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[Caellach Marellus]

By the time he's let out he'll be a frail and feeble old man who's unable to hold his own piss till he can reach a toilet. He'll be a threat to noone and isolated by how society has long moved on and left him behind.

[Seriphyn]

This guy...he's like putting up a fist in a defiant salute...he actually resembles an Internet armchair politician, who becomes so disconnected  from society reality that he thinks "Oh, look what I'm doing, I'm making a proper political statement through all of this. People will actually begin to doubt Norwegian/Western society and see the TRUTH!!!!1"

No. No you're not.

You're just coming across as insane.

[hellgremlin]

I don't think he's coming off as insane. I think it'd be far, far more comforting if he came off as insane.

He comes off as someone far worse than a madman; a man of faith and conviction and cemented beliefs. We're lucky this guy blew his cork early and only wasted 70 people; if he was patient, and stuck to rousing oratory, I'm sure his clean-cut looks would've got him into politics or authority of some sort. Instead, he merely became a hero to the copycats who will follow in his footsteps.

He's not insane. He is just completely irredeemably evil. The hallmark of true evil is always the belief that you are doing good.

[Gottii]

I don't think he's coming off as insane. I think it'd be far, far more comforting if he came off as insane.

He comes off as someone far worse than a madman; a man of faith and conviction and cemented beliefs. We're lucky this guy blew his cork early and only wasted 70 people; if he was patient, and stuck to rousing oratory, I'm sure his clean-cut looks would've got him into politics or authority of some sort. Instead, he merely became a hero to the copycats who will follow in his footsteps.

He's not insane. He is just completely irredeemably evil. The hallmark of true evil is always the belief that you are doing good.

This.  People with ideals but no principles are the most dangerous kind of people out there.

[Mizhara]

Well, he did try to go into politics/authority. He failed, badly. Still images give him a wholly different appearance than when he's actually shown trying to talk or whatever. He's far too clumsy as a public speaker and he has absolutely no charisma. He's not very good at anything, really. Or so it seems.

As for looks, replacing a jawline with a beard like that... that's not clean-cut. That's just so very sad.

On the insanity question, he does come off as quite... off. His narcissistic personality disorder becomes more and more clear every time he speaks (and better yet, gets interrupted or asked something that doesn't quite fit in with his insane version of the world) and there's quite a few other symptoms of mental disorders showing. None of them takes away his responsibility for his actions, yet.

[Bacchanalian]

I don't think he's coming off as insane. I think it'd be far, far more comforting if he came off as insane.

He comes off as someone far worse than a madman; a man of faith and conviction and cemented beliefs. We're lucky this guy blew his cork early and only wasted 70 people; if he was patient, and stuck to rousing oratory, I'm sure his clean-cut looks would've got him into politics or authority of some sort. Instead, he merely became a hero to the copycats who will follow in his footsteps.

He's not insane. He is just completely irredeemably evil. The hallmark of true evil is always the belief that you are doing good.

That sounds awfully close to the definition of "psychopathic". 

"Psychopathy (/saɪˈkɒpəθi/[25]) was not used as the official term but referred to a personality disorder characterized by an abnormal lack of empathy combined with strongly amoral conduct but masked by an ability to appear outwardly normal."

You could argue that the term is merely a clinical term for "completely irredeemably evil" that doctors use to try and categorize someone who exhibits that sort of behavior.  But at the end of the day in every mental health catalogue on the planet you'll find psycopathy and sociopathy and both are closely related and could potentially be applied in this case.  I'm not a doctor, and I don't profess to be any sort of expert on this stuff, and from what little I've read even the doctors that have interacted with him can't agree, so this is really just pissing in the wind.  But I have a hard time wrapping my head around the notion that anyone is capable of what he did without being mentally ill in some fashion. 

[Victoria Stecker]

  But I have a hard time wrapping my head around the notion that anyone is capable of what he did without being mentally ill in some fashion.

Agreed. The question for the court to decide will be whether his particular case of fucked-in-the-head-ness is sufficient to absolve him of responsibility for his actions.

Although I wonder how we would view the 9/11 hijackers, had they appeared in court. They were at least as certain that what they were doing was right - but the possibility that a terrorist may be insane isn't one that's often considered. ...

... shit, now I'm actually curious. What is it about this guy (the fact that he acted alone, wrote a monster manifesto, isn't particularly charismatic) that we look at him as a possible psycho, while we look at someone like Bin Laden (lead a large organization, highly educated and charismatic) and never think that he might be mentally ill.

[Desiderya]

Religion.

[Tiberious Thessalonia]

The funny thing about this case is that everyone agrees he did it.  He's not claiming that he's not guilty. He's claiming that he had a calm and rational reason for doing it.

The prosecution, in this case, is trying to say 'First, no you didn't, and second, you are suffering from narcissitic personality disorder and are sick.  We want to help you.'

He is desperately trying to make sure he is declared sane so that his crimes can mean something, while the prosecution is saying he is sick, and needs help.

Quite a reversal from how this normally goes.

[Morwen Lagann]

A harsher punishment theoretically makes it easier to portray himself as a martyr for whatever cause he thinks he's serving - so he probably is operating on the assumption that if he can be declared sane, that the sentencing will be more likely to serve that end.

Not exactly a bad plan, if that's the intent. I just don't think it's likely to work. We'll find out I guess. :S

[Chell Charon]

A harsher punishment theoretically makes it easier to portray himself as a martyr for whatever cause he thinks he's serving - so he probably is operating on the assumption that if he can be declared sane, that the sentencing will be more likely to serve that end.

Not exactly a bad plan, if that's the intent. I just don't think it's likely to work. We'll find out I guess. :S

Actually, beind declared sane and judged as such is the lighter conviction, with a date for possible release (albeit a far one) and admission to the fact his logic for the deed was rational.

If judged insane and directed to mental asylum. It
1. Makes him just another nutjob with a nutty agenda.
2. He will not be released untill treating psychiatrist is willing to say he is no longer a threat to society.

[Morwen Lagann]

That seems kinda counter-intuitive... not sure I see the logic there, but I'm probably colored by our legal system. 

How does that work?

[Caellach Marellus]

That seems kinda counter-intuitive... not sure I see the logic there, but I'm probably colored by our legal system. 

How does that work?

You can't be a political martyr jailed for his beliefs if you aren't jailed and instead put down as a rambling lunatic who people should understand is very unwell and unable to think clearly.

People will follow a revolutionist, not a crazy guy who bounces off the padded walls in a strait jacket.

[Morwen Lagann]

... Right, which is what I said. I was asking why being judged sane would result in a lighter punishment.

[Mizhara]

It wouldn't. He's misunderstanding the way it works. If he's sane, he'll be convicted and sentenced to "forvaring" which is basically just being locked up until he's judged fit for release. It's basically ten years first, then a new checkup and extending it five years at a time until he's either "better" or dead. If he's not considered liable for his actions, it'll be the exact same result except it'll be called something different.

Normally, it'd actually have a practical difference, but this is kind of a special case. Which of the two he's sentenced to is mostly a matter of definitions and legitimization of his actions. The fact is, this trial barely even involves him, to be honest. It's about us as a society and how we deal with monsters rather than about the monster itself.