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[Katrina Oniseki]

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=252819

Alright, here we go.

I mentioned some changes in the other thread, but here they are in detail. Highlights include:
Added warp speed for the travel/tank role
Removed a mid slot from cargo role and also gave them 2 highs again
Gave special bays to Iteron II, III, IV and Hoarder
Fixed the weird CPU insanity
Fixed their HP allocation favoring armor (this was leftover old design that I didn't fix first time through)
Tried to separate within roles with some kind of distinct advantage or character (Don't expect anything too extreme here, everything I said in the first thread about haulers mainly being used for their cargo capacity is still true)
Lots of other general tweaking

On the topic of the special bays: In choosing what these ships would do there were several barriers to work through. We feel that these are already pushing the boundaries of tech 1 specialization, and that's why there is no ship bays/arrays which we feel would have broken those boundaries. Also, I'm sure some of you will be concerned about the imbalance inherent in having more ships for one race than another, and I urge you to look at the feedback on this topic across the EVE community and see that the majority points towards enduring some imbalance if it allows for more character. Here is the first thread with 40 pages or so for your enjoyment: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=250079&find=unread

Looking forward to your feedback, but please don't expect version 3, I have to get on with my life at some point

SIGIL - Most HP

Amarr Industrial Skill Bonuses:
+5% Cargo Capacity
+5% Agility (was max velocity)

Slot layout: 2H, 4M(+1), 6L(+1); 1 turrets , 0 launchers
Fittings: 250 PWG(+180), 300 CPU(-450)
Cargo (capacity / capacity with max expanders, t1 expander rigs and all 5 skills): 2100(-900) / 17150m3
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 780(+624) / 1900(+884) / 2400(+1540)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 125(-30) / .86(-.14) / 11000000 / 13.1(-2.1)
Signature radius: 175(-35)
Warp speed: 6au/s (+1.5)

BADGER - Most potential Cargo and Base Cargo in role (Also battle HAM Badger)

Caldari Industrial Skill Bonuses:
+5% Cargo Capacity
+5% Agility (was max velocity)

Slot layout: 2H(+1), 6M(+2), 4L(+2); 1 turrets , 1 launchers(+1)
Fittings: 185 PWG(+135), 380 CPU(-370)
Cargo (capacity / capacity with max expanders, t1 expander rigs and all 5 skills): 3900(-225) / 19593m3
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 1440(+1166) / 750(+7) / 2060(+1200)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 127(+7) / .94(+.15) / 10650000(-2100000) / 13.8(-.1)
Signature radius: 190(-30)
Warp speed: 6au/s (+1.5)

WREATHE - Fastest

Minmatar Industrial Skill Bonuses:
+5% Cargo Capacity
+5% Agility (was max velocity)

Slot layout: 2H(+1), 5M(+3), 5L(+3); 1 turrets , 0 launchers
Fittings: 200 PWG(+155), 320 CPU(-280)
Cargo (capacity / capacity with max expanders, t1 expander rigs and all 5 skills): 2900(-400) / 18576m3
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 1140(+1061) / 1000(+257) / 2250(+1469)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 140(+15) / .81(-.19) / 10000000 / 11.2(-2.6)
Signature radius: 155(-5)
Warp speed: 6au/s (+1.5)

Iteron - Good all-around (and Drones!?)

Gallente Industrial Skill Bonuses:
+5% Cargo Capacity
+5% Agility (was max velocity)

Slot layout: 2H(+1), 5M(+3), 5L(+3); 1 turrets , 0 launchers
Fittings: 215 PWG(+170), 350 CPU(-250)
DRONES (bay / bandwidth): 30m3 / 15mbit
Cargo (capacity / capacity with max expanders, t1 expander rigs and all 5 skills): 2700(-300) / 17294m3
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 960(+881) / 1050(+269) / 2600(+1819)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 130(+5) / .78(-.22) / 11250000(+1000000) / 12.2(-2)
Signature radius: 185(-5)
Warp speed: 6au/s (+1.5)


=======================================================================================

