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[Seriphyn]

What about Matari culturalist/ethnic while being in service to the Cartel?

I mean, old news items have got Minmatar who undertake the Voluval and abide by the traditions, but call themselves Gallenteans. You've got Amarrians and Caldari living in the Federation who would call themselves Gallentean.

Minmatar =/= Republic. Minmatar is just an ethnic/cultural origin.

[Saede Riordan]

What about Matari culturalist/ethnic while being in service to the Cartel?

I mean, old news items have got Minmatar who undertake the Voluval and abide by the traditions, but call themselves Gallenteans. You've got Amarrians and Caldari living in the Federation who would call themselves Gallentean.

Minmatar =/= Republic. Minmatar is just an ethnic/cultural origin.

Its a bit more then that, Ava hints at it. There's a certain 'matari-ness' that goes beyond ethnicity. 

And Ava, thats basically what I'm trying to do, as for this:

The IC issue, the ONLY IC issue I could see, has to do with Kita's actions being contradictory to one another; IE, Matari and Slaver, Promotes peace yet engages  in piracy, etc. Pick either or.

1: She's not a slaver, so that's not an issue.
2: She doesn't necessarily want peace, or to put it more accurately, she's jaded enough that she doesn't think peace is ever really going to be in the cards on a large scale. She would consider getting some level of cooperation between the Tribes and the Cartel (as per Mizhara's example above)  to be a win. But she doesn't trust any of the Big4, or CONCORD, and she sees them as a threat, both to her people, her culture, and her way of life, and she's learned to be distrustful of anyone whose not helping her, and consider everyone an enemy and a threat until proven otherwise.

So, while there's definitely a possibility of us switching to NRDS, doing so would mean going through and setting pretty much every group supporting any of the 4 empires or trying to harm the angels red anyway, and it would basically net out the same way, just with 90% of the 350,000 people in eve red, which is quite a bit of standings juggling for no real gain.

That said, she doesn't go out of her way to make enemies, close avenues of negotiation, or hurt people for fun. She's a shoot first, ask questions later kind of girl, but that doesn't mean she's adverse to hearing people out at all.

[Isobel Mitar]

As this has been brought up a couple of times now in this thread, I thought to post some PF references for the curious.

There are actually two news arcs (that I know of) which deal with Angels trying to take over some Republic territory.

The first one is "the Skarkon Annexation arc":
http://www.eveonline.com/news.asp?a=single&nid=2051&tid=4
http://www.eveonline.com/news.asp?a=single&nid=2055&tid=3
http://www.eveonline.com/news.asp?a=single&nid=2084&tid=4
http://www.eveonline.com/news.asp?a=single&nid=2086&tid=3

The news items can be interpreted in several ways.

My reading is that Angels took over a poor backwater system by force for few weeks, likely by changing/re-employing the people on the top and then Republic did the same. I theorize nothing much changed in practice for most "ordinary" Skarkon residents during those few weeks of occupation, and many did not particularly care unless there was some money to be made in it. For the ordinary Skarkon poor, chieftains and warlords come and go, like bad weather.

For context, this arc happened close to Empyrean Age launch. Some "TonyG deus ex machina".

And a small followup news item:
http://www.eveonline.com/news.asp?a=single&nid=2625&tid=3

Possibly interesting to Nikita, as it describes an Angel splinter faction.

The second news arc is the "Konora takeover arc":
http://www.eveonline.com/news.asp?a=single&nid=3175&tid=9
http://www.eveonline.com/news.asp?a=single&nid=3178&tid=3
http://www.eveonline.com/news.asp?a=single&nid=3180&tid=3

Again several interpretations are possible. My reading is that "Commander Origen" together with the Angel splinter faction mentioned above try a conspiracy and a power grab. They want to carve out a bit of territory for themselves in Konora, but fail.

[Isobel Mitar]

Two other thoughts, separated form the PF post above for clarity.

First, most roleplayers separate IC and OOC to variable extent. Among other things, this separation means that to play a character that is liked and respected, one needs to play somebody other characters can like and respect.

Second, not all Matari (the most numerous race in the cluster!) are pro-Republic, or even pro-tribes. There are plenty of valid variations. For example, playing a Matari who has rejected clan life or a Matari from a criminal clan are both PF-wise quite valid RP angles.

[Seriphyn]

Meanwhile, the recent "annexation" has spurred the capsuleers of Cruoris Sepherim, a Blood Raider loyalist organisation; to act out in what CEO Cyshade claims is the resident's best interests. The enigmatic press release also made reference however, to the blooding of minors as part of an effort to "assist the peoples of Skarkon to reconsider their position". CR-SE member Rolvaag later added: "In light of the citizens of Skarkons' continued defiance of the rule of law...for every ISK Skarkon families give to the Cartel, we will take a pint of blood."

The press release has been met with almost unanimous repulsion from millions of planet-bound viewers and capsuleers alike, with many in both groups left confused by the threats.

