Backstage - OOC Forums
EVE-Online RP Discussion and Resources => EVE OOC Summit => Topic started by: Silas Vitalia on 02 Feb 2013, 15:09
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Some of my back and forth with Mekhana in her Patriotism thread got me wondering for the rest of you:
Why do your crews, corporation and alliance staff, and assorted baseliners work for you as a capsuleer?
Do you promise and deliver lavish rewards? Do you operate out of factional loyalty as a motivator for recruitment? I'm just curious if some of you have thought about these interactions and then what sorts of people end up flocking to your various banners.
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Great benefits, and excellent survivability for most of her crew positions. Full health, dental, life/death, and family coverage available. Excellent meal service on larger vessels, decent meals on smaller ones. Plus, she's not opposed to meeting her crew in person sometimes.
Simply put, working for Katrina is a good job.
Notable exception: "Doctrine" ships used in I-RED fleets use crews hired by I-RED/RDC, not by Katrina's people. Benefits are controlled by I-RED. Survivability is much lower. They rarely meet Katrina in person. Food is decent but standardized.
Oniseki Holdings employment is a whole different story, and varies from subsidiary to subsidiary.
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The Foundations' supplies nearly all the crew and staffing for its Capsuleer division. An exception is made for the Capsuleers who wish to have their own independent crews and not Foundations' provided ones. This is the only exception, though, as every other area is under Foundations' control. As for why Foundations crew works for the Capsuleers ... well, the demands of the Overwatch to meet the needs of the Nation. The rest is just bonus details.
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Kat more or less listed the reasons for the ones in Morwen's employ, word for word. Can't speak to the people working directly for other members of TYRIN, but Morwen probably enforces a company-wide policy or two (or three, or four) along these lines.
Not like we can't afford it... :P
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I know from my histories, Kane usually played with mercs. One with good reputations. Probably Legion, to be honest. Small, professional teams to handle ship work and dockside security. It was rarely exciting work, mission runs notwithstanding, but the paycheck was steady and Kane was always willing to negotiate "Death in the Line of Duty" clauses. Matoko is much the same. Mercs with good credentials for security, skilled labor drawn to the idea of working for ORE-aligned Capsuleers...
I guess the basic premise is that I treat it like a job. It's employment, plain and simple. So long as the terms are fair, the paychecks arrive on time, and potential employees agree to basic background checks, there hasn't yet been need for anything more stringent.
So yeah, pretty much echoing Katrina and Morwen here.
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Any number of reasons, for Streya. As she mostly does PvE activities for now, survival is essentially assured. And the pay is good in comparison to serving on a baseliner-ccommanded ship. Of course, Streya might give some ideological reasoning for people to join, but ALXVP is probably still quite tiny (if existent at all) on baseliner news feeds and the like. Perhaps once we get larger (and thus probably more famous in the baseliner world) word may get out that a transhumanist group is starting a colonization initiative. This could probably draw in people who want a fresh, new start on a colony. I could also see transhumanist ideology appealing to some, and maybe if we get big enough the corporation could offer people cloning services. I'll let Saede decide on that, though CCP's input as to how common it is for a baseliner to get cloning services would also be appreciated.
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Notable exception: "Doctrine" ships used in I-RED fleets use crews hired by I-RED/RDC, not by Katrina's people. Benefits are controlled by I-RED. Survivability is much lower. They rarely meet Katrina in person. Food is decent but standardized.
Disclaimers are great!
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I like to imagine that Gwen pays her crew in horrendously excessively compared to most out of a mix of sheer lack of true conception of just how much ISK is actually worth, and a fair bit Capsuleer-guilt from making so much to begin with. So spots likely fill up pretty fast. Shouldn't suggest that she's a wonderful and generous person, though - It's all about appeasing her own need for normality. The more her crew makes, the less of a big deal it makes her in comparison, etc.
She's likely a terrible "Captain", too. I can't imagine she interacts with her crews whatsoever, lest it remind her too directly of her status.
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Seriphyn's crew is mostly FedNav or otherwise military-affliated. His ship is run as a military vessel according to whatever naval traditions/protocols the Gallente have. Sort of provides some quirks for RP in that regard.
Though currently, the Destiny Foundation marauder of his is staffed by civilian employees with a large contingent of 18-25 year old volunteer aid workers.
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Katla has a lot of crew who have been with her for a very long time, partly due to her not flying much and consequently losing few ships. Some signed up for ideological reasons (most of those have been with her for years, since before she went openly Sansha). Some work for her because they have professional skills she is willing to pay well for. Some are victims of legal traps, and can't leave without serious legal repercussions.
