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The Sani Sabik sectarian law-enforcement organization is called the Bleeders, and is a combination of priests and policemen? (The Burning Life, p. 18)

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Author Topic: Volunteer GMs  (Read 2827 times)

kailethre

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Re: Volunteer GMs
« Reply #15 on: 15 Sep 2016, 12:51 »

MAIN CHARACTER: Lord Kailethre
ALTS AVAILABLE FOR ONE OFFS:
Natalei is my primary RP alt and villainous vixen
I have a few other noname alts that are throwaways
CONTACT INFORMATION: evemail is likely the best

Situational specialities
politics | exploration | business
combat | dungeons | dialogue
lengthy arcs | one shots | events
relationship building | personal development | adversarial relationships
Other: though not specialised i can handle most any situation given some prep time

Lore speciality:

True Amarr | Ni Kunni | Khanid
Deteis | Civire | Achura
True Gallente | Intaki | Jin-Mei
Brutor | Sebiestor | Vherokior
Empire | State | Federation | Republic
Sisters of Eve | Guristas | Angels | Serpentis
Nation | Blood Raiders | Intaki Syndicate | Mordu's Legion

Mediums:

Slack | Google Docs | IG space
IG text |

Example work:
http://pastebin.com/Z3AzjusR - a fight/murder scene that i helped friends with. its not amazing but if this is the sort of stuff youre after then shoot a mail
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Aldrith Shutaq

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Re: Volunteer GMs
« Reply #16 on: 15 Sep 2016, 17:02 »

Because OOC egos get in the way of good RP, while IC egos get in the way of interesting change.

Honestly I think most players are too afraid to let their character fail or lose, and one of the best ways to do that is through adversarial RP. As long as both parties trust and respect each other and are fair in their planning, failure and loss can be one of the best ways to initiate character development. Aldrith has done so many times, including instances where he was both the winner and the loser, such as when he delivered his message to Silas Vitalia or tried to stop Vincent Pryce from running off on a date with one of his subordinates.

Realistic feeling hard-earned victories and bitter defeats can only come from these kinds of RP's, and the script needs to stay loose enough to allow for tension while still being stable enough to make sure unexpected butthurt does not arise. It all takes a lot of traits that not all RP'ers have; patience, detachment from their characters, care more for the creative process than the end result, selflessness, and a good sense of how their character's traits might lead them down one path or another. It's fun if done right, but can explode in a fiery mess if not approached with the right attitude.

Also, egos suck and they all deserve to die.
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Syagrius

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Re: Volunteer GMs
« Reply #17 on: 15 Sep 2016, 17:39 »

@Syagrius

Are you differentiating between effective and ineffective ways to use adversarial relationships to enhance roleplay? After interacting with you in character, I feel like you've got a lot of experience on the topic.

Yes indeedy, but I am not sure that is a good or bad thing.  I think if used correctly adversarial relationships can be fun and rewarding.  But understand it can be a minefield and have actually lost Eve-friends over misunderstanding, I or James didn't have the energy or desire to mend. 

How many of us from earlier generations especially, have those very relationships with our father or brothers?  My mother hated how my father, brothers and I mercilessly picked on each other.  She didn't understand the dynamic and our motivation. 

I and James for that matter, am often left scratching my head at how folks mistake or take something said,  often contrary to James actual meaning.  We have to remember that using text limits the emotional and nonverbal subtext.

My favorite quote and guiding principle when I created James is, "I am indeed a villain, but a very honest one." 
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Charles Cambridge Schmidt

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Re: Volunteer GMs
« Reply #18 on: 15 Sep 2016, 19:19 »

@charles

"the best part about villains is when you obsess over them just as much as the villain"

I agree. I think a good adversarial relationship is also a matter of self-exploration. A good villain can create a mix of often conflicting emotions. A good villain can make a "hero," a "protagonist," question themselves. Discomfort is the hallmark of growth.

It's not enough for an antagonist to elicit hate. Hate's one dimensional on its own. Hate's boring. A better antagonist can get a mix and even encourage double-think: hate for the antagonist and self hate. Respect for the antagonist's goals if not their methods. Sympathy. Empathy. Even investment. That's engaging, and the exploration of those emotions creates extra depth. The chemistry and dynamics in winning and losing, too, creates a variety of emotions at once and prompts introspection.

