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[Seriphyn]

Since it was brought up in two threads, I thought it would be better if I take the post to a separate post instead. There seems to be an issue with "Asianizing" the Caldari, I'm not sure how prevalent it is, but I thought it was pretty obvious. It's quite clear with how they are portrayed, and I thought most players sort of saw them this way? For example...

- Naming. System names, personal names, NPC names (Wakizashi, Samurai, Katana, Shogun etc.) etc.
- Silent spectating
- Collectivist attitude. “Good of the whole”. Would extend to attitudes to family
- Honour suicide (State Issue Raven description)
- Strong work culture, little emphasis on pleasure
- Intolerant/xenophobic of foreigners who do not “stick by the rules”

By contrast, the Gallente…

- Democratic, constitutional-based government with separation of powers. Party-based politics.
- Immigrant culture (eg. ‘Promised Land’)
- Political activism (‘theatrical outrage at the drop of a hat’)
- Dislike of high taxes and interventionist governance (but always an opposing call for more, ie. Sociocrats)
- Consumer culture around lifestyle (ease of living, fashion, cosmetics, looks etc., wild parties!)
- Entertainment culture (dominance in music, film etc.)

Collectivism is a very Asian/Eastern concept. Family comes first, and in the State, it extends to corporation and country. Individualism by contrast is very Western, born from materialism. We can't wait to break free of our parents and families, for example.

[Mathra Hiede]

As a quick surface overview it certainly seems like that - but it seems like a much more recent addition of the Asian elements, specifically the Japanese ones to do with the State FW NPC names and other similar emphasis on things like you mentioned, work ethics, aim for perfection and advanced tech.
That being said and I can't emphasise enough is the depth of these cultures is much deeper and varied that such a description doesn't do justice to the State as a whole. The various Megacorps have strongly different idealogies about business, life and everything in between - some are ruthless and greedy and others compasionate and dedicated (Ishukone being a good PF Example of the compasionate Megacorp)

Those idealogies tend to chafe a little with the glossy overview you presented, however accurate to the larger population it might be, although from what I understand there are some other influences that are woven into the Caldari PF, but right now I can't remember them.

As for the Gallenteans I can't comment on any real authority as I have never really gotten into them in much detail, infact of all the races and factions they are probably the ones I know the least about, however I do see them as a bit more... over the top that a simple Western interpretation, we abhor public violence but the Gallente cheer and encourage it (Public incineration much?) so there is possibly a medieval European influence through there - where public executions where a spectator sport, which leads me to believe things like gladiator sports would also be popular.

Just my 0.05 ISK worth

[orange]

- Naming. System names, personal names, NPC names (Wakizashi, Samurai, Katana, Shogun etc.) etc.
- Silent spectating
- Collectivist attitude. “Good of the whole”. Would extend to attitudes to family
- Honour suicide (State Issue Raven description)
- Strong work culture, little emphasis on pleasure
- Intolerant/xenophobic of foreigners who do not “stick by the rules”

Names/Language - I do not think there is an argument as to whether Napanii has a strong Japanese influence, but it also has a strong Finnish influence by most accounts.

Collectivist attitude - There are non-East Asian cultures which have collectivist attitudes (1).  It is just common for Anglo-American culture to identify the Asian as such, since first generation immigrants tend to adhere to this culture.

Intolerance of Foreigners is seen in every culture, it is a question of whether it the law protects the foreigner's cultural practices or impedes it.  There is significant intolerance of foreigners, specially when they stick to very public cultural norms which run contrary to the prominent culture - Muslim head scarfs in France for example or naming your child with a "home-country" name verse an Anglo name in the US (the child might adopt an Anglo name to make it easier in school and beyond).

Honor suicide -the Romans practiced forms of Honor Suicide, especially with poisons (see Tea Ceremony).  It is not indicative of an Asian culture.

Strong work culture/little emphasis on pleasure - I disagree with the assertion that this is an Asian trait in the case of the Caldari, but rather an artifact of being a corporate culture.  Of course the corporations are going to push for a focus on hard work.  Within the Gallente culture the same is true, the State's corporations just have a more direct impact on culture.

