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[Lyn Farel]

First, to the player of Alain Octiran / Hans Nardieu (not sure if he roams here), I have to say that I really enjoy your characters fleshing out that kind of political day to day debates, heated discussions and outrages, playing between the whole roster of the gallente parties. Also, the last one (here) made me particularily laugh as it seems obviously inspired of something that recently happened IRL.

Now that on the matter of RL inspired things in roleplay, more seriously, it made me wonder several things. I must say that I am not opposed to it, quite the contrary in fact, as I find it quite enriching. But is that somehow blurring the barrier between RL and the Eve world ? Will it become a little too much obvious if we abuse of it after some time ?

To the first question I personally think that if this is well done like this and transfered to the eve world properly, it does not. To the second, though, I am not so sure. What is your opinion on that ?

[Valdezi]

Hey, Lyn.

I've been thinking about this a lot lately and I'm not sure yet what the answer is. I agree that the allegory has the capacity to become obvious and silly if not done in a subtle and interesting fashion.

There's an extent to which everything we do is RL-inspired. Our characters are largely mired in the context of their players and this is unavoidable.

[Seriphyn]

I believe it was Shaalira that pointed out before that associating Federal politics too closely to Western politics has the danger of turning people off of the faction altogether. As entertaining as it can be, I'm not confident all of us want to see EVE equivalents of RL political debates...at the same time, taking a unique approach to it can be entertaining.

This is more personal bias, but the reason I don't want to see too much RL-in-EVE political debates is oversimplifying the Federation. Demographically, it is closer to India, with a strong developed/developing world(s) divide. It is far more diverse than the US ever will be, and IMO is more closer to a "confederation of planets" than a space US.

But that's personal taste. If people enjoy it, by all means...I'd just encourage to take unique approaches...for example...people in remote places of the Federation...how do you ensure they pay their taxes, if they haven't been recorded or even made aware of to the general public? Look at internal issues as well as diplomacy with foreign empires, because it's certainly not perfect (maybe Gallente Prime is, though).

There might be a planet that consistently violates Federation law, but nobody cares to touch them due to the supply of a certain resource to the rest of the Federation. Alienate them, and you risk that planet cutting off trade with others, and making even more people unhappy (there is an emphasis on 'interplanetary trade' according to the Fed Admin NPC desc)

Stuff like that...in summary...

"Look at the Federation from the bottom-up socially, politically and culturally, and see how it collates with a top-down perspective. Do not apply the Senate government top-down"

Eurgh, who knows, i've been drinking, so bit rowdy

[lallara zhuul]

The more there is RL crossover the more the Amarrians will be referred to as paedos.

I think it will just bring down the level of any kind of interaction to a more reactive level of the player instead of somewhat planned responses of the character.

[Lyn Farel]

The more there is RL crossover the more the Amarrians will be referred to as paedos.

I think it will just bring down the level of any kind of interaction to a more reactive level of the player instead of somewhat planned responses of the character.

Good points, though I think that if the thing is done well enough players should not really see the parallels done with RL and thus the player should probably not tend to react too much to an OOC reactive level as much as the character level.

[orange]

Seriphyn, it is your personal bias and I disagree with your opinion that the United States lacks diversity.  I suggest you look into the demographics of the United States a little deeper than the top layer (for example we lump Mexican, Chilean, and Costa Rican into a single category Hispanic) before making assertions that it lacks diversity.

I will say I think it is fair to state US politics, generally, lacks diversity.

[Valdezi]

The Hans Nardieu post in question, as Lyn rightly points out, is a poke at French politics rather than US politics, anyway, so I'm unsure why the US allegory is being discussed.

[Senn Typhos]

Well I was having fun, at least.

Senn only recently discovered how to talk, he's excited to share ideas. ._.

[Valdezi]

Keep it up, Senn, I think it's good.

[Seriphyn]

Without really elaborating on why it's being discussed, India or a South American democracy like Brazil actually is a far better point of comparison. I believe Peru had a Japanese president a while ago.

Never said the US lacked diversity, but it pales in comparison to a place like India, and would be just one planetary blip for a nation that spans hundreds of worlds.

[Esna Pitoojee]

IMO, RL politics comparisons works a lot like other player-influenced or produced content:

It's not terribly bad to set this as an example for a small sub-community in the cluster, especially for purposes of goodhearted satire. I remain somewhat suspicious of serious RL governmental comparisons out of a concern someone will make a mock-US/Britain/Russia/whateveristan and then start presenting it as a utopia/distopia, then RL feelings about RL politics get involved, etc... not seen it happen yet, though, so I'm not going to come down on this to hard.

It's not cool to be trying to dictate and entire factions' politics based on such comparisons.

[Seriphyn]

Oh, also, slavery. Slavery is Teh Bad IRL. But as Lou has pointed out on the IGS it doesn't necessarily have the bad connotations we think it would.

If slaves at 90% of the Amarr workforce, why the hell would you want to abuse them? It's property. Like how a factory has machines, you don't want to be abusing those machines.

That's the "ideal" anyway.

[Graelyn]

Also, you don't want to piss off 90% of your workforce.

They have all the tools to cave your head in, and know how to use them.

[Verone]

Like how a factory has machines, you don't want to be abusing those machines.

Yet 99.9% of factories do so because it's cheaper not to maintain their equipment and run to failure and replace whatever breaks, or the entire machine, or to use sub standard parts.

I'd assume given experience as an Engineer in heavy industry for the last 10 years, in a LOT of places, probably the majority of the empire, slave labour is not a pretty thing at all.

Why give them more than the bare essentials they need to survive?

[lallara zhuul]

Why give them more than the bare essentials they need to survive?

Indeed.

Why give them a possibility to not to have a worldview that makes them work 24/7/365 for a pittance?

How would that be different from the Gallente Federation?

Or any other empire?

The difference is that in the Empire it is called slavery, its cultural motivation is religious (not just survival as in other empires) and it is limited.
Once you are free, you can start working your way up the ladder of society.
Those that are in an economic prison do not have that possibility open for them.

Yes, in the Amarrian system you have to pay for the sins of your ancestors by being enslaved for generations upon generations until you have emptied the ocean of sin with a spoon that has a hole in it.

At least the system is honest.

Unlike in any other empire.