BESTOWER - Most potential Cargo

Amarr Industrial Skill Bonuses:
+5% Cargo Capacity
+5% Max Velocity

Slot layout: 2H, 3M(-1), 6L(+2); 1 turrets , 0 launchers
Fittings: 90 PWG(+20), 230 CPU(-520)
Cargo (capacity / capacity with max expanders, t1 expander rigs and all 5 skills): 4800 / 39201m3
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 450(+255) / 850(-323) / 940(-233)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 110(-15) / .95(-.05) / 13500000 / 17.7(-.9)
Signature radius: 215(+5)
Warp speed: 4.5au/s

BADGER MARK II - Launcher, Most Base Cargo

Caldari Industrial Skill Bonuses:
+5% Cargo Capacity
+5% Max Velocity

Slot layout: 2H, 5M(-1), 4L(+1); 1 turrets , 1 launchers(+1)
Fittings: 80 PWG, 320 CPU(-680)
Cargo (capacity / capacity with max expanders, t1 expander rigs and all 5 skills): 7300(+2050) / 36674m3
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 680(+132) / 760(-256) / 810(-206)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 115 / .93 / 13000000(-500000) / 16.8(-.6)
Signature radius: 230(-20)
Warp speed: 4.5au/s

MAMMOTH - Best travel time in role

Minmatar Industrial Skill Bonuses:
+5% Cargo Capacity
+5% Max Velocity

Slot layout: 2H, 4M(-1), 5L(+1); 1 turrets , 0 launchers
Fittings: 80 PWG, 250 CPU(-500)
Cargo (capacity / capacity with max expanders, t1 expander rigs and all 5 skills): 5500(-125) / 35230m3
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 640(+249) / 600(-494) / 935(-238)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 120(+10) / .91(-.09) / 11500000(-1000000) / 14.5(-2.
Signature radius: 180(-20)
Warp speed: 4.5au/s

ITERON MARK V - Average (to balance awesome Iteron II, III, IV)

Gallente Industrial Skill Bonuses:
+5% Cargo Capacity
+5% Max Velocity

Slot layout: 2H, 4M(-1), 5L; 1 turrets , 0 launchers
Fittings: 85 PWG, 270 CPU(-580)
Cargo (capacity / capacity with max expanders, t1 expander rigs and all 5 skills): 5800(-200) / 37152m3
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 540(+71) / 650(-718) / 970(-515)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 105(-5) / .87(-.13) / 12500000(+750000) / 16.3
Signature radius: 220(-10)
Warp speed: 4.5au/s


=======================================================================================

ITERON MARK II - Mineral Bay

Gallente Industrial Skill Bonuses:
+5% Mineral Bay Capacity
+5% Max Velocity

Slot layout: 2H(+1), 4M, 4L(+2); 1 turrets , 0 launchers
Fittings: 110 PWG(+55), 250 CPU(-500)
Cargo (capacity / Mineral Bay Capacity): 550(-3200) / 50000
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 600(+444) / 700(-160) / 970(+71)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 120 / .92(-.08) / 12625000(+1625000) / 16.1(+.9)
Signature radius: 210
Warp speed: 4.5au/s

ITERON MARK III - PI Commodities Bay

Gallente Industrial Skill Bonuses:
+5% PI Commodities Capacity
+5% Max Velocity

Slot layout: 2H, 4M(+1), 4L(+1); 1 turrets , 0 launchers
Fittings: 130 PWG(+55), 270 CPU(-480)
Cargo (capacity / Planetary Commodities Hold): 550(-4325) / 55000
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 580(+306) / 740(-354) / 1000(-377)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 120(+5) / .9(-.1) / 12800000(+2300000) / 16(+1.4)
Signature radius: 195(-5)
Warp speed: 4.5au/s

ITERON MARK IV - Ore Bay (Ore includes Gas, Ice, and Mineral Ore)

Gallente Industrial Skill Bonuses:
+5% Ore Hold Capacity
+5% Max Velocity

Slot layout: 2H(+1), 4M, 4L(+1); 1 turrets , 0 launchers
Fittings: 120 PWG(+50), 260 CPU(-490)
Cargo (capacity / Ore Hold Capacity): 550(-4700) / 50000
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 590(+355) / 710(-306) / 950(-223)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 120 / .94(-.06) / 12975000(+1725000) / 16.9(+1.3)
Signature radius: 205(-15)
Warp speed: 4.5au/s

HOARDER - Ammo bay (This includes anything in the 'charge' group - bombs/cap charges/etc)