The point is that shoehorning the cultures of EvE into particular Earth cultures does a disservice to both the EvE cultures and Earth cultures with respect to their complexities.

[Senn Typhos]

I think rather than looking for specific Earthbound cultures to attach races of EVE to, we should instead look at the existing cultures and draw conclusions from previous examples of the cultural skeletons they draw from, if that makes sense.

To put it another way; Caldari culture is a mixture of heavy corporate/merchant, and a warrior culture. So instead of saying "Japanese" or something, look at any culture that includes those elements, and you can probably get a sense of how the Caldari would function, since all of EVE is an amalgamation of Earth's peoples.

Case in point, samurai were not the only caste of people to value honorable deaths - the Norse and Greeks did as well. And while Japan could be argued as a corporate culture, America could as well. And a small nation producing a powerful military - again, many examples from history. From these examples, a better picture of "The Caldari" can be painted, rather than "Japan in the Future."

[Rodj Blake]

There's also a Finnish influence on Caldari names.

[Vieve]

Strong work culture/little emphasis on pleasure - I disagree with the assertion that this is an Asian trait in the case of the Caldari, but rather an artifact of being a corporate culture.  Of course the corporations are going to push for a focus on hard work.  Within the Gallente culture the same is true, the State's corporations just have a more direct impact on culture.

I also disagree with the assertion that this is an Asian trait.  For example, the Protestant Work Ethic and similar cultural threads didn't originate in Asia.

[Syylara/Yaansu]

Since it was brought up in two threads, I thought it would be better if I take the post to a separate post instead. There seems to be an issue with "Asianizing" the Caldari, I'm not sure how prevalent it is, but I thought it was pretty obvious. It's quite clear with how they are portrayed, and I thought most players sort of saw them this way? For example...

I've often gotten that feel from the cultural attributes presented as well.

As far as a lot of the responses, please don't confuse saying "they have many traits one finds in Asian cultures" with saying "they have many traits which are solely found in Asian cultures and not elsewhere and also have absolutely no traits from any other cultures whatsoever."

[Valdezi]

Dex is right to say that individually, these characteristics are not necessarily indicative of Asian culture, but, taken as a whole, i.e taken together, there is strong evidence to suggest that the Caldari were intended to have a strong East-Asian feel.

[Silver Night]

I would suggest that given there are probably 50 to 200 times more Caldari than there are people living on earth today, even if there are some common elements, I would hesitate to say that the entire culture has a 'feel' that resembles any particular region on modern earth.

It is tempting to create these sorts of simple labels and boxes, but I think it falls short of addressing the size and complexity of the empires we are talking about, as well as their distance in time from modern earth.

[Kyoko Sakoda]

"Art of Eve" quotes Reynir as saying the primary sources for inspiration for the State were Japan, Germany, and Finland. While my own character has a very Japanese name, I often reject any direct comparison because it is not only misleading (and 25,000 years in the future) but there are greater nationalistic values at work within the embedded ideology of the State than there are in really any of the three sources.

[Dirk Smacker]

Collectivism comes much more naturally when you live in an overcrowded or an isolated condition.  Examples being the overcrowding in East Asia, the forced isolation of 20th century communist governments, and US cities being the only bastions of collectivist thinking in the US (both crowding and isolation as you do not need a car to live there).     

In the thread that I started where I couldn't really buy how the Caldari were both viciously competitive and collectivist thinking at the same time, the conclusion I came up with is that Pre-Heth Caldari corps tailor-made the culture to be cramped and isolated.  The practical purpose would be ridged control over the company and keeping individuals from accumulating too much power to challenge the leadership.  However, the "positive" side effect being the collectivist nature of the race.

Then the capsuleers came and the Caldari economy crashed.  The prime fiction states that it was because the Big 8 failed to utilize the capsuleers.  However, what if it was an attempt to keep them from importing information?  Some say the fall of the Soviet Union started when the people started getting real information about American life, not just what they got from Pravda.  Well, what if Caldari society was actually breaking down due to outside communication, compounding the adverse effects of the changing galactic economic situation? 

