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[orange]

So... lets talk about other infomorphs as well.

Frankly, capsuleers aren't it.  DUST is coming and even though it is really just a respawn mechanic, it is cloning on "walking about" basis.

In theory, an industrial/trading character could potentially stay in one station just in his pod, and make billions.  No threat of podding, none.  These infomorphs literally could be working 8 to 4, having dinner with the family and then playing a very complicated game with the other informorph next door.

[Aria Jenneth]

The PF isn't consistent. Or rather, it's consistently inconsistent: "Xenocracy" and the Incarna trailer are the two primary sources that seem to suggest that (some) capsuleers don't "get out much."

Otherwise, there are capsuleers walking all over the chronicles, from Tibus Heth's background to the odd Federal function. Don't have time to look them up, presently. Planets are probably kind of rare. But, there's no reason you couldn't catch a shuttle down from the customs platform.

It seems to me that PF is trying to get a head start on the obvious question of why not everybody is going to be getting much use out of Incarna: those who don't are full-time eggers.

Probably, then, the correct answer is the most obvious one: glamorous walker-about-in-stations or permanent egg inhabitant, it's a matter of personal preference.

[Verone]

The whole subject is a double edged blade in my opinion.

Even though there are some capsuleers that feel the need to rarely ever leave the capsule, there's a rich history of a lot of them doing so in prime fiction. Many corporate CEOs, officers and important dignitaries do so on a regular basis and personally I can see why.

It's not really that bad of a process to do so (it was explained in quite a lot of detail toward the back end of The Burning Life), and given the presence of soft-scan technology and insanely advanced medical processes, plus the social status of the capsuleer they remain insanely well protected from accidents and attempted ill will from anyone (the transition from the 'normal' decks of a space station to the capsuleer's domain and the insane security involved is also referenced in The Burning Life).

Money and power go hand in hand, and one thing always follows; expensive tastes. Capsuleers for the best part are egotistic, arrogant and look down on the 'little people' given their social status when it suits them, no matter how hard they try to be nice people.

The way I see it, is that the number of capsuleers in Eve stands at probably around 5 million, when you include all characters; alts, mains, the thousands of corporate officers, ISD members, high level agents and the like. Out of those 5 million, how many are roleplayers out of character? A few thousand. How many of those step out of capsule on a regular basis? It dwindles the numbers down to a TINY proportion, not even 0.000000000001% of the population of New Eden.

We might, as capsuleers see it as commonplace to see each other in a bar or whatever, we have separate areas of every station we choose to dock at, and we're generally segregated from the rest of the plebs who inhabit most stations. This works to the advantage of an egger who decides to get out of the capsule to conduct business. Very few things are as scary for the general population as meeting a capsuleer, a demi god with a corporate army and the most advanced technology in the cluster behind them.  I should imagine that 99.99% of the time, business would go very smoothly for an egger with that kind of intimidation.

As for implants and everyone looking pretty, given the prevalence such advanced technology, and of equipment on the scale of nano-technology I've never seen any reason why implants have to be visible and covering a person's skin, face or eye. Some capsuleers might like it, for that extra look. Sure, interfaces such as the capsuleer's neural jack would be present, and visible unless covered with hair or synthetic skin.

I like that you've brought up such a fundamental subject and kicked off a  debate about it to be honest. I think that both sides of the fence are valid viewpoints, and there's nothing to stop a capsuleers de-egging and stretching their legs if they want to.

I do agree however that it seems a bit silly that the average egger would regularly get involved in planetside management on a personal level, and fly down there just to see on person and have a meeting given the technology at their disposal. Sure, they'd check on things from time to time I guess, but nothing regular in my eyes. As for military actions on the ground, I can't see an egger getting involved with this kind of thing either, unless it was personal and they wanted to make a point.

As for planetside visits in general, a lot of eggers are born planetside, and I should imagine that every so often they'd get the urge to return and take a breath of fresh air and chill. Nostalgia very rarely fades.

[Havohej]

It's not really that bad of a process to do so (it was explained in quite a lot of detail toward the back end of The Burning Life)

Can someone please transcribe with a spoiler tag for the cheap and poor amongst us who are waiting for the paperback?  I'd like to see this

[Seriphyn]

Why is no one paying attention to my points regarding Her Painted Selves lol?

But yeah, what Verone said is why I find the whole teenage girl, space lesbian thing REALLY immersion breaking.

And skin patches over neural sockets ftw...eh yeah

[Ken]

waiting for the paperback

My copy is paperback... Not available yet where you're living, Havohej?

[Wanoah]

I do agree however that it seems a bit silly that the average egger would regularly get involved in planetside management on a personal level, and fly down there just to see on person and have a meeting given the technology at their disposal. Sure, they'd check on things from time to time I guess, but nothing regular in my eyes. As for military actions on the ground, I can't see an egger getting involved with this kind of thing either, unless it was personal and they wanted to make a point.

Yeah, it does seem silly, but then so does flying on a private jet to a meeting with someone when you could just use the phone, email or video conferencing or w/e. It seems that however good the technology gets, people still put a lot of emphasis on doing business in person even if it is ludicrously expensive. People, eh. vOv

[Ulphus]

I do agree however that it seems a bit silly that the average egger would regularly get involved in planetside management on a personal level, and fly down there just to see on person and have a meeting given the technology at their disposal. Sure, they'd check on things from time to time I guess, but nothing regular in my eyes. As for military actions on the ground, I can't see an egger getting involved with this kind of thing either, unless it was personal and they wanted to make a point.

