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[Silas Vitalia]

So, let's be civil, and have some discourse.


Many of us support factions in our RP. 

Some of those factions do well, many of them do poorly. Many of them do horribly, and we might feel they are being shafted by the lore, by the PF, and by events. For years.

While we all want 'our' people to do well and be represented faithfully in the game, this isn't always the case.  It is in fact likely not to be the case.

How your characters deal with setbacks by their factional leaders, capsuleer allies, etc is JUST as important as how they deal with success.

I'll point out two great RPers who have demonstrated graciousness in defeat, Graelyn and Aldrith.  Amarr FW has been getting its ass kicked, repeatedly, yet despite what I'm sure are their ooc frustrations they continue to roll with the punches and handle these things gracefully in character.  That's what I'm talking about.

Yes there are big live events coming. Guess what, half of the people showing up are going to 'lose.'  Guess what again, the sun still rises afterwards.

I at one point had damn near 800 or 900 hundred real life people under my aegis. Took territory. pew pewed a lot of people.  Reflected our rising stars in my RP. 

Got backstabbed, lost fleets, lost allies, lost every. single. system, one by one, with no way of stopping it.  Alliance crumbled, failcascaded, and was destroyed.
Reflected this catastrophic defeat in my RP.   


Moved on, rolled with the punches, and eventually punched back.

Blood Raiders aren't exactly kicking ass these days are they? I'll remind you all their last 'event' showcased shield-tanked Ahimmu's and a carrier that were all instantly destroyed, to much trolling IC and OOC.   

Life goes on, relax and have fun, k?

[ArtOfLight]

A good post. +1

I find that facing defeat can really help define a character more so than facing success.

[Vincent Pryce]

NO! WE CAME TO WIN THIS FUCKING RP!

[Silas Vitalia]

Vincent does have a point in that not always winning doesn't mean you shouldn't be doing you damnedest to crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women. Or men.

[Ciarente]

Vincent does have a point in that not always winning doesn't mean you shouldn't be doing you damnedest to crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women. Or men.

ICly. I have a huge admiration for those RPers among us who continue to roll with the punches OOCly.

[Silas Vitalia]

Vincent does have a point in that not always winning doesn't mean you shouldn't be doing you damnedest to crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women. Or men.

ICly. I have a huge admiration for those RPers among us who continue to roll with the punches OOCly.

IC/OOC divide.  I will blow up all your internet space pixels and destroy you very being IC. OOC it's nothing but love for all (most) of you.

[BloodBird]

A good post. +1

I find that facing defeat can really help define a character more so than facing success.

I am enjoying myself right now.

I was enjoying myself back when the Fed had lost all systems and looked like a moronic pile of moronic morons having daily training ops in being morons doing moronic things. I was simply enjoying myself for different reasons.

Morons, damn it.

Also, while I was not very active these last two years on my mains I was active in FW and had fun, even if mostly infrequent, and I expect I will be having fun in the future as well. At least I hope so...

Also slight de-railment - Mal, your Lialus? Great job portraying different toons, I did not realize. Hope you did not burn Mal this time, that would both suck and blow, Mal is awesome. 

[Aelisha Montenagre]

Oh god, so much agreement with Silas, Art and Vince.

Yes that includes Vincent.  Yes and the conflicting nature of that unholy union.  Mainly because of the picture. 

But pretty much - complain about execution, not events.  Aim to make this the iterative process it is and feedback your discontent through the appropriate channels.  But wildly flailing and declaring people 'who are employed to do this stuff' of malicious intent is a bit much. 

We Caldari rpers may be about to take the shaft (elevator, mind out of gutter please), but the point is to figure out the why of it.  The Events team isn't here to serve us.  They interface with us, and their primary demands come from their employers - be they marketing, production or otherwise.  There are factors at play beyond us (PAX and GDC right now) driving the need for a pretty impressive explosion.  That explosion means nothing if it doesn't crap in someone's weetos. 