Enter Tibus Heth, who refocused Caldari society in a patriotic fervor using gold old Soviet-style policing, keeping the attention on the enemies of The State, not the higher standard of living typical Gallentes enjoy.         

[orange]

...corporate/merchant, and a warrior culture ... rather than "Japan in the Future."

Just like Space Nazis (or Space Soviets), these are "archetypes" that should be used sparingly.

For example, I can describe the framework of the Caldari State as being very similar to the first framework for the United States (ie Articles of Confederation vs Constitution) and the 8 megacorporations have parallels to the 13 Colonies/States.  I can draw parallels between the Caldari War for secession and the American War for Independence and the American Civil War.  My knowledge of that history informs my roleplay to some degree, being a Lai Dai employee before being a State citizen like a Virginian or New Yorker before being an American in 1785.

This does not make the State (or Federation) the "United States in the Future."

[Silver Night]

Collectivism comes much more naturally when you live in an overcrowded or an isolated condition.  Examples being the overcrowding in East Asia, the forced isolation of 20th century communist governments, and US cities being the only bastions of collectivist thinking in the US (both crowding and isolation as you do not need a car to live there).     

In the thread that I started where I couldn't really buy how the Caldari were both viciously competitive and collectivist thinking at the same time, the conclusion I came up with is that Pre-Heth Caldari corps tailor-made the culture to be cramped and isolated.  The practical purpose would be ridged control over the company and keeping individuals from accumulating too much power to challenge the leadership.  However, the "positive" side effect being the collectivist nature of the race.

Then the capsuleers came and the Caldari economy crashed.  The prime fiction states that it was because the Big 8 failed to utilize the capsuleers.  However, what if it was an attempt to keep them from importing information?  Some say the fall of the Soviet Union started when the people started getting real information about American life, not just what they got from Pravda.  Well, what if Caldari society was actually breaking down due to outside communication, compounding the adverse effects of the changing galactic economic situation? 

Enter Tibus Heth, who refocused Caldari society in a patriotic fervor using gold old Soviet-style policing, keeping the attention on the enemies of The State, not the higher standard of living typical Gallentes enjoy.         

This might be a different discussion, but I would say that collectivism and competition aren't mutually exclusive unless you are liking the competitiveness directly to individualism or self-interest.

Both the collectivism and the competitiveness are probably relics of a culture that formed on Caldari Prime over thousands of years - a planet that was (at least to begin with) barely sufficient to maintain human life. Collectivism in groups, where everyone had to work and the individual might need to sacrifice for the whole to survive, and competition in that one group might need to compete against other groups for extremely scarce resources, where the satkes were nothing less than the entire group's survival.

I think it is pretty easy to see how that kind of culture and mentality would transfer easily to a corporate model. Corporations competing fiercely against eachother, etc.

[lallara zhuul]

Collectivism comes much more naturally when you live in an overcrowded or an isolated condition.        

Look further into the past of the Caldari people to see where this developed.

Like after the collapse of the EVE gate...

Most of the aspects of the Caldari culture can be explained by the almost impossible conditions they were forced to live in during that period.

[Mithfindel]

To contrast, I'll compare the Caldari with the other usual suspect, us Finns:

- Naming. System names, personal names, NPC names etc. (for example, most names ending in -nen. The crappiest agent in the Home Guard has a name that means "poo" in Finnish, btw.)
- Collectivist attitude. “Good of the whole”. Would extend to attitudes to family. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talkoot)
- Strong work culture, little emphasis on pleasure (Lutheran Work Ethic)
- Intolerant/xenophobic of foreigners who do not “stick by the rules” (matches as well - we're a bit more tolerand these days, but Tango Finlandia isn't entirely parody: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhxZoV3t61c though it is presented in a very silly and ignorant way)
- Mill towns (okay, this is by no means unique to Finland/Scandinavia, though the mill mentality might be a bit more common around here)
- Character models. For example, I designed Axel (Kurki)'s old model to be a pretty stereotypic Finn.

There's likely a few other examples, as well, but I don't think CCP had any better view of Finland as they had of Japan while designing the Caldari, so they're still something standing on their own, though they do have some influences.