Yeah, it does seem silly, but then so does flying on a private jet to a meeting with someone when you could just use the phone, email or video conferencing or w/e. It seems that however good the technology gets, people still put a lot of emphasis on doing business in person even if it is ludicrously expensive. People, eh. vOv

I've been to management courses which emphasise that a huge amount of information about what a person is thinking and how sincere they are is conveyed via body-language. That you can lose 50% of the information by calling someone on the phone instead of talking face to face, perhaps 80% via email.

In an environment with few legal sanctions for someone that rips you off, being able to meet someone face to face when deciding whether to trust them in a business deal might be surprisingly common. Especially if we have real-time video manipulation designed to hide "tells" and be bland.

[Seriphyn]

The justification for meeting someone, also, can be used within EVE devices. CONCORD monitors all FTL communications, right? You could even say that comms aren't secure, and that meeting face-to-face is far more safer.

EDIT: However, eliminating combat RP and relinquishing that to staff I think limits a lot of RP possibilities....just sitting around and talking...

[Havohej]

waiting for the paperback

My copy is paperback... Not available yet where you're living, Havohej?

Might be - I haven't checked.  Empyrean Age took forever so I just figured Burning Life would, too

[Casiella]

EDIT: However, eliminating combat RP and relinquishing that to staff I think limits a lot of RP possibilities....just sitting around and talking...

Do you refer to in-space combat, or dirtside? Because I tend to think of generals of rank similar to Seriphyn's as directing combat, not getting out on the front lines and throwing ammo around themselves.

[Aria Jenneth]

EDIT: However, eliminating combat RP and relinquishing that to staff I think limits a lot of RP possibilities....just sitting around and talking...

Do you refer to in-space combat, or dirtside? Because I tend to think of generals of rank similar to Seriphyn's as directing combat, not getting out on the front lines and throwing ammo around themselves.

I heartily concur.

There's no reason, at all, to put a pod captain in the line of dirtside fire.

Mind you, that's not to say that a pod captain wouldn't be so gung-ho as to put himself in the line of fire anyway. You're a multimillionaire (at least) demigod privateer. Who, exactly, is going to tell you "no?"

The place where I feel the line is crossed is where said flyboy-turned-ground-pounder makes some claim to having a truly substantial effect on ground combat. The ground simply is not a capsuleer's strong suite. At most, a capsuleer might make a good officer-- interchangeable, however, with any number of other good officers, which, again, makes putting one on or near the planet-or-stationside front lines a foolish choice. Out-of-pod just is not where a capsuleer shines.

The fact that something is a foolish choice doesn't mean that it won't get made, mind you.

And even without that, there's nothing saying that "capsuleers never get in fights." Eve is the sort of universe where it behooves you to carry a sidearm....

[Kaleigh Doyle]

Heh, I leave this thread for a few days and it goes to Quebec, gets a tattoo and comes back with pink hair.

First of all, I never said pilots out of their pods was blasphemy. People tend to take the extremes and argue against them like it was my main point, and that is certainly NOT it. I can see many circumstances where pilots might interact out of pod, but much of what I see done is...well, immersion breaking for me. But whatever, it's just my opinion. I just discuss what I see and talk about what I want.

As for the bit about this:

The pod, as great as it is from a game mechanic point of view, is terrible for storytelling. It removes the captain-crew dynamic that would make for compelling characterisation and smooth exposition. It removes any sense of dramatic tension. There's not much at stake - least of all a captain's life - and we are all stupidly rich, so losing your stuff doesn't really cut it either.

...I disagree entirely. If anything I think it gives us an opportunity to approach a perspective that is innately outside our perspective, a concept for which roleplay was originally intended. Roleplay is about experiencing the different, and we shouldn't be afraid to tackle something just because it rests outside our comfort zone.

Popular roleplay concepts like White Wolf's Vampire series (space vampires, lol) has been exploring the concept of what makes us human (in nature) and how extraordinary circumstances gleans new perspective that many would consider 'inhuman' and alien. When you take away the natural limitations that define a human, despite their continuing habit to BE human, do they gradually accept their life as demi-god pilots with near limitless resources or try to retain their humanity, pretending that nothing has changed?

Personally, I find that kind of interaction interesting. What kind of impact does this 'alien' lifestyle have on ordinary people and how do they evolve as people (in mind and body)?

[Lillith Blackheart]

I'm just going to stress that the various chrons about the pod implants themselves and the backstory surrounding them make it evident that long-term interfacing with the pod without breaks causes deliterious effects, especially nausea.

That might be something of merit to ponder as to why pilots spend time out of the pod.

[Mebrithiel]

I'm just going to stress that the various chrons about the pod implants themselves and the backstory surrounding them make it evident that long-term interfacing with the pod without breaks causes deliterious effects, especially nausea.

That might be something of merit to ponder as to why pilots spend time out of the pod.

And here I thought that was just CCP's way of telling us it's healthy to take a break and get some fresh air once in a while 

I'd agree with what Kaleigh says, but no matter what mess pods do to a persons head, I think there's still too much instinct in a human and their desire to meet and greet where necessary and walk around. They did it before they were pilots and old habits die hard.

On the space-lesbian note, it might be a good pointer that Kaleigh is Gallente for one thing...

Secondly, I'm sure sex and sexual orientation is something that needs to be looked at more. Do pilots distance themselves from the physical act because they prefer the use of machines and tools? Or is that area just an inherently tough place to RP responsibly? Does fantisizing it make it easier to do? And just what situation is sexuality at 24 odd thousand years in the future?

Topic split on that?