Agreed! Lots of agreement coming your way, from me. Aldrith phrased a lot of good thoughts that I agree with, mostly that the issue with a lot of the RP that GMs set up needs to be thoroughly communicated OOC. Not a script, per se, but definitely guidelines. Just like with textfights, it's important to establish before continuing further. It'd be as inane as a non-DUST civilian beating a heavy-armor ground-pounding DUST murder machine in a fist fight because people think "dice rolling" is an acceptable way to determine fights >_>
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Elmund Egivand

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Re: Volunteer GMs
« Reply #19 on: 15 Sep 2016, 19:55 »

@charles

"the best part about villains is when you obsess over them just as much as the villain"

I agree. I think a good adversarial relationship is also a matter of self-exploration. A good villain can create a mix of often conflicting emotions. A good villain can make a "hero," a "protagonist," question themselves. Discomfort is the hallmark of growth.

It's not enough for an antagonist to elicit hate. Hate's one dimensional on its own. Hate's boring. A better antagonist can get a mix and even encourage double-think: hate for the antagonist and self hate. Respect for the antagonist's goals if not their methods. Sympathy. Empathy. Even investment. That's engaging, and the exploration of those emotions creates extra depth. The chemistry and dynamics in winning and losing, too, creates a variety of emotions at once and prompts introspection.

Agreed! Lots of agreement coming your way, from me. Aldrith phrased a lot of good thoughts that I agree with, mostly that the issue with a lot of the RP that GMs set up needs to be thoroughly communicated OOC. Not a script, per se, but definitely guidelines. Just like with textfights, it's important to establish before continuing further. It'd be as inane as a non-DUST civilian beating a heavy-armor ground-pounding DUST murder machine in a fist fight because people think "dice rolling" is an acceptable way to determine fights >_>

That's why there are modifiers, to ensure that a civilian beating a DUSTer is highly unlikely (thought I would love to see the civilian somehow beating the DUSTer in a fist fight and try to explain that away without resorting to RNG LOL).
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Aldrith Shutaq

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Re: Volunteer GMs
« Reply #20 on: 16 Sep 2016, 02:08 »

Well in situations like those a good GM will recognize what the chances of a particular scenario playing out are and adjust the narrative to make more sense. In the case of a civilian getting incredibly lucky and beating a pimped-out cyber-dude, you could say his tech had a hiccup at the exact wrong moment, or some other environmental factor intervened.

Although an even better GM would skip the dice roll, say the Duster mushed the player's face in, and tell the player that was a dumb idea.
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Lithium Flower

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Re: Volunteer GMs
« Reply #21 on: 16 Sep 2016, 18:49 »

Ok I see a lot of people who favour adversarial roleplay and relationships. I'm interested. What kind of adversarial relationships do you like? Rivalries? Villain-hero? Ideological divides? Do you go back to the traditional narrative conflicts? Like man vs man, man vs society, man vs nature, man vs self, man vs machine, man vs god? Which do you think make for the most fun and rewarding roleplay?
I prefer playing adversarial relationships as conflict of interests or ideological divides.

In a villain-hero relationships I try to show villain to be a hero as well and being driven by good will (having good heart besides showing at first as offensive and evil, etc), and that the hero is not as clean as others thought. (Thus I don't recommend playing with me for those, who loves classical hero-villain divides). Probably the best hero-villain scenario for me is the one where hero and villain in the end not just turns to be equal, but really swap places.
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Tressith_Sefira

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Re: Volunteer GMs
« Reply #22 on: 19 Sep 2016, 12:33 »

@Aldrith

Surely not all OOC and IC ego is bad. A certain amount of it is what prompts risk taking. The simple act of saying hello in a quiet channel; the creation of a new venue; the writing of a new IGS post: these are all things that take a little gusto. That gusto keeps us going when our hellos go unanswered, our venues go unused, and our post goes unnoticed.

I think I agree with you when you say that it can get in the way. I think good adversarial relationships are a check; can your ass cash the check that your mouth is writing? If it can't, you better work on it fast before your opposite shows you up. Too, no matter how hard we try, our OOC character shows through our IC characters. The give and take, the winning and the losing, and how we do both. Maybe that determines the quality of us as roleplayers.

