the Minmatar, who finally had the Tribal Council (or whatever it is) set back up after 5 years. Even several of the pirate factions have had small arcs as part of the Dust 514 connection.

So the Amarrians have had basically no attention from the Events team since it got put back together again, and somehow it's not cool for them to have a couple actors show up for about half an hour at an event put on by one of the oldest corporations in the game for their 10th anniversary, which, by the way, they left so that the person (or persons) playing them could go show up to the Federation Day event that was scheduled at the same time?

I'm not even really a member of the Amarrian RP subcommunity and I think that's a crock of shit.
« Last Edit: 04 Oct 2013, 08:14 by Morwen Lagann »
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Anslol

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Re: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC
« Reply #297 on: 04 Oct 2013, 08:18 »

I'm sorry but why the flying fuck should the Amarr RP'ers be responsible for telling devs to go to other faction's events? They aren't the managers. I mean shit aside from Fed day when was the last MAJOR Gallente or Caldari Minmatar event, and I mean major.

Fed day was big and had ERRYBODY up in that bitch in Luminaire. SOE actor shows up, yayz.

PIE, one of the oldest god damn alliances in the game, hosts their annual ball. Errybody show's up in THAT bitch as they do for however many years they consistently did it. Amarr actors show up, nose in air and all, yayz.

I dunno if I've ever seen a major Minmatar or Caldari player event, but I haven't been in the RP scene too long so meh.

Bottom line, if you want them to come, BUILD THE FUCKING THING. People didn't show up to burning man to stare at a desert and hope something happened. No, they knew a giant fucking fire was gonna be lit, so they went.

Want people coming? LIGHT A FUCKING FIRE.
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Lyn Farel

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Re: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC
« Reply #298 on: 04 Oct 2013, 08:43 »

[redacted]

Are we again arguing of which faction has CCP favours/attention and which one is spoiled ? *monocle* Yes of course sir,  that's what we always do !
« Last Edit: 04 Oct 2013, 13:09 by Lyn Farel »
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Anslol

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Re: CCP Falcon: Live from OOC
« Reply #299 on: 04 Oct 2013, 08:56 »

That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that it isn't the responsibility of the players or RP'ers to tell CCP/dev actors what other faction events they should go to. Blaming them for not doing that is just...dumb.
« Last Edit: 04 Oct 2013, 09:34 by Anslol »
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