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[Makkal]

I'm digging this up from a moderated thread because I think it's something worth tackling.

Morwen Lagann...

    I won't speak for the other moderators, but apparently it's flown way over people's heads yet again: I elected to post, rather than even consider taking moderation action of any sort, because moderating in this thread would have constituted a conflict of interest, having been the target of some of his exceptionally far-beyond-the-line-of-acceptable behavior.

Lyn Farel...

Aren't you sure you are not overreacting that a bit ? I mean, it was gross and all, but it was not even directed at someone real, just at a fictional character, and it did not even happen to her... It was just.... threats... Like so many of them.

Maybe it's just about sensibilities I guess... I find it really poor taste myself and probably offensive to read, but well... It's not like there are no people in New Eden ready to trash talk like that at every opportunity, since it's the same IRL...

Good call CCP mods decided to snip it though. It was definitely out of the line as stated in the IGS rules.

When people react negatively to an IC post, there can be a number of factors they're reacting to. It's easy to mix them up because many times you get 'this is bad' without a great deal of clarification as to why it's bad.

So let's dig into the specifics of why I found Slaver Filth's post problematic.

1. This is a public area - What you RP in private is largely your own business. EVE RP can go to some dark places, and that's fine, but the IGS is not an appropriate locale to go into detail for some of those activities.

2. Wow, that's gross - Players have limits to what they're comfortable with and we should respect one another's limits. 'Graphic depiction of how I'd like your character to be raped by a slaver hound' is going to be outside of the bounds of a lot people. Others might be okay with it, but if an individual player isn't, they have every right to voice disapproval.

Again, this doesn't mean that such things are never acceptable, but that acceptability happens within a private venue with another player who is comfortable with that sort of interaction.

[Morwen Lagann]

That's pretty much my take on it. I've definitely done some stuff in private RP, both in EVE and elsewhere, that really, really should not be posted elsewhere (with the possible exception of a personal blog or whatever) - not just because of it being private, but because of the content possibly pushing the limits of reasonable (or, perhaps, even pushing the limits of what's technically allowed in EVE according to the TOS/EULA).

It's very, very important to remember, though, that regardless of our perspectives on the matter, the final arbiter on these matters is CCP, and their word is law - the posts in question were reported by at least one person (myself; I think Katrina reported one of them) and the CCL/ISD folks on duty agreed they were in violation of the forum rules and took action accordingly. Whether anyone else thought the posts were worth reporting or not was irrelevant - it was the interpretation of the rules by their moderating staff that was important; just like how it works here or on pretty much any other forum.

It doesn't really matter what we consider to be appropriate or acceptable within the context of the official EVE forums as far as the existence of a post goes - it's what the rules say that matters there - but we of course have the right to make our own judgements based on whether the 'appropriateness' of a given poster's content will determine the sort of response we make to them or not.

[Caellach Marellus]

I suppose we don't bring up the golden dildo episode as an exception to the rule? 

[Morwen Lagann]

I suppose we don't bring up the golden dildo episode as an exception to the rule? 

Hey. That shit was a) hilarious and b) it was cut because I linked to a non-EVE product on a forum that wasn't allowed to do that on.

Also, I never claimed to be perfect. It's the Gallente half. >.>

[Lyn Farel]

I would respectfully ask you not to turn my post into some kind of advocate of what Slaver Filth did, or a strawman to explain your position. That was not my point and I feel that discussing about that with my post as an introductory quote is highly misleading and distort its content, making it say things I never said.

Thank you in advance.

NB : maybe i'm reading it like I shouldn't, but it does sound extremely wrong to me.

[Morwen Lagann]

Your post implies that you think I was overreacting to his posts. (I happen to disagree.)

I believe that is what Makkal was trying to point at by quoting it. She seems to think that a) it was extremely inappropriate, and b) I wasn't overreacting in my response. If I'm reading her right.

[Lyn Farel]

I also happen to think his post was extremely inappropriate, you just seemed to react in an extremely personal way that prevented you to even consider the other side of the argument. I can admit that my post was a little too ambiguous, probably, but there it is, it's what I meant. :/

[Louella Dougans]

they were also using text formatting to evade the forum rules regarding posting obscenities and insults, directed at specific users.

[Makkal]

I suppose we don't bring up the golden dildo episode as an exception to the rule? 

Golden dildo?

I sense an Amarr joke in the wings.

I would respectfully ask you not to turn my post into some kind of advocate of what Slaver Filth did, or a strawman to explain your position. That was not my point and I feel that discussing about that with my post as an introductory quote is highly misleading and distort its content, making it say things I never said.

Thank you in advance.

NB : maybe i'm reading it like I shouldn't, but it does sound extremely wrong to me.

I'm sorry. I didn't mean to suggest that you were okay with his post.

[Morwen Lagann]

I suppose we don't bring up the golden dildo episode as an exception to the rule? 

Golden dildo?

I sense an Amarr joke in the wings.

Thgil was basically waving an e-peen around on the IGS without any substance to back it up, and Morwen crudely told her that if she wanted to wave a dick around she really ought to get one to wave around, and then offered a few suggestions with links to images.

Apparently 24k gold-plated dildos and vibrators are a thing IRL.

[Lyn Farel]

I suppose we don't bring up the golden dildo episode as an exception to the rule? 

Golden dildo?

I sense an Amarr joke in the wings.

I would respectfully ask you not to turn my post into some kind of advocate of what Slaver Filth did, or a strawman to explain your position. That was not my point and I feel that discussing about that with my post as an introductory quote is highly misleading and distort its content, making it say things I never said.

Thank you in advance.

NB : maybe i'm reading it like I shouldn't, but it does sound extremely wrong to me.

I'm sorry. I didn't mean to suggest that you were okay with his post.

Don't worry, I overreacted after what has become the other topic. It's an interesting point to bring up nevertheless, though I'm not completely at ease with it since I disagree with what was said just above, but i'm too tired to create another argument yet again... :/

Edit : to hell with it anyway, I find it hard to believe that when it's someone like slaver filth breaking the IGS rules with highly offensive wordings there is such a fuss, while when it's Morwen making similar allusions to Thgil, or Graelyn making the exact same thing to Dea, nobody cares, or just faints not to care.

I understand there is a difference of scale involved, and that Slaver Filth also was godmodding stuff besides (with the eve wiki and all), but that shouldnt be taken into consideration since it's another issue entirely and relevant to godmodding and not offensive wordings. I have seen countless sexual harrassing allusions on the IGS, a good deal done by a lot of characters on this forum, and I don't really care since it's IC. And some of them are rather funny (like the last one done by Graelyn), but is the funny side of it the criteria telling if it's offensive or not ? If it's funny, it's ok ? And is it funny to everyone ? I bet it's not for the targeted people.

I also can understand that kind of things it will probably ruffle sensibilities for some people and that CCP chooses to act upon it when reported. It just makes me think there is a lot of hypocrisy involved.