@Sygarius

How do you differentiate between productive and nonproductive adversarial relationships? What do you think makes a difference for you? And how would you characterise that picking back and forth between your brothers and father; was that productive? And how do you think that we can avoid those pitfalls of misunderstanding over this challenging but rewarding type of interaction?

@Charles

I'm tying back to that last question I asked James. You think OOC coordination is key to keeping fights productive and fun?

@lithium

That's nuanced. What's your philosophy on balancing winning and losing in conflict?
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Velarra

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Re: Volunteer GMs
« Reply #23 on: 19 Sep 2016, 15:22 »

MAIN CHARACTER: Velarra
ALTS AVAILABLE FOR ONE OFFS: None. Subject to change with November Alpha clones.
CONTACT INFORMATION: Evemail
Currently Seeking: (I would like to GM / find a GM/ brainstorm / make new connections)

Situational specialities
(color in red your preferred topics and styles)
politics | exploration | business
combat | dungeons | dialogue
lengthy arcs | one shots | events
relationship building | personal development | adversarial relationships
Other: As a Storyteller / "GM" To instigate and provide toys and / or tools for people to play with or react to.

Lore speciality:

True Amarr | Ni Kunni | Khanid
Deteis | Civire | Achura
True Gallente | Intaki | Jin-Mei
Brutor | Sebiestor | Vherokior
Empire | State | Federation | Republic
Sisters of Eve | Guristas | Angels | Serpentis
Nation | Blood Raiders | Intaki Syndicate | Mordu's Legion
Other:

Mediums:

Slack | Google Docs | IG space
IG text | Other:

Reference:
Lunarisse Aspenstar / Maria Daphiti
« Last Edit: 19 Sep 2016, 16:35 by Velarra »
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Vlad Cetes

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Re: Volunteer GMs
« Reply #24 on: 19 Sep 2016, 19:01 »

MAIN CHARACTER: Vlad Cetes/Vlad Cettes (due to game mechanics I have to have 2x chars, one is for RP one for PVP)
ALTS AVAILABLE FOR ONE OFFS: No RP alts
CONTACT INFORMATION: @vladcetes on slack or evemail
Available Events: I have the La Grace Castle available for events (Vehrnichtung in game), a fortified castle perfect for sensitive meetings
Currently Seeking: (I would like to GM/ find a GM/ brainstorm/ make new connections)

Situational specialities
(color in red your preferred topics and styles)
politics | exploration | business
combat | dungeons | dialogue
lengthy arcs | one shots | events
relationship building | personal development | adversarial relationships
Other:

Lore speciality:

True Amarr | Ni Kunni | Khanid
Deteis | Civire | Achura
True Gallente | Intaki | Jin-Mei
Brutor | Sebiestor | Vherokior
Empire | State | Federation | Republic
Sisters of Eve | Guristas | Angels | Serpentis
Nation | Blood Raiders | Intaki Syndicate | Mordu's Legion
Other:

Mediums:

Slack | Google Docs | IG space (look on zkill for why no in space RP)
IG text | Other:

Example work:
http://vladcetes.blogspot.com/2015/12/virtual-jove.html
http://vladcetes.blogspot.com/2016/04/staring-into-abyss.html
http://vladcetes.blogspot.com/2016/04/the-shining-and-light-without-whom-i.html
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Charles Cambridge Schmidt

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Re: Volunteer GMs
« Reply #25 on: 20 Sep 2016, 18:26 »

@Charles

I'm tying back to that last question I asked James. You think OOC coordination is key to keeping fights productive and fun?

I do! Even if someone takes a rather narratively hands-off approach (as with the dice rolling thing I mentioned), you still have to set boundaries. Elmund said it in a roundabout way: modifiers need to be applied to individual characters for specific traits, and if the players operating under your GMing or fighting disagree with the capacity you've assigned to the people they're musing, things get awkward and messy OOC, fast.