The largest group, however - the majority, even - are juveniles, typically from broken homes or no homes at all, often with some kind of criminal record. She collects them through various agreements (none of them strictly illegal, but often creatively legal) with station authorities, typically using her old corporation, Astropolitan Front as...well, a front. Although she doesn't personally mingle much with them, the deal she offers isn't necessarily a bad one, given the often cutthroat realities in New Eden. She offers them food, a home, stability (rigorous discipline, in fact) and a free and solid education. In turn, her officers and she get to form the crew from an early age, both socially, educationally and ideologically. At the end of their education, they are well-trained and usually highly motivated. Though it can amount to brainwashing, no mind control technology is involved.
It takes time, of course, so in the event she acquires a vessel she expects to lose again quickly, or just one that's not very tough, she'll hire a disposable temp crew in the standard manner.
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When it comes to "disposable ships" (like for pvp), Lyn hires standard crew. Actually, that's not her that takes care of that, of course, considering the amount of people involved, especially when you lose several ships per day. Now, she is mostly done with that (not much pvp anymore for me now vOv).
For the rest, nobody ever really understood what makes the people hiring her crew hiring some people and not other. For her crew she remains a plain mystery they never even see, and even less, speak to. Since she tries to avoid social contact at all costs, is agoraphobic, and a lone soul, and despite her apparent indifference actually fears what people may think of her or see of her, then being the social misfit she is, she actively tries to hide from every eye, especially the eyes of strangers that roam in the entrails of her own ships. Which even seems more paradoxical since if she avoids them at all costs, they get even more foreign than they already are. Hell, even the people hiring people for her do not see her.
But all of this combined means that she unconsiously has created a whole aura of mystery around her persona, and baseliners, and even a lot of capsuleers only know of her what they see on the IGS, and do not even have anything else than her holo ID. That may actually be one of the factors attracting people to work for her in the first place, as weird as it may sound. They seem to work better for the ideal they make of her than what she really is. Somehow, her behavior, originally almost denying what her demi-god status means, has actually completely made it more real in the eyes of a lot of baseliners. She has become a demi god very hard to get a glimpse of, which is what most gods are often about anyway, some might say with a lot of irony.
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For Sakura? Simply put, glory. The same reason why some people join the military, to go places, see things, and blow things them up. After all, she does maintain a serious subcap fleet, numbering close to 100 hulls, almost all of which are either faction or T2. Apart from in-space battles, her tourney work has also gotten her a bit of a following (I'd imagine), and thus some people wanting to be apart of that.
Beyond those perks? She can be a bitch, but she's fair, and tries to look out for people under her watch wherever possible. That, and she doesn't like to suicide ships, nor does she get them blown up often, so I imagine that's certainly a big benefit!
As for her younger sisters, the ones that are still doing a lot of work in the empires... they're still sort of figuring out what they want to do in life, what they want to stand for, etc. As a result, I can see their crews being the sort of salaried people you'd see in office buildings around the world today, people who simply work for the money rather than any motivation. Especially since they almost never, ever die, and the space they work out of it relatively safe.
However, for the younger sisters, that status quo won't last forever. I thoroughly suspect that sometime down the road, one or more of them might find a cause worth really diving deep into, and that's when the people who are only around for the money are likely to GTFO and get replaced by motivated, belief-driven individuals.
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Pieter recently he lost several Wiyrkomi employees that he'd grown used to flying with and having as ground crew / security because of the dreaded internal audit.
Now he gets Kaalakiota trained crew and anciliary support personnel as assigned by Kaalakiota. He is a typical Civire boss who can often be found working with them when not in the pod. He gets takeout for his ground crew. He is part of a group of them who box, sometimes competitively with other Kaalakiota personnel. He helps change out sensor clusters, armour plating and other such tasks.
This tends to inspire a certain esprit de corps. He is interested in their needs and performances and, so far, his crew is small enough that he can maintain this.
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CTCS recruits crew from persons convinced by our persuasive theology.
For Covenant ships, I suspect it is possible that crew can be rapidly replaced, through use of the various technologies found in the Takmahl ruins, which included a lot to do with bioengineering and such.
It is possible that Covenant crew contain a number of Takmahl-style Bio-Droids, rather than normal people.
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I pay them >_>
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It's part of the Mithra's family business.
