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[Elmund Egivand]

+1 for Victoria's comment.

It makes sense that rediculously wealthy, extremely powerful nigh-immortal rabble-rousers are likely to be kept on an extremely short leash whenever possible.


Think of how much of a pain in the ass it is for everyone involved whenever someone like Barak Obama wants to eat at a 'regular person' restaurant.  The security, the closing of nearby businesses, roads, the hospitals on call when he travels, the layers of security detail, etc, etc.

Now multiply his wealth and celebrity by a factor of 100.    Station security unlikely to be happy when capsuleer 'x' wants to go slumming with the proles in the local bar.  This is not to say that it doesn't happen, just that things can easily be 'complicated.'

Of course not all capsuleers are popular, well known, or famous.

This is why it is likely far more common, and even encouraged by the authorities that be, for capsuleers to build their own isolated communities or estates where they can 'play normal'. This is perhaps the biggest reason why an empire would allow a capsuleer to live on a vast estate somewhere on a planet.

The authorities charge exorbitant taxes and fees and property values from the capsuleer who can afford it easily, making tons of money for the regional authorities. Meanwhile, the capsuleer is kept safely in their prison without walls. It's a form of encouraged house arrest.

"You stay there in your fancy estate and don't come to the city, and we'll send you whatever you want. Deal?"

I feel so fortunate for playing a Matar, because the concept of 'Elite Class' doesn't seem to exist in the Minmatar society and your money and power doesn't affect your social standing, just your age and your perceived wisdom. So I get Elmund to visit the bars and drink vodka and play cards with the proles, and they won't even feel awkward about it.

[Vic Van Meter]

I don't know, the position of royalty and nobility has changed from time to time and culture to culture.  While there were certainly times when you had to protect nobles from possible assassinations and angry populations, that wasn't always the case.  European nobility were expected to be out and about, mingling with at least their vassals in other territories so they could keep an eye on things.  In these cases, it wasn't much of a problem being near the population.  They were poor, uneducated, and unschooled in martial disciplines.  Their lords were generally well-trained combatants.  They walked among those people with little fear until the end of that age.

As far as capsuleers go, I'd say it's probably decided very much on a case-by-case basis.  If a capsuleer develops a reputation for not being a rabblerouser and for not making a nuisance of himself, I'd say he'd pretty much be tolerated anywhere.  If a capsuleer is revolutionary and vitriolic, I don't think he'd even be welcome to land in his own back yard without pissing off the neighbors.

So that might be something that needs to be figured out on a character basis.  Character traits and flaws have benefits and consequences.  If you want a capsuleer that can generally find himself planetside without much trouble, you'd better be ready to play someone that can feasibly be believed to do that.  If you walk into any thread or chat channel and your character has an attitude, you have to understand that the baseliner community might eventually end up knowing that capsuleer's reputation.  To be allowed to walk around anywhere, whenever and wherever you want, you'd better be ready to play someone very intentionally disarming.

Which is why Constantin can't get involved in any of these fun little diss battles that pop up on the IGS.  A slip of a word talking shit about a certain Gallente political party, and he might find himself not able to visit a whole planet if the government there is made up of that party.  But that's sort of a price you pay to play the diplomatic and cheerful type.  You have to be very conscious that your character is walking on RP eggshells.

[Lyn Farel]

Capsuleers are not necessarily space Obamas or Rodens.

They can be celebrities, and a lot of celebs usually visit plebs and proles and other common average places.

I would also argue that considering that CCP is always putting the emphasis on capsuleers connections, they have the power to give the middle finger to authorities and go baseline as much as they want, as long as they are not too much a pain on site.

It is however specified it works with a bullet in the head if publicly discovered in Jita 4-4, so arguing otherwise because of :connections: starts to smell a little special snowflaky.

[Anslol]

tbqfh, if it isn't hurting someone directly or some overthetop claim like I AM LORD OF ALL JITA, WATCH AS I SMASH YOUR PATHETIC RP'D EVENT WITH A THOUSAND INVINCIBLE HETH CLONES UNDER MY COMMAND...so what? Maybe I'm not seeing the deeper problem here or something, but I just don't get why there's so much contention around this.

We're supposed to make content. Then someone makes content/something interesting a new. Then people say 'oh that's not real, we're gonna discredit you.'

