Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Gwen Ikiryo]

Hey everyone - Got a quick question about the Napaani language, if you don't mind.

Keeping it brief: Is it supposed to be the modern, generally accepted universal tongue of the State? Like, that everybody uses?

Or is it a niche (and possibly incomplete) language used exclusively by people high in State society, in an attempt to reclaim the ancient Raata tongue which has been semi-forgotten and gone unused for centuries? While the majority would only speak "Standard Caldari", or what-have-you, which'd be some sorta heavily federal-influenced affair.

I've seen both interpretations, and have so far been assuming the second, but it's led to some quasi-awkward moments where my RP ends up butting heads with someone elses, so I'd like to get it cleared up.

[Kyoko Sakoda]

It could be a resurgence language in modern times. I seem to remember something on Evelopedia about the Caldari educational institutions under direction of the megacorporations ensuring that differences in the "main" Caldari language were not so grand as to hamper communication between any two Caldari. Not unlike Nynorsk and Bokmål in Norway.

[Natalcya Katla]

It could be a resurgence language in modern times. I seem to remember something on Evelopedia about the Caldari educational institutions under direction of the megacorporations ensuring that differences in the "main" Caldari language were not so grand as to hamper communication between any two Caldari. Not unlike Nynorsk and Bokmål in Norway.

Ivar Aasen is Caldari? 

*Hugs Yoko for being such a Scandinerd*

[Pieter Tuulinen]

As I understand it, once the Caldari left a single world they decided they need a central language to reduce 'linguistic drift'. Napaani is a reinvented version of what is known of one of the old Raata languages.

Apparently the amount it is used varies depending upon the corporate culture and the formality of the communication. Generally the use of Napaani should serve some special purpose - whether it's establishing inliers and outliers or just for emphasis.

At least that's how I do it..... >_<

[Lyn Farel]

I'm not even touching that subject again with less than a thousand meters long pole.

[Iwan Terpalen]

Rather. People mostly use a few signature phrases to add some flavor.  People's opinions on how realistic or desireable that is may vary, but I can't recall a single instance of Caldari roleplayers excluding others because they don't salt their sentences with the occasional -haan, or refusing to explain a phrase IC or OOC when prompted.

[Desiderya]

From here

Having found this document you may be wondering at its purpose and at my intentions for having created it. The simple answer is that it is a piece of fan fiction written for the setting of EVE Online. The harder answer is that it is an expression of the freeform play encouraged in the sandbox game world of New Eden and it is also homage to the deep, rich, and dark universe of EVE and the characters that inhabit it. Some players prefer to mission, some to mine, some to steal, and some to save. I enjoy these things too, but most of all I prefer to imagine. Here, myself and several others over the years have imagined the words and sounds of a far future world and brought them out to share.

There's a lot more background explanation as to where napaani originates from, where it was used and how and why it was resurrected. I'm going to pull some lines out to illustrate the use, but I suggest reading the whole couple of paragraphs before dismantling the quoted lines.

When it was reconstructed during the war, the linguists charged with the task set about simplifying the grammar and writing system of ancient Napanii so that it could be accessible to all citizens regardless of their education level or linguistic background.
[...]
The actual use of Napanii varies from place to place and between different socio-economic groups in the State. Deeply patriotic corporations and persons are prone to use the “State language” (Napanii) more often than the “street language” (Caldari).

It's essentially an old Raata era language that has been reinvigorated by the megacorporations during the secession war, to promote cohesion, unity and patriotism. It's claimed to be an 'official state language', whereas the day to day language differs from it.

[Gwen Ikiryo]

Eep. I hadn't intended to start an argument. My bad.

Er... So it's generally accepted that it's not the language of "the common people", but interpretations seem to differ as to if there is a "Caldari basic" (Or what have you) that's in universal use throughout the rest of the State, or if it's highly fragmented. That makes sense, I suppose, if there's no canon basis.

And Kyoko, I'm not quite sure I follow your analogy (Not much for norwegian linguistics, unfortunately). Are you suggesting Napaani might be only a dialect of a generally used State language, or an exception to the overall standardization due to it's resurgent status?

[Pieter Tuulinen]

Yes, FYI, some RP'ers consider things like Kresh and Napaani to be an OOC attempt to exclude non-Caldari RP'ers from Caldari RP.

[orange]

And Kyoko, I'm not quite sure I follow your analogy (Not much for norwegian linguistics, unfortunately). Are you suggesting Napaani might be only a dialect of a generally used State language, or an exception to the overall standardization due to it's resurgent status?

I think the suggestion is that there is a standard-CEP sanctioned version of Napaani that all government functions and inter-corporate business is conducted in, but there may be any number of variations, dialectics, or even different languages spoken throughout the State.

The comparison to Nynorsk & Bokmål to me is not extensive enough.  I would argue it is more like having a common Nordic language (English  ) and then having Icelandic, Danish, Norwegian, Swedish, and Finnish (which does not share much of a base with the other 4) and all their dialects spoken as well were regionally appropriate.

Only in the case of the Caldari, instead of relying on the shared common language at secession (probably some Gallente language), the idea is that they invented/resurrected a dead one.

[Kyoko Sakoda]

Languages are really on a dialect-language sliding scale. Orange's comment is not unlikely if you leave out English and possibly Icelandic; Swedish, Norwegian, and Danish are all about 50-75% mutually intelligible word for word.

[orange]

My inclusion of English was more of a cruel joke (even though there are plenty of Nordic/Germanic words in English).

My real point was that the State's languages are vast and plentiful with variation between them, but most share a common origin (some don't).

At the time of secession, my supposition is that the Caldari likely used the Federation's common tongue initially.  Then as a means to further differentiate themselves they shifted resurrecting the Raata language as their common language.

[Pieter Tuulinen]

Why would they not speak Caldanese?

[Nicoletta Mithra]

English is a West Germanic Language - that's why it mainly consists of Germanic words (plenty Germanic words in a Germanic language \o/). It's not a Nordic (North Germanic) language. Finnish isn't even a Germanic language, but rather an Uralic language, wich doesn't even share a root with the germanic languages in the Proto-Indo-European language, but is a descendant of the Proto-Uralic language.

So, uh, yah, including those two is kind of a cruel joke, Finnish even more so than English. ;P

More on topic, EVElopedia says: "The Caldari are monolingual for these reasons. Although dialects exist depending on location, the corporations ensure that these linguistic variations do not prevent all Caldari citizens from being capable of fully understanding one another."

There's a bit of wriggle space there, but it seems it's in the range of dialects rather than on the languages side of the sliding scale.

[Kyoko Sakoda]

"Ah, so does this Finno-Ugric family include, say, Klingon?"