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[Vic Van Meter]

I was never torn apart.

For the record, Ari despite her Amarrian politeneness - IS AMARRIAN.  And worse, Dark Amarr.  I spent  months with people unsure of what to make of Arista.  I didn't get to burst into the scene and yell opinions I could not back up with experience - in space or in RP interaction.  EVE RP moves at a minute a minute.

"When you kill a thousand baseliners a day, it costs nothing to be polite".  Its a common stated phrase.  Sure there are going to be people who speak out -- but 90% of the time they are people speaking from positions on in-game backup ability.

That, perhaps, is the hard part for people to see - esp[ecially new players such as the OP.

the OP had issues cause they bashed heads with members of AP - a WELL established wormhole corporation - not one or two people living in a make pretend wormhole that no one else gives a fuck about.  They fight every day to keep their space.  So their IC attitudes will reflect this, as in game actions ARE IC.

Is Tibby and the TS-F memebers a pack of meanies? They're a pirate corporation that eats people for breakfast.  They ALSO fight for their space -- and not just from rolep[layers willing to fly and fight the Ebil Sansha Loyalists.

The list goes on.

EVERYONE, without fail, who talks smack, and can not back it up in space, is smacked verbally with the ultimate intent to encourage these people to literally undock and bring it.  This is EVE.  Can I capitalise EVE more? THIS IS EVE.  EVE is not an RP environment where we're all killing the same Raidbosses every week.

We ARE the raidbosses.  Or the dungeon trash. Take your pick.

Though there ARE "pure RP" encounters, they are EVE's exception - not its rule.

(in a fucking shit mood. Yay RL.)

Really?  I have a pretty good time in EVE RP, and I've never even shot another player in PVP.  In fact, that's actually a pretty important part of Constantin's character.  Sometimes, I feel like a forum troll raining on the PVP parade because I literally couldn't care less about kills and PVP if I was trying and I've never given anyone any respect for it.  It's weird, since I feel like that guy who shows up on a more PVE-centric game and pisses all over everyone for their lack of PVP skills.  I seriously think I touched off some kind of fight when I showed up because of that.

Scherezad sort of does the same thing, but she's even better.  Christ, she's so happy and nice that she almost comes off like a serial killer.

If Scherezad's player is listening... well done.

[Isis Dea]

If you kill off all the new blood before or during their attempt to stand out, you're practically slicing up any hope of new RP.

the unfortunate thing though, is that it makes sense to do that, in a lot of circumstances.

E.g. in Amarr RP, one of the main RP enemies are the heretics of the Sani Sabik. When a new Sani Sabik cult character/corporation crops up, it is logical and reasonable for the Imperial Amarr to try and stamp it out before it gets out of hand. To employ disproportionate response, to crush the heretics before they persuade more to their cause, and all that.

There are other situations where that's the case too. In-character, people have a lot of good reasons to crush any outbreaks of things, and yet that is often counter-productive out-of-character.

 

Oh there we can agree, in fact I gave a lot of flak toward the TSF recently because I felt people weren't taking proper potshots IC toward the Sansha-lovers. If it's truly within the spirit of good RP and staying true to your character in a productive manner, I can't see why anyone should hate you.

[V. Gesakaarin]

@OP

I'll be honest and say what you're facing might not be so much hostility for the sake of hostility, but if you take a moment to look around and see the fact that being in a one man roleplaying corporation or a character in an NPC corp is more or less the rule and not the exception then the reaction of, "Oh, another one," is to be expected. Hell, I faced it initially with Veik when I first started with her myself except I decided to try and corrupt people to form Pyre Falcon.

Eve to me is a social game, and you can choose to either just be another roleplayer in a one man corporation writing stories, being an IGS pundit, and posting on forums just like this or you can try and conceive of a vision and put the time and effort in to build it with others who like what you have to offer them.

Your choice, really.

[Ava Starfire]

Heya Kunarian! 

Some advice:

[11/9/13 2:32:25 PM] [Censored]: lol everyone gets sick of backstage at some point
[11/9/13 2:32:31 PM] [Censored]: only RP snobs go there
(Wasn't me, swears!)

However this is also typically said for The Summit and occasionally the Intergalactic Summit too. The RP community for EVE Online is not very friendly at all, especially when compared to communities such as The Secret World or Roleplayer Guild. Even when it comes to being on-the-ball with the Lore here, as deep as it is.