"Fights" doesn't solely apply to physical actual fights, either. The longer, lengthier conflicts that arise need a subtle guiding hand, especially if the goal is to have the two key players - hero, villain - incorporate others into the RP for the sake of content generation. The hero/villain pair, or HPV (ha ha ha), then needs to find ways to generate conflict between the rivalry that's accessible and fun for players.
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kalaratiri

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Re: Volunteer GMs
« Reply #26 on: 20 Sep 2016, 19:00 »

MAIN CHARACTER: Kalaratiri
ALTS AVAILABLE FOR ONE OFFS: Esil Skor / Cra'th Reh
CONTACT INFORMATION: Eve Mail, Tweetfleet slack
Available Events: Esil and Cra'th co-manage a Wormhole citadel anchored over a Temperate planet. WH RP is available on specific request (and I'll have to consider possible security risks).
Currently Seeking: (I would like to GM/ find a GM/ brainstorm/ make new connections)

Situational specialities
(color in red your preferred topics and styles)
politics | exploration | business
combat | dungeons kinky | dialogue
lengthy arcs | one shots | events
relationship building | personal development | adversarial relationships
Other:

Lore speciality:

True Amarr | Ni Kunni | Khanid
Deteis | Civire | Achura
True Gallente | Intaki | Jin-Mei
Brutor | Sebiestor | Vherokior
Empire | State | Federation | Republic
Sisters of Eve | Guristas | Angels | Serpentis
Nation | Blood Raiders | Intaki Syndicate | Mordu's Legion
Other:

Mediums:

Slack | Google Docs | IG space
IG text | Other:

I have been largely removed from the RP scene on all characters for several years now. I am definitely interested in getting back involved, particularly in Angel and WH oriented stuff.
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"Eve roleplayers scare me." - The Mittani

Gesakaarin

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Re: Volunteer GMs
« Reply #27 on: 23 Sep 2016, 05:02 »

Ah, adversarial relationships. People always say they want it and then get mad when they get it. Mostly because they try to OOC metagame a meta-master and get butthurt as a result.

Because as a career space villain I can count on one hand the people who ever bothered to right click -> start convo/send mail me for some real talk about IC boundaries and conditionals before getting super salty.
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Lunarisse Aspenstar

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Re: Volunteer GMs
« Reply #28 on: 23 Sep 2016, 08:29 »

What Veik said. For that reason, I tend to shy away from those sort of RP's unless the adversary is an NPC for that reason or there has been a rather extensive discussion of the likely end games and "lines" for such a RP.  With one or two exceptions (and one in particular, he is missed and he should know who he is), usually it ends in OOC meta flames, drama and angst.
« Last Edit: 23 Sep 2016, 08:40 by Lunarisse Aspenstar »
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Tressith_Sefira

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Re: Volunteer GMs
« Reply #29 on: 23 Sep 2016, 11:58 »

@Gesakaarin, @Lunarisse

I've had this kinda problem too before. I think we all have.

I think there's a few key things that help: ooc consent and ooc coordination. If some guy on the IGS I've never met before, and neither has Triss, starts calling her out, I'm going to assume the worst about them. Because they're going into dangerous, murky territory, and I don't know if I can trust them. And because I haven't consented to this type of RP with this person. It's not a nice thing to do. It's not a fair mindset. But - what if I'm not receptive to adversarial roleplay? They don't know that unless they talk before they try something so volatile.

I like to know the other party well before I try something new and risky like that. I like to know how strong their IC/OOC separation is. For my own selfish sake, I like to have a gentle sense for how they tick, what they enjoy, what they don't, whether they're happy or not. I think "good" adversarial RP is more difficult and challenging than normal RP, so I like to be as well informed as possible so I can be a good partner. And so I can trust in my other partner.

I try not to think about a good adversarial relationship as being about winning or losing. I like to think of them as a journey, with new and different ways to explore characters, and new and different avenues to let them change. The fact that Triss is a DUSTer and therefore super strong/powerful is a sidenote, in my opinion. It's only one of the layers or levels that conflict can happen. What's more important is - why is there a fight happening? What will happen as a result of the fight? How do characters feel before the fight? After the fight? Was a fight really the best option?

If you win a battle for the wrong reasons, in character and in life, that's worse than losing a battle for the right reasons. The first might be a physical victory but it's a character defeat. The second gives opportunity to try, try again.

Let me call out to @Syagrius. James and Triss don't get along well, as Triss is poor in diplomacy and politics, which James is stronger at. It reflects poorly on Triss as a person and as a professional. That's such a unique and wonderful dynamic. His player has strong separation too. Thank you, my friend.

I think I take it too far. Probably the only two things people absolutely need are consent and coordination for, yes, boundaries, like you said Gesakaarin. What kind of set boundaries have you found that work well for all parties involved?
« Last Edit: 23 Sep 2016, 12:12 by Tressith_Sefira »
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