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Vincent uses slaves on most of his lower grade capsuleer combat ships. Most of them he aquires through the Cartel or raiding them himself from the remnants of those he attacks. They are property, and if they die nothing of value was lost. Despite this fact, some slaves are eager to sign on his ships - because he lets them work their way to freedom. Depending on the ship and relative danger each slave has to do tours of duty from one to five capsuleer combat incidents. If they survive he gives them three options; First one is to become a free citizen of Curse and he will set up you with a basic necessities for a lifetime. Second is to start a proper training to become an Angel proper, which is becoming fast the most popular one and has resulted in a strong cult following for him among the ranks of Archangels. Third one is to be returned to ones home sovereign state.
Reality of option three is however far more sinister. Kindness wasted on ingrates is kindness wasted more often than not, majority of the ones who pridefully wish to return to the Republic, State, Empire or other chosen faction end up in the chemical laboratories and bio-medical facilities of the Serpentis, never to be seen again. Some candidates are released back to where they wish, so they can spread the word of the Angels mercy and sow the seeds of dissent among the ranks of their respective factions.
Recently after his return in to the pod, people have slowly started to enlist in his service on their own. The disenfranchised, the outcasts and the people from the warzones who've lost all hope of stability and safety, signing up in hope for a new life, a new start in Curse, under the Angels wings.
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Vincent uses slaves on most of his lower grade capsuleer combat ships. Most of them he aquires through the Cartel or raiding them himself from the remnants of those he attacks. They are property, and if they die nothing of value was lost. Despite this fact, some slaves are eager to sign on his ships - because he lets them work their way to freedom. Depending on the ship and relative danger each slave has to do tours of duty from one to five capsuleer combat incidents. If they survive he gives them three options; First one is to become a free citizen of Curse and he will set up you with a basic necessities for a lifetime. Second is to start a proper training to become an Angel proper, which is becoming fast the most popular one and has resulted in a strong cult following for him among the ranks of Archangels. Third one is to be returned to ones home sovereign state.
Reality of option three is however far more sinister. Kindness wasted on ingrates is kindness wasted more often than not, majority of the ones who pridefully wish to return to the Republic, State, Empire or other chosen faction end up in the chemical laboratories and bio-medical facilities of the Serpentis, never to be seen again. Some candidates are released back to where they wish, so they can spread the word of the Angels mercy and sow the seeds of dissent among the ranks of their respective factions.
Recently after his return in to the pod, people have slowly started to enlist in his service on their own. The disenfranchised, the outcasts and the people from the warzones who've lost all hope of stability and safety, signing up in hope for a new life, a new start in Curse, under the Angels wings.
This is great stuff...
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Vieve no longer has personal employees. All of them either work for her husband Jake, or Omerta Syndicate itself.
Celeste's core staff are all related to her, though an outsider likely wouldn't realize this, because they look Civire, and she appears Gallente. They receive generous compensation, responsibilities commensurate with their competence, and a guaranteed clone contract. They also have the right to argue with her, assuming she tells them what she's up to. Her other employees are in the main contract workers. One (her personal trainer) is on long term loan from an associate.
Almost the entirety of Maris' crew is on long term loan, including her crew chief (who usually seems to report to her) and her security chief/bodyguard (who most certainly does not report to her). The loan of the crew allegedly reflects an altruistic interest in the work she does for the Sisters of EVE via Ataraxia Pharmacies, though she's not convinced of that, and neither is her security chief. They do their job well, and so far not a single piece of cargo or a single refugee life she's transported has ever been lost -- despite way too damn many low sec runs in a mundane cargo ship -- so she's not complaining.
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Vincent uses slaves on most of his lower grade capsuleer combat ships. Most of them he aquires through the Cartel or raiding them himself from the remnants of those he attacks. They are property, and if they die nothing of value was lost. Despite this fact, some slaves are eager to sign on his ships - because he lets them work their way to freedom. Depending on the ship and relative danger each slave has to do tours of duty from one to five capsuleer combat incidents. If they survive he gives them three options; First one is to become a free citizen of Curse and he will set up you with a basic necessities for a lifetime. Second is to start a proper training to become an Angel proper, which is becoming fast the most popular one and has resulted in a strong cult following for him among the ranks of Archangels. Third one is to be returned to ones home sovereign state.
Reality of option three is however far more sinister. Kindness wasted on ingrates is kindness wasted more often than not, majority of the ones who pridefully wish to return to the Republic, State, Empire or other chosen faction end up in the chemical laboratories and bio-medical facilities of the Serpentis, never to be seen again. Some candidates are released back to where they wish, so they can spread the word of the Angels mercy and sow the seeds of dissent among the ranks of their respective factions.
Recently after his return in to the pod, people have slowly started to enlist in his service on their own. The disenfranchised, the outcasts and the people from the warzones who've lost all hope of stability and safety, signing up in hope for a new life, a new start in Curse, under the Angels wings.