Some people are very determined to believe their piece of the pie is the best and they're empowered within a group which (should they want to or not) enforces a standard which caters to them. This standard is to met by others or they'll end up outside the social circle very quickly.

If you're outside the circle, like me, prepare for endless waves of sarcasm, mockery, and plenty of personal attacks. If you're ever needing a little pick-me-up, just take a look at what I get to sort through within my posts, as I'm pretty inviting within my type of character for that kind of attention.

In the end, you can't please anyone by being independent and/or standing out, and if you like never using constructive criticism, and prefer sarcasm alongside jabbing one-liners, this might totally be home for you! 

Truthfully I hope not.

The Lore of EVE deserves better than that,
Isis

You play a mockable character, you receive mockery.

I'd say that's pretty true to lore.

[Ava Starfire]

I have to agree with the OP and Isis. The general characteristic of the IGS often seem to be: If you say more than three sentences people will come, grab the weakest of it, get it out of context and start bashing you—ignoring the rest you’ve have said, even if it is the core of your communication. Writing just one witty line seems to be the key to “win” the argument.

That said: the IGS is for destroying sandcastles, private channels are for building them. Both ways can provide fun.

Or they will scream "MODUS PONENS" or some logic 101 shit

[Isis Dea]

@OP

I'll be honest and say what you're facing might not be so much hostility for the sake of hostility, but if you take a moment to look around and see the fact that being in a one man roleplaying corporation or a character in an NPC corp is more or less the rule and not the exception then the reaction of, "Oh, another one," is to be expected. Hell, I faced it initially with Veik when I first started with her myself except I decided to try and corrupt people to form Pyre Falcon.

Eve to me is a social game, and you can choose to either just be another roleplayer in a one man corporation writing stories, being an IGS pundit, and posting on forums just like this or you can try and conceive of a vision and put the time and effort in to build it with others who like what you have to offer them.

Your choice, really.

Only typically the others are hostile or without enough credit that even if you form a group you're still unable to talk or make a dent in the IGS community.

Something about that isn't right.

But people can keep going off to other corners instead of speaking up about it too.

As for mockable, that's in the eye of the beholder. If all you can see in a post is troll material then you're vile as an RPer. Especially if the person did put an effort into their post. You deserve every bit of the "meh" era that comes after, in time. Or to not be taken seriously.

[V. Gesakaarin]

@OP

I'll be honest and say what you're facing might not be so much hostility for the sake of hostility, but if you take a moment to look around and see the fact that being in a one man roleplaying corporation or a character in an NPC corp is more or less the rule and not the exception then the reaction of, "Oh, another one," is to be expected. Hell, I faced it initially with Veik when I first started with her myself except I decided to try and corrupt people to form Pyre Falcon.

Eve to me is a social game, and you can choose to either just be another roleplayer in a one man corporation writing stories, being an IGS pundit, and posting on forums just like this or you can try and conceive of a vision and put the time and effort in to build it with others who like what you have to offer them.

Your choice, really.

Only typically the others are hostile or without enough credit that even if you form a group you're still unable to talk or make a dent in the IGS community.

Something about that isn't right.

But people can keep going off to other corners instead of speaking up about it too.

As for mockable, that's in the eye of the beholder. If all you can see in a post is troll material then you're vile as an RPer. Especially if the person did put an effort into their post. You deserve every bit of the "meh" era that comes after. Or to not be taken seriously.

There's an IGS community? I don't know, it just seems like some sort of, "Me versus them" attempt here where, "them" is a nebulous group of people who don't agree with your character. It seems like an odd expectation to have, everyone agreeing with your thoughts and ideas, going into it in the first place to me.

Reading your thoughts here, it just sounds like you're advocating other characters to be more vociferous towards each other except your own. Unless I'm mistaken?

[Lyn Farel]

And this is why we can't have nice things. Or moreso, RP doesn't occur at the scales you see in other games, and also why you don't see a lot of variation/new blood in RP here. Those claim of the older days typically reference a time I think when the community was more inviting or accommodating. However present day I think people would rather go to other games for trying to orchestrate any public story arc or live effect to fight a common foe.

Sure the RP might be fitting to the game but it is still shitty RP.