I'm not suggesting it is fair (or that it should be), I am suggesting that calm declaration of why it is not 'open to people who have invested heavily in their interests' may actually lead to development time on more inclusive features.  Falcon is tied by the system, he can't call off the rules of FW for one event or a million events in the current system. 

Regarding 'global fairness' (this event being an instance of local unfairness/fairness - your call) we are going to need a lolhuge number of events in the sample set to figure out who is being empirically screwed.  Feelings don't make for great qualifiers of if we are or are not victims of an injustice. 

Simply put, keep thinking on why you feel betrayed/let down/annoyed.  Talk about it by all means.  Let's make this part of the developmental process, instead of a sigh of acceptance or rage-filled post that will just make the argument look childish.  RP took a drubbing 5 years ago, it is only now that any moves (for better or worse) are being taken by the company in that domain. 

[Silas Vitalia]

Small derail, why is everyone insisting the Caldari are mandated by god to lose?  The 'event' outcome some have seen on Dust is one possible result, as far as I know.  And even that outcome is perhaps one small asset to overall story.  One can still lose the Titan and win in other ways. It's open.

Even the promotions for the event have clearly stated players will determine results.

[Silas Vitalia]

EVE is one of the ONLY games where your losing in space is -always- your fault.

They have more people? You should have recruited more. You should have begged, borrowed, stolen, out-thought, out-manuevered, and out schemed your opponent. 

The PF doesn't always reflect our ability to shape outcomes, but in space we decide.

[Esna Pitoojee]

Regarding the event - and perhaps this deserves to be moved to the thread regarding the dev blog - I think it comes down to three significant factors:
1, the event taking place in Luminaire space severely limits the ability of Caldari and Amarr militia people showing up - which comprises a significant portion of the former's and almost all of the latter's faction loyalists.
2, the way the storyline has been presented has caused many uninvolved in the storyline and unaware of the history of Caldari Prime to view it as "glorious freedom fighters versus space nazis with a genocidal supergun" (yes, yes, not accurate - I'm talking about perception). Within those parameters, the side to fight for is obvious.
3, there are at least some people who will be showing up simply to make things go boom, and if the titan becomes vulnerable it will be the biggest boom. For instance, I've got confirmation on at least 2 nullsec alliances showing up simply to blow stuff up.


Regarding the OP: I'm generally fine with setbacks to my faction. What I become frustrated with is shifts in the PF/storyline/whatever that limit my ability to generate my own RP and interact with others.

[orange]

So, IC, the lose of CP is a big deal to my character.

The RL demands (like work) I have mean that I can't participate and neither can my character.

Since, my character can't participate, he has failed his society and ancestors.  His disgrace at failing to perform his duty demands he make amends.  Entering exile are the appropriate traditional response to such failings and in the "modern" world that includes biomassing of clones.  Put another way the character I have invested years of play time in dies.

That does not sound particularly fun and really drives me towards giving up on RP and just focusing on the challenge of bottom up null sec economics.

Posted using phone.

[Silas Vitalia]

So, IC, the lose of CP is a big deal to my character.

The RL demands (like work) I have mean that I can't participate and neither can my character.

Since, my character can't participate, he has failed his society and ancestors.  His disgrace at failing to perform his duty demands he make amends.  Entering exile are the appropriate traditional response to such failings and in the "modern" world that includes biomassing of clones.  Put another way the character I have invested years of play time in dies.

That does not sound particularly fun and really drives me towards giving up on RP and just focusing on the challenge of bottom up null sec economics.

Posted using phone.

Then I'd suggest making RP characters that don't have 'loss' conditions that require you quitting the game.

[orange]

Thanks for the urdoinitrong

[Silas Vitalia]

Setting up difficult success conditions for something you create is absolutely you right to do, best of luck.

Lamenting to all of us how difficult it is to live with said self-imposed conditions is something you can choose to avoid as well.