How would you make your character (A) react when another character (B) brings up ICly something on which you as a player (p-A) is in fundamental disagree with the other player behind (p-B) ?
Like the most stupid example but likely to happen :
Character B : "What do you think of soft clones ?"
Character A : "Soft clones do not exist"
Character B : "Of course they exist, I have several of them, as well as saves in an implant"
Character A : "Liar"
=> OOC drama.
Ok there, fine, players A and B start to ignore each other, as well as their characters.
I think the simplest solution is to not bring it up. This is of course a very 'meh' solution, but it works well in a lot of cases. To give a bit of an example, Saede and Ava have a lot of very fundamental differences in perspective surrounding religion, philosophy and Minmatar society. Saede's solution to avoiding conflict with Ava is to not bring it up, thus starting arguments. Anther example, my father is a republican, I'm a (dirty) liberal, and we don't remotely see eye to eye on it, but we still manage to peacefully interact as long as we don't discuss politics. So if you have a fundemental disagreement with a player on the nature of canon, you can just avoid talking about it and starting unneeded fights. To solve you example then, the best solution would have been for player B to not bring it up in the first place when they knew it had to potential to create conflict. This isn't an amazing solution I'll admit. The better solution would be for the players to come to some sort of consensus, but when that's not possible, just choosing not to force the issue isn't a terrible way to go about it.
The law of solipsism, as I said above. I do not find it especially satisfactory, but we have to deal with it yes.
Let's take another example. Someone says his character B has a special ability that you disagree with OOCly.
Character A and B take part in an event. Player B starts to use his ability even knowing you disagree with it, after all, he is free to have his fun too, which is legitimate.
How are you supposed to explain that to yourself, and your character ? How to react ICly after something like this happens ?
I'm not sure what you might be referring to here, but lets go with a relatively extreme example of someone deciding they're a wizard and starting to sling magic around everywhere. The solution to this is really just, ignore it, don't let it effect your character. In most cases people won't force something on your character, and if they do you can call them out for the more relevant OOC issue of them godmodding your character, then of the issue of whatever it is they're doing. If they're not actually effecting your character, then its pretty easy to just let them have their weird fun and just let it go. Again, its not an amazing solution, but there are solutions.
I can just be "I will kill myself and soft clone !", and then "No you don't". Then you see the character dying in front of you, and since you don't agree with soft clones, seeing him coming back again a few minutes later literally breaks the rationality of your world.
It's not necessarily about godmodding special powers on your character, it can just be using a player creation that directly conflicts with the rationality of your own universe. It's extremely irritating when it happens. Especially because it's a player made thing without any place in the Canon.
The main issue is that the more a player creation start to invent new, universal things, or take them as facts in a setting where it's not only between character A and B, but a whole world, then that player starts to stomp on the RP of another player.
I will not lie and say that these days I do not feel especially good when I see all those sciencey new technologies burgeoning like flowers everywhere, arising from the needs of players to find new stuff and create their own little special thing.
And what if something like that then starts to bleed over something like SeyCon ? If a player comes up happily and starts to explain his own new technology ? Yeah, you can ignore it, but some will not and you will be left torn between people happily playing with it and some not so much. And eventually, you just start to feel more and more oppressed. You start to feel that your own little meddling with PF, trying to be respectful of the Canon and not creating wild fantasies, but just going with minor details or just using your own version of an existing device, is rather vain and bland. Then you ask yourself "Why bother ?"
It generates drama, or just divide people, and I find it unhealthy on the long run. Especially as it creates a race for "the new awesome idea that is better than the last tech created by another player !" "but wait, I can do better !" and so on and so on.
What is so limitating in the PF to begin with ? We have plenty of tools to play with. Eve PF is incredibly dense for a MMO.
But let's take it in another way : it is generally assumed that the more you create something to be universal, or well spread, the more the probability to be called godmodder increases. Saying that you invented the apocalypse battleship, is an extreme of that. The other extreme, the one generally assumed to be positive, is basic world building with very regional player made creations. Saying that your own little native town on planet X is like this or that, and that it's like that because *insert good explanation showing that you did your homework to insert your little town into the Matari world the planet is located" all the better.