As for those saying, "just go elsewhere" -that's cool, I will make presence elsewhere if folks want to see me there. But I'm not going to stop rubbing it in on official forums. For coming from someone who doesn't believe the golden days of EVE RP are over, someone who's been playing since 2004, I think our community can be better than the nature of the game.

And in light of how CCP is treating the lore recently, that is my only hope.

The IGS has always been said to be a cesspool. If you are looking for good RP in there, you might as well take a bath in a pond of mud, the end result would still be cleaner...

The good RP lies elsewhere, either on some channels, or in space.

I don't think it's the RP community that contributes to the atmosphere, but rather the game and the general community.

[Morwen Lagann]

And this is why we can't have nice things. Or moreso, RP doesn't occur at the scales you see in other games, and also why you don't see a lot of variation/new blood in RP here. Those claim of the older days typically reference a time I think when the community was more inviting or accommodating. However present day I think people would rather go to other games for trying to orchestrate any public story arc or live effect to fight a common foe.

Sure the RP might be fitting to the game but it is still shitty RP.

As for those saying, "just go elsewhere" -that's cool, I will make presence elsewhere if folks want to see me there. But I'm not going to stop rubbing it in on official forums. For coming from someone who doesn't believe the golden days of EVE RP are over, someone who's been playing since 2004, I think our community can be better than the nature of the game.

And in light of how CCP is treating the lore recently, that is my only hope.

The IGS has always been said to be a cesspool. If you are looking for good RP in there, you might as well take a bath in a pond of mud, the end result would still be cleaner...

The good RP lies elsewhere, either on some channels, or in space.

I don't think it's the RP community that contributes to the atmosphere, but rather the game and the general community.

I don't normally agree with Lyn on a lot of things, but this more or less sums up what I was trying to say earlier, and possibly in a better way.

The IGS is a terrible place to RP for the most part.

If you're looking to be a snarky twat or score cheap points over grammar and spelling, it's great. If you're looking to have a civil discussion where the meaning of a post is what's discussed, not the player's typing ability, it's a shitheap. A channel or small private conversation would be better.

If you're looking to shit up people's attempts at serious IC discussions about interesting subjects, it's great. If you're looking for a place where you can have those serious IC discussions without the brain-damaged peanut gallery trolls interfering, it's a terrible place. A channel or small private conversation that can by its very nature exclude the peanut gallery would be better.

If you're looking for a place where you can post an announcement for an event or something like that, it's okay - except that you have to deal with the people looking to shit anything and everything up. Channels aren't great for that unless you're making good use of MOTDs, because they depend on people being there when you make the announcement - a forum doesn't have that problem.

I think the issue is that at the end of the day, whether the IGS is IC or not is irrelevant - it is still a forum, and it will be treated as such regardless. Forums encourage that kind of behavior.

Reaction time is often rewarded in ingame channels, and the inability to think quickly is often punished. It's frequently the other way around on forums. It's a lot harder to play the "score cheapshots" game in a channel where people are responding in realtime, because if it takes you a while to come up with that oh-so-witty retort people will easily notice you just wasted so much time on it and you're more likely to look like an idiot. On a forum, a lot of people ignore the timestamps of the posts because they're not right there in your face with everything you say compared to channels in the game client, so that delay is often overlooked.

I'm sure someone's going to point out that I'm often a snarky bitch on the IGS with Morwen. Yeah, so what? Guilty as charged - the forum's useless for anything but that and making announcements for the most part, so that's exactly what I (and lots of others) am going to use it for.

[Silas Vitalia]

Isis you talk about "Shit RPers" in just about every post here.

This might not give you the sort of interaction with other RPers OOC that you are looking for.


I've noticed a lot of similarities and vitriol with both OOC and IC postings on the same subject matter, directed at the same groups of people. 

I think this will cause a self-fulfilling prophecy regarding the sort of treatment you might receive.

[Lyn Farel]

I don't normally agree with Lyn on a lot of things, but this more or less sums up what I was trying to say earlier, and possibly in a better way.

Meh, that's mostly on moderation issues... Which is not a lot of things... : (

[Vic Van Meter]

Yeah, I think we need to make a distinction.  If you're a complete pissant for OOC reasons, that doesn't necessarily mean you're a bad RPer.  Just a miserable person.

A bad RPer is one who is completely one-dimensional and boring, falling into the easy slip of the background noise.