Love this, deliciously typical Angel behavior, where the 'neutral' option of going home really is not neutral at all - it's most often a total betrayal of trust - as befitting a tried and true Angel mobster :twisted:
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For PvE ops (read, missions), Vikarion has an old and standard crew. He doesn't particularly know them, but he's comfortable with them, and since he (almost) never loses a ship, pay is somewhat lower. For PvP ops, Vikarion does his level best to hire Gallente nationals, since he tends to fly ships with low survival rates and he tends to fly them until they explode (destroyers, large frigates, cruisers). Such crew are paid well, and anyone who performs exceptionally well is referred to a State Mega for possible employment. Aside from that, he doesn't care - not complete apathy, it merely doesn't enter into his mind unless someone mentions it.
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Thanks, glad you guys liked it :)
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Anslo hired baseliners on ship and planet side. His PI facilities are people run because he knows them well enough to trust them. These were people that were sort of cast aside for whatever reason, and he took them in to give em a job and a home. He makes sure that they're WELL out of harms way as well.
The club he owns is employed with his closest baseliner friends who run it the majority of the time he isn't there. If they need isk to keep the business going, he tosses stupid amounts of planetary currency to make sure they stay afloat and employed. He also prefers hanging out with regular humans compared to most capsuleers he's met. MOST anyway, not all.
In terms of ships, he's very careful about it. He tried to run a minimal crew and not loose anyway. If he feels things are going south, he orders a general evac instead of forcing everyone to stay and fight to the death. He knows that he can be resurrected, but that baseliners can't. It's also why he shied away from war and pvp now. During his hiatus from egg life, he learned a lot about baseliners and their hundreds of cultures. Because of that, he treasures each life in his life and would sooner give up his own immortality than allow his own people to die wantonly.
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Because of (http://www.evejita.com/ItemsImg/icons/64_64/icon46_08.png) and (http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/graphics/icons/64/icon100_08.png)
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Forenote: With all the writing I am doing on this lately, I think I'll go consolidate this into one place sooner or later.
Now: Esna's staff and crews are a combination of many things, with a strict hierarchy in place between three distinct castes - a reflection, in many ways, of the Empire he grew up in.
At the top are the "Determined" - this caste forms the crew on his core vessels, officers on less important ones, and the overseers and chiefs of his facilities. They are people who show religious, social, or personal conviction for joining his forces, and can thus be relied on to 'do the right thing' for more reasons than pure money. While, of course, the enticements of good treatment, decent pay, and care for family are a draw to many, it is only those who choose to fight for a higher cause that fit into this first group. Notably, Esna is perfectly happy to abuse a grey zone in the laws regarding Holders and starships: Although a Holder is forbidden from raising his own space fleet, the rules regarding forming special deals with certain "private military contractors" are rather more nebulous. So what if the contractor happens to be solely owned and financed by a certain capsuleer... in this way, Esna is able to funnel commoner recruits and contracted slaves into his crews to augment those who volunteer on their own. In the case of slaves in this 'caste', duty on a combat vessel is optional, but explained as a likely faster track to freedom or a comfier position.
The second slot are true mercenaries: Those whose only attractions to service with Esna are glory, pay, and the thrill of fighting under a capsuleer. These are also funneled through a private military contractor Esna sponsors for the sake of simply keeping all the recruits in one pool and one system. Unless they happen to start showing signs of developing a sense of faith or conscience, they are generally end up assigned to non-critical positions in facilities and basic duties aboard some vessels.
Finally, a small number of slaves are funneled into his crew as penitents. Captured pirate crews, Blood Raiders, or terrorists who have already committed crimes and whose hatred of the Amarr is judged to be so great they will surely strike again, these are used as a resource for crewing the most dangerous vessels - ships whose lifespans following undocking can be measured in hours. Most do not survive, but the ones who do somehow manage to live through enough 'runs' are eventually transferred to some other duty where they will serve out the remainder of their lives. Esna doesn't like to talk about these.
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I'm going to say that a large part of Lhara's staff are recently reintegrated former slaves. This would mostly be for psychological reasons, for even after gaining their freedom, many Matari would still be 'wired' to think and act in an Amarrian chain of command. As a former 'administrator' of sorts while she was a slave herself, Lhara understands this structure and is herself predisposed to working in it.
These are the kinds of people she seeks out for her own benefit, but also as a way to 'transition' these people from Amarrian structures to the life of a free individual (or at least that's what she tells the TLF recruitment pool).