Why not keeping that rule for technology too ? Why trying at all costs to invent new tech, rather than just taking what we have in PF and create your own flavour of it ? Drones exist. Gallente are libertarian fashionista. Then they must use Rouge Drones ! And Whore drones ! Or whatever floats your boat.
Technology now. Clones are created with biomass. Biomass is rather central in Eve setting. If we can create blank corpses, what prevents people in some twisted corners of space to do the same, implant them with basic electronic implants or control, and turn them into flesh puppets able to do basic or elaborated moves through a computer ?
I mean, why trying to insert stuff from other universes when we already have stuff from... New Eden ?
A well know and discussed case now.
Player A blows up player's B ship in space. There is nothing to loot, but player A claims that he abducted player B crew as part of his RP.
Player B disagrees OOCly and claims ICly that never happened.
This is a pretty clear case of outright godmodding and should rightly be called out as such.
Well obviously it is not shared by everybody. Silas does it, Sansha loyalists also deal in that sort of things. I am not saying that they are doing it wrong or right. I am just saying that they have a point too. if that is godmodding... Well, there was other discussions about that already, and it is not what i'm interested in.
What i'm interested in is the possibility that people can disagree over it OOCly. So yes, they will ignore each other. Until it eventually bleeds over in the universe around and start to affect other people that you will meet too. Eventually if you have to cut yourself from everyone that got touched by it because you try to ignore it, you will soon get completely blind to everything happening around. It would be like adding 75% of a channel to ignore list and then trying to sort out what is being said on said channel.
Of course though, I think that I took a bad example with Sansha or Blooders abducting crews as I think it would be a shame not to play that since it's what happens in PF after all. I would be rather tempted to say that it's people not rolling with it that are godmodding their way out of the setting... It's a complicated issue.
Player A doesn't care and sells those slaves to someone else, player C, who starts to do all sort of stuff with them.
This escalates further with not only godmodding but another player (C) being party to the godmodding. If I were player A in this case, I would contact player C and see if something couldn't be worked out with them. Godmodding like this is only really legitimate if other players identify it as legitimate. If player C doesn't go along with it, the buck stops there. This is a case where the community shouldn't be supporting/endorsing godmodding in that manor, its poor form.
But is it still godmodding when it's literally part of the setting ? Probably since you are dealing with someone else characters. But as I said above, the other player just feels like trying to godmod out of it as well.
It's the kind of situation that only the two players can sort out between themselves, but if it does not happen, then it creates divides. Even if you can still get out of it with the law of solipsism, OOC scars remain.
Eventually player A can still claim it's fake, that it's other people and not his crew and it will be up to everyone ICly to believe him or not. But it will still make a lot of OOC drama behind. That's basic godmodding, even out of good intentions.
At best it will lead to disagreeable solipsism, at worst both versions of what happened are conflicting. Most of the time it will just be 2 versions of what happened conflicting but as they are exposed ICly, everyone can ICly deny them, so it's fine. But what isn't is the OOC behind.
It is godmodding, I agree. But its not caused by having disagreements about the canon, its outright infringing on another player's existence without their consent, and that's not okay. If someone came to me and said they wanted to capture my crew after they'd blown up my ship, I'd probably go along with it. But if they just went ahead and did it without asking, I'd consider that godmodding and (I think rightly) call them out on it. To give another example. If someone wanted to turn their character into a suicide bomber and blow my character up with it, if they talked about it with me beforehand, I would probably agree to it and help them sort something cool out (because yeah! roleplay conflicts), but if they just ran up to my character somewhere random, and tried that, I'd remove my character from the channel, and again, call them out on it OOCly. That's really in my mind the best way to deal with that sort of godmodding, don't legitimize it by responding to it or giving it the time of day ICly. Its an OOC issue and should be treated as such.
Then yes, of course, it would be better if abducters always asked before doing it. Question of good form, perhaps.
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Topic: Clone backups, and the IC/OOC barrier problem (Read 9012 times)