I think the reason it's harder to differentiate here is because EVE RP tends to be pretty petty anyway, so it's sometimes hard to know if people are doing it because they're actually trying to play a character and are otherwise decent people, if they're just whiny pricks IRL and don't know how to play anything else as a character, or if they're just doing exactly what everyone else is doing because they don't know how to balance consistency and originality and they just kind of follow the bouncing ball.

Very different issues that present similar symptoms.

[V. Gesakaarin]

I used to put time and effort into the IGS, trying to make in-depth posts with intellectual clarity, then one day I took a step back and realized I was just trolling myself doing so in a venue that by and large is about high-school level political theory and cultural stereotypes. I mean really, the IGS to me is about equivalent to say a whole lot of people going, "All Americans are fat and drive SUV's while shooting assault rifles," or, "I'm French so I'm going to go eat a croissant and baguette," or, "I'm Australian so might as well put another shrimp on the barbie," or, "I'm British so I'm going to put on some Burberry m8," or the list can really go on.

I don't spend my days trying to tell random people about what defines my own cultural heritage and political system so why would my character? There's nothing wrong with trolling and shitposting in a forum such as the IGS because for my own character at least the entire thing becomes the same old, same old, and for me there's no need to invest any time or energy in providing subtlety after the nth time you post something and it all devolves into that same old.

Eventually it all becomes rather predictable, and everytime I consider putting any degree of effort into external RP whether on the IGS or elsewhere I just remember all the occasions having been struck by the derp bat wielded by others and nothing yet has changed my mind not to think it  won't happen again.

[Silas Vitalia]

I used to put time and effort into the IGS, trying to make in-depth posts with intellectual clarity, then one day I took a step back and realized I was just trolling myself doing so in a venue that by and large is about high-school level political theory and cultural stereotypes. I mean really, the IGS to me is about equivalent to say a whole lot of people going, "All Americans are fat and drive SUV's while shooting assault rifles," or, "I'm French so I'm going to go eat a croissant and baguette," or, "I'm Australian so might as well put another shrimp on the barbie," or, "I'm British so I'm going to put on some Burberry m8," or the list can really go on.

I don't spend my days trying to tell random people about what defines my own cultural heritage and political system so why would my character? There's nothing wrong with trolling and shitposting in a forum such as the IGS because for my own character at least the entire thing becomes the same old, same old, and for me there's no need to invest any time or energy in providing subtlety after the nth time you post something and it all devolves into that same old.

Eventually it all becomes rather predictable, and everytime I consider putting any degree of effort into external RP whether on the IGS or elsewhere I just remember all the occasions having been struck by the derp bat wielded by others and nothing yet has changed my mind not to think it  won't happen again.

You used to have lots of interesting things going on on the IGS   

Don't get down

[Vic Van Meter]

I used to put time and effort into the IGS, trying to make in-depth posts with intellectual clarity, then one day I took a step back and realized I was just trolling myself doing so in a venue that by and large is about high-school level political theory and cultural stereotypes. I mean really, the IGS to me is about equivalent to say a whole lot of people going, "All Americans are fat and drive SUV's while shooting assault rifles," or, "I'm French so I'm going to go eat a croissant and baguette," or, "I'm Australian so might as well put another shrimp on the barbie," or, "I'm British so I'm going to put on some Burberry m8," or the list can really go on.

I don't spend my days trying to tell random people about what defines my own cultural heritage and political system so why would my character? There's nothing wrong with trolling and shitposting in a forum such as the IGS because for my own character at least the entire thing becomes the same old, same old, and for me there's no need to invest any time or energy in providing subtlety after the nth time you post something and it all devolves into that same old.

Eventually it all becomes rather predictable, and everytime I consider putting any degree of effort into external RP whether on the IGS or elsewhere I just remember all the occasions having been struck by the derp bat wielded by others and nothing yet has changed my mind not to think it  won't happen again.

Understandable maybe, but I always thought that if you play down to the mass, you're not really helping the situation.  That's why I have so much respect for people who can still keep their characters above water, like Nicoletta and Pieter.  It's too easy to stop trying because the threshold is so low.

Just because the bar is set low is no reason for poor quality roleplaying out of people who are capable of better.  Especially since there are quite a few people who do play interesting characters that really stick out from the background static.