Minmatar Industrial Skill Bonuses:
+5% Ammo Bay Capacity
+5% Max Velocity

Slot layout: 3H(+1), 4M(+1), 3L; 2 turrets(+1), 0 launchers
Fittings: 180 PWG(+120), 300 CPU(-350)
Cargo (capacity / Ammo/Charge Bay Capacity): 500(-4600) / 50000m3
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 840(+566) / 800(-216) / 2100(+1084)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 120 / .85(-.15) / 10625000(-875000) / 12.5(-3.4)
Signature radius: 185(+5)
Warp speed: 4.5au/s

Ore hold includes Gas

Mineral hold does not include Gas and Ice products

Ammo hold includes cap charges, nanite paste, bombs, and anything else in the "charge" group I believe (I will confirm this soon).

We talked about doing a POS fueler (and I expect this to be the most legit complaint) but it just isn't possible atm. I can't go into specifics but please trust me here =/

Renaming strikes me as messy, but I'll bring it up with our story department and see what their opinion is.

I should be more careful about making vague references to future development. Basically, our extremely high level direction for the next while is focused towards building things - we have no idea what will fall out of this specifically, but the overall direction may lead to new potential uses for indie ships, which is why I felt fine leaving 4 of them more or less open to change down the road. Please don't read into this, there's nothing particular that I know of relative to these ships coming in the near future.

As far as the the abuse of the hoarder ammo bay for compression - the difference in potential capacity and unpacked volume between it and the old Iteron V isn't enormous. Not different enough to create a new kind of abuse, though obviously would make for more efficiency. I'll make sure we talk about if we are happy with this and if not we can adjust the unpacked volume on the Hoarder accordingly.

[Katrina Oniseki]

For some reason, I thought Louella's thread was started by me and tried to edit "my" OP in it, but only ended up quoting Lou.

I am an idiot.

[Louella Dougans]

For some reason, I thought Louella's thread was started by me and tried to edit "my" OP in it, but only ended up quoting Lou.

I am an idiot.

lol 

[Ghost Hunter]

Aha, they did do the specialized bays like I thought. Now inject some haulers into the other races and spread those bays around.

[Karmilla Strife]

I kind of like these changes better than round 1, having each industrial do something slightly better than the rest is a nice touch.

[Esna Pitoojee]

Hmmmmm.

I wonder how much of a use the ore bay will see, considering most mining ops are either done ferrying stuff to a nearby station or with an Orca/Rorqual in belt.

[Morwen Lagann]

Hmmmmm.

I wonder how much of a use the ore bay will see, considering most mining ops are either done ferrying stuff to a nearby station or with an Orca/Rorqual in belt.

TBH the changes to barges/exhumers made the Orca's ore bay mostly redundant unless the fleet is mining using Hulks or Covetors near-exclusively - a max-skilled Mackinaw has an ore bay of 35k m3, for example. The Orca is what, 50k m3?

[Katrina Oniseki]

Hmmmmm.

I wonder how much of a use the ore bay will see, considering most mining ops are either done ferrying stuff to a nearby station or with an Orca/Rorqual in belt.

50k ore or minerals in an easily skilled T1 hauler is going to see a LOT of use. It takes a long while to skill into anything with that amount of cargo space (Orca, freighter). When talking about Veldspar, you're only risking about 7 million ISK in goods too. I see no reason why you'd want to put up with using the entire Orca to carry the ore back to a trade hub or manufacturing location when you can hand it to a lower skilled corpmate and have them ferry it.

Good change is good.

[Morwen Lagann]

I'm not complaining about the changes to the haulers, Kat.

I'm saying that the addition of ore bays to barges and exhumers made the Orca's ore bay redundant months ago.

[Katrina Oniseki]

I was more responding to Esna's post. I'll remove you from the quote. 

[Alain Colcer]

everything sounds cool, except the hauler with drones.....battle iteron?

[Samira Kernher]

everything sounds cool, except the hauler with drones.....battle iteron?

Drones is awesome.

[Lyn Farel]

What's the point of iteron II compared to iteron IV ?

Anyway, specialized indus ftw.

[Katrina Oniseki]

What's the point of iteron II compared to iteron IV ?

Anyway, specialized indus ftw.

One carries Veldspar. One carries Tritanium.

[Lyn Farel]

Ah ok !