Then what the buggering fuckmuffins is the point of even bothering to make content? Just roll with it and have fun. Jesus Christ.

[Silas Vitalia]

tbqfh, if it isn't hurting someone directly or some overthetop claim like I AM LORD OF ALL JITA, WATCH AS I SMASH YOUR PATHETIC RP'D EVENT WITH A THOUSAND INVINCIBLE HETH CLONES UNDER MY COMMAND...so what? Maybe I'm not seeing the deeper problem here or something, but I just don't get why there's so much contention around this.

We're supposed to make content. Then someone makes content/something interesting a new. Then people say 'oh that's not real, we're gonna discredit you.'

Then what the buggering fuckmuffins is the point of even bothering to make content? Just roll with it and have fun. Jesus Christ.

If someone made content that said they owned the planet your beach channel was on, how would you feel about that?

[Anslol]

I'd shuffle that under the whole heth clone army thing, since said planet was placed in CONCORD specific space.

[Lyn Farel]

Jesus Christ.

What does Jesus Christ have to do with godmod... Oh, I see what you did here. 

[Anslol]

Damn I didn't even see what I did there 

[Katrina Oniseki]

Okay, I think we're all overthinking this a lot. CCP isn't trying to poop on our worldbuilding. They're just providing factional flavoring on which to do it. Baselining in the Big Four is different depending on where you go.

Minmatar Republic - Nobody cares if you're one of those green sperm pilots.
Gallente Federation - "OMG IT'S A CAPSULEER CAN I HAVE UR AUTOGRAPH?!!??!"
Amarr Empire - "Lord Pilot. It is an honor to meet you, sir."
Caldari State - Don't blow your cover. Just don't.

The Caldari State is the only place that has any mention of getting shot on sight, and half of the people complaining in this thread don't baseline in Caldari areas with their main character anyways, so I don't see what all the fuss is about. Looking at you, Anslo. You can still be a celebrity with a limo and paparazzi drones snapping photos of you wherever you go, as long as you do it in the Fed.

The Caldari State simply expects capsuleers to remain low key and not attempt to throw their weight around. Those who do are quickly eliminated from the system. That's a trade-off for living outside the law in a totalitarian state. There are certain limits you just don't cross. You're already fabulously wealthy and legally invulnerable. Is it so much to ask for your character to not be a tremendous public jerkass with your newfound power and flip the finger to the authorities? I don't think so.

Just about everybody else in New Eden either grudgingly respect (Empire), celebrate (Federation), or ignore (Republic) the capsuleer's power.

So seriously? This is a non-issue, people.

[Anslol]

Looking at you, Anslo. You can still be a celebrity with a limo and paparazzi drones snapping photos of you wherever you go, as long as you do it in the Fed.

I'm famous? 

But no that wasn't what I was really commenting on. It was more the fluff/player made stuff being shat on I was questioning (i.e. this threads OP). PF breaking is one thing, but trying to say someone's content breaks PF when...it really doesn't, and it's trying to add to the game for fun?....m8

[Arnulf Ogunkoya]

I've been thinking about it & I think I can see a way were Constantin Baracca could get away with preaching in the States without getting killed.

Assume that he really is in the employ of the Theology Council. This means he is directly associated with an allied government. What if the council has sold this as an experiment in social control to some of the megas? Unless I am mistaken Imperial theology is very big on the "obey your lawful superiors" angle. If the Bishop emphasises this in his sermons to Caldari workers, then it could act to reinforce existing corporate loyalty. In return he gets access to all the rejects of State society. Any he converts he can ship off and they cease to be a problem for the State authorities. He also prevents them falling under the sway of the Guristas, or some lesser criminal organisation.

[Katrina Oniseki]

I've been thinking about it & I think I can see a way were Constantin Baracca could get away with preaching in the States without getting killed.

Assume that he really is in the employ of the Theology Council. This means he is directly associated with an allied government. What if the council has sold this as an experiment in social control to some of the megas? Unless I am mistaken Imperial theology is very big on the "obey your lawful superiors" angle. If the Bishop emphasises this in his sermons to Caldari workers, then it could act to reinforce existing corporate loyalty. In return he gets access to all the rejects of State society. Any he converts he can ship off and they cease to be a problem for the State authorities. He also prevents them falling under the sway of the Guristas, or some lesser criminal organisation.