 

[Victoria Stecker]

Its a bit more then that, Ava hints at it. There's a certain 'matari-ness' that goes beyond ethnicity. 

And Ava, thats basically what I'm trying to do, as for this:

The IC issue, the ONLY IC issue I could see, has to do with Kita's actions being contradictory to one another; IE, Matari and Slaver, Promotes peace yet engages  in piracy, etc. Pick either or.

1: She's not a slaver, so that's not an issue.

As was mentioned earlier, this was not the case a few weeks ago, which raises a lot of red flags regarding trusting the change IC. In addition, while Kita herself may no longer keep or trade slaves, she is still a supporter of the Cartel. She's going to have a very difficult time convincing people (especially matari) that she's not just another Angel, out for profits and not much more.

It is possible that she will be able to bridge the gap IC and end up with friends in both the Cartel and the pro-Matari camps, but it will require that she be very careful about what she does and how. It's just as likely that she'll end up alienating everyone except the few friends she has that don't care.

[Vincent Pryce]

being contradictory to one another; Matari and Slaver - - Pick either or.

The Thukker Tribe frowns on your lack of shades of gray and flexibility.

Slaver and Matari are not mutually exclusive. If you read up on RL tribal and clan cultures and reflect it on EVE and sprinkle a good dose of grimdark in the mix...

[Casiella]

"Hm, if we help the slavers take some folks from that clan, their power will be reduced and we'll gain more local influence and power..."

Who really believes that would never happen? Because it does/did IRL...

[Vincent Pryce]

"Hm, if we help the slavers take some folks from that clan, their power will be reduced and we'll gain more local influence and power..."

Who really believes that would never happen? Because it does/did IRL...

Exactly.

[Ulphus]

The IC issue, the ONLY IC issue I could see, has to do with Kita's actions being contradictory to one another; IE, Matari and Slaver, Promotes peace yet engages  in piracy, etc. Pick either or.

Not necessarily. Nikita has rather come across as unstable, violent, psychotic and changeable. My memory is that Nikita herself has said these things IC and OOC.

Regardless of whether she's in the Angels or has joined the Matari militia, she does rather seem to be someone that people might avoid dealing with, with good reason.

1: She's not a slaver, so that's not an issue.

Not a slaver now. Declaring stuff on IGS does not mean that people are going to automatically welcome you with open arms as a reformed character. That might come with time though, depending on her stability and other actions.

And correct me if I'm wrong, but she is still a declared supporter of the Angels, who do still raid Matari space to take slaves.

One thing that people haven't mentioned is the Voluval mark. IIRC Nikita has one of the "bad" marks? Traditionalish Matari might think that's enough reason to avoid her company.

[Esna Pitoojee]

There's also the part in your IGS thread about slave holding/trading is forbidden "without the express permission of the corporate directorate to do so". A lot of people could (and probably did) read that as "we're organized slavers now", not "I'm forbidding slavery altogether".

[Lyn Farel]

As said above, you can totally and fairly imagine that a lot of matari clans or single matari are slavers, of benefiting from slavery to save themsevles from it, or whatever grimdark reason you can find. You can perfectly play a cold and selfish clan that only cares for his own and thinks that the other tribes are the enemy. You can also play a very dark side of the "Freedom above all else" syndrome, where the people in question believe so much in it that they can't accept to see limits to their freedom and their ability to do things, whatever it is, and whatever it costs to others. It can also be played with Utopia in mind : "I care for Utopia, I would burn republic tribes to ashes to help my own kind if I had to - after all, they have always mistreated us, outcasted us, and brought death and misery upon the rejects of their society or those that do not follow their whims. True freedom lies in the Cartel, and this is the path some tribes have chosen. Mine is one of them."

[Saede Riordan]

There's also the part in your IGS thread about slave holding/trading is forbidden "without the express permission of the corporate directorate to do so". A lot of people could (and probably did) read that as "we're organized slavers now", not "I'm forbidding slavery altogether".

That was actually meant to allow things like taking on willing slaves (yes, roll your eyes) and purchasing slaves for subsequent release.

"I care for Utopia, I would burn republic tribes to ashes to help my own kind if I had to - after all, they have always mistreated us, outcasted us, and brought death and misery upon the rejects of their society or those that do not follow their whims. True freedom lies in the Cartel, and this is the path some tribes have chosen. Mine is one of them."

That's honestly sort of what she's doing, except its not the Tribes that Nikita has any overall disdain for (although there is some of that there) her hatred is mostly aimed at CONCORD and the Big4, who had 'Her People' branded as nothing more then criminals and condemned them to be hunted down as such.

[Casiella]

Okay so if the Angels are really her people, why the desire for change?

[Saede Riordan]

Okay so if the Angels are really her people, why the desire for change?

Because she wants to turn the angels into something better then they are, and she wants them to be accepted into the galactic community, which is something that being slavers directly interferes with. Also, keep in mind that while the angels are her people, she still thinks of herself as Matari, and arguing about what it means to be matari is rather what started her down this path in the first place.