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Most of Sai's crews were standard hires, people who said they wanted to serve on a starship and didn't mind the danger. Sai paid them the going rate, and maybe a bit above, but tried to keep away from them, since she knew sooner or later, they were going to die. Given her nature this didn't last long, and she ended up gettign hurt several times as she got close to them and then the ship they were on blew up. Still there are a few who have survived and worked their way up in the ranks, and these people have taken up a position something like a senior non-com, the experienced vet acting as filter between the general crew, and the officers (in this case Sai herself).
The exception to this is the number of mercs, nationals, terrorists, and marines she has captured or picked up from missions over the years. Since almost all of these have been from "enemy" factions, as she takes them in, she gives them a choice. Work for her, or step out the airlock (either to whatever local laws they broke, or empty space). To date, no one given the option of breathing the viod has taken it, and most of the people who have stayed on with Sai are loyal to her, if only because they see her as the one who has their lives in her hands.
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Jev's spent a lot of time hand-nurturing reliable support staff and an intelligence apparatus. Her actual crew, although they get good training and are carefully vetted, is a lot more loosely attached.. let's just say they get excellent death benefits.
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let's just say they get excellent death benefits.
Are they siphoned back to Jev through fraudulent front companies, fine print, and red tape?
Can't be true Caldari unless death benefits are also a source of profit you know.
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Look, they're paid out as trust funds paying out gradually over time, without interest accruing.. for the beneficiaries, at least.. and it's all perfectly legal, let me assure you.
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and it's all perfectly legal, let me assure you.
Hey, so long as it's all legal and filed in the proper archives in triplicate then it's all good.
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Some of my back and forth with Mekhana in her Patriotism thread got me wondering for the rest of you:
Why do your crews, corporation and alliance staff, and assorted baseliners work for you as a capsuleer?
Do you promise and deliver lavish rewards? Do you operate out of factional loyalty as a motivator for recruitment? I'm just curious if some of you have thought about these interactions and then what sorts of people end up flocking to your various banners.
Technically, the employees and slaves on Makkal's ships aren't her's, they're her clan's.
If slaves, they don't have much choice. If commoners, they're born into an environment where their friends and family serve the clan. It's possible for some of them to be socially mobile enough to leave the clan's service, but it's unusual, so working for a favored daughter on a spaceship is a fairly prestigious position. If Caldari specialists, I assume they're looking to move into Kingdom citizenship or possibly they're 'leased' workers from KK.
A handful of capsuleers have gifted Makkal slaves, but if they're meant for domestic work, she keeps them off the ship. I suspect it is a faux pas to get a slave blown up only a few months after you're given them as a gift.
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Pay is good. Atmosphere is relaxed. Safety record is outstanding.
Some of the crew get bored, however, as the ships don't leave station as often as people expected when they signed on.
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The vast majority of Shin's ships see very little use, and maintain only skeleton crews at competitive rates. Combat ships are staffed with highly paid, highly skilled contractors, and she takes pains to ensure that survivability for these contractors is as good as money can buy - she's wealthy enough to afford it, it keeps her crew's mind on their jobs during combat, and she feels that having this reputation attracts more skilled crew.
There is also a contingent of scientists and biotechs who are refugees from the collapse of the Omerta Syndicate black medical programs. They worked for Omerta largely because of the pay and their own flexible morality. They continue to work for her for the same reasons.
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Pay is good. Atmosphere is relaxed. Safety record is outstanding.
Some of the crew get bored, however, as the ships don't leave station as often as people expected when they signed on.
Pretty much this. And back when I was still racing, a chance for 15 minutes of fame.
Also, corporation employees with permanent contracts (of which there are few these days) receive pretty much anything a baseliner could desire.
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Historically, Aria offered high pay, great bennies, high selection criteria (having worked for her looks nice on a resume'), and excellent life insurance.
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Another post that had me thinking. So I wrote a fiction thing - it's here (http://lariaraven.blogspot.co.uk/2013/04/crew.html)
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Another excellent story, Laria.
Silver's crew probably work for him because the pay is good, and as podder jobs go, it is extremely safe (since he almost never undocks). I do have a ship in Vale of the Silent - a mining Thorax - whose skeleton crew has almost certainly created a shadow society in the 10 years since I last visited it.
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Because they're poor, alternative employment opportunities are scarce out here, and though my wages are nothing they can retire on, I give a healthy bonus for a very successful night or if I feel they were particularly on the ball during an engagement. Also, I keep my escape pod systems well-maintained, which is important.
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Though currently, the Destiny Foundation marauder of his is staffed by civilian employees with a large contingent of 18-25 year old volunteer aid workers.
Can't believe I missed this the first time through, Monthy Python reference?