Any time you say you want to do something public in the State, you MUST include the disclaimer that it's taken a lot of red tape and time and bribes to get permission to do it. Otherwise you're stretching credibility. The State does not like freelance people on their turf. Least of all those with lots of money.

It's entirely possible for Baracca to preach in the State, assuming he has all the proper permits and arrangements and blah blah blah set up ahead of time. The State does have political rallies, rock concerts, even legal protests; but they are all arranged through the proper channels beforehand. It's also worth noting that the State does not really care what religion you follow.

Finally, I'd like to point out that you can still just say Veik is talking histrionics out of her bunghole IC. Since when is everything our characters say automatically true or accurate? Do people really think everything Veikitamo says IC is gospel from the State? She's a pretty obvious example of showboating jackboots, and takes pride in it. I think you all might be taking her a bit too seriously.

[Arnulf Ogunkoya]

I've been thinking about it & I think I can see a way were Constantin Baracca could get away with preaching in the States without getting killed.

Assume that he really is in the employ of the Theology Council. This means he is directly associated with an allied government. What if the council has sold this as an experiment in social control to some of the megas? Unless I am mistaken Imperial theology is very big on the "obey your lawful superiors" angle. If the Bishop emphasises this in his sermons to Caldari workers, then it could act to reinforce existing corporate loyalty. In return he gets access to all the rejects of State society. Any he converts he can ship off and they cease to be a problem for the State authorities. He also prevents them falling under the sway of the Guristas, or some lesser criminal organisation.

Any time you say you want to do something public in the State, you MUST include the disclaimer that it's taken a lot of red tape and time and bribes to get permission to do it. Otherwise you're stretching credibility. The State does not like freelance people on their turf. Least of all those with lots of money.

It's entirely possible for Baracca to preach in the State, assuming he has all the proper permits and arrangements and blah blah blah set up ahead of time. The State does have political rallies, rock concerts, even legal protests; but they are all arranged through the proper channels beforehand. It's also worth noting that the State does not really care what religion you follow.

As another, fictional, thinker replied "I believe that is what I just said Captain." 

Finally, I'd like to point out that you can still just say Veik is talking histrionics out of her bunghole IC. Since when is everything our characters say automatically true or accurate? Do people really think everything Veikitamo says IC is gospel from the State? She's a pretty obvious example of showboating jackboots, and takes pride in it. I think you all might be taking her a bit too seriously.

Not really giving much thought to Veik. Not having roleplayed with her I don't really have any view on her IC. I just had the notion of what might explain that one character being able to operate overtly without official sanction.

[Gottii]

The main reason I disagree with trying to preach to the Caldari is that it flies in the face of a lot of PF, and makes little sense given the highly controlled nature of Caldari corporate society.

1.)  Caldari are cultural purists.  This is their "thing".  Why in the world would they want other cultural influences, up to and including their allies?  They fought a war over that kinda thing.  After all, the Gallente used to be their allies too. 

From Caldari: Demographics

 The corporations emphasize this in their enculturation process, enforcing a single Caldari culture and identity for the purposes of unity and cohesion.  

The megacorps actively and methodically go to great lengths to insure cultural homogeneity.  Allowing a preacher from another culture hoping to break that homogeneity would literally make no sense.  Literally, one reason many Caldari players are reacting so poorly to this is that it directly contradicts the stated goals of the State itself, and therefor their characters' goals as well.

2.)  According to PF, Caldari corporate citizens are highly indoctrinated, and megacorporation control and Caldari enculturation is strictly monitored and enforced.

Again, from Caldari:demographics

 Where corporate control is weak and/or threatened by non-Caldari influences (such as colonial outposts in remote areas or space stations on major spacelanes), citizens are frequently rotated between locations, resulting in very few permanent residents in these places. 

Certainly, a preacher seeking to spread another religion, i.e. a non-Caldari influence, would certainly mean that the megacorps would rotate and isolate their citizens away from such things.  Otherwise, none of the above statements make any sense. 

How would you seek to limit non-Caldari influences, actively and aggressive seek to maintain a singular Caldari culture and identity, but allow foreign missionaries and preachers access to your population?  You cant really.  Hence, people having a problem with this storyline. 

[Silas Vitalia]

Gotti has excellent points.  Rebuttal, sir?!