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[Silas Vitalia]

Destroyers aren't built to handle that kind of thing?

Those frigs will all be picking on someone and orbiting around them but your entire dessie wing will be getting plenty of good shots from different vantage points where transversal will be super low?

[Anslol]

Tell that to the Slicer moving away at 4,000+ m/s or the asshole Hawk with medium ASBs. My ship pushes 2,000 m/s and catching people in frigs is still a problem sometimes. Slicers and Hookbills man...Slicers and Hookbills.

Also a lot of us are short range and brawly to keep people webbed and scrammed to avoid said running away of the enemy so..eh. The RR helps but still.

[Silas Vitalia]

Tell that to the Slicer moving away at 4,000+ m/s or the asshole Hawk with medium ASBs. My ship pushes 2,000 m/s and catching people in frigs is still a problem sometimes. Slicers and Hookbills man...Slicers and Hookbills.

Also a lot of us are short range and brawly to keep people webbed and scrammed to avoid said running away of the enemy so..eh. The RR helps but still.

Don't try to catch them (you cant).  You are a death blossom of destroyer rageface, if they want to tango they will have to come to you and you proceed to chew them to oblivion.

I assumed your query was that they wanted to fight and you were the one that left the scene?  If those frigs want to engage then let them 'come at me bro' and die in a fire

[Anslol]

Wanted to avoid massive losses, as we had lost...nothing that roam. Our kill to loss ratio has just kept getting better and better, really good for the guys to see it.

But I guess the take away was that I should have engaged and that, even if we died, they would have had more pricey loses.

[Iwan Terpalen]

Mh'yes, it probably would've ended up a big brawly bloodbath. You might've come out ahead on ISK, but avoiding it wasn't a bad call, necessarily.

Try encouraging your destroyer guys to fit mid-range (20-30k), maybe. Enough deeps to crack most things still, pick off brawlers while they're motoring around, evaporate disruptor-range kiters.

[Anslol]

How does long range handle fast moving frigates? They just sort of lol as they zip around while artys and such miss.

[Silas Vitalia]

IIRC Dessies will have range and tracking bonuses over AF's/Frigs every day of the week?  If they can hit you you can hit them, twice as hard.

If they are buzzing around a 4k/s they aren't shooting you, shoot someone you can.

And trading a bunch of cheap dessies for t2 ships is always win.

[Anslol]

Huh...I tried blapping a condor zooming around me once at 2-3k m/s. Range went from ooh...7,000m to 12km. Couldn't touch it :\

[Silas Vitalia]

Huh...I tried blapping a condor zooming around me once at 2-3k m/s. Range went from ooh...7,000m to 12km. Couldn't touch it :\

7-12km he should be scram/web dead? 

The point is they can kite all they want and be ignored.  If they get in their weapons range your dessies should murder them.

[Anslol]

Well the condor in my solo case got scrammed and that shut down the MWD, but they still managed to use traversal to get away from me. They just slipped in and out of my scram range and sling shotted their ship. My artys couldn't keep up.

Happened again with autocannons and the son of a bitch died. Same guy too. I felt good podding him :3

Regardless, I dunno. I suck at long range with dessies lol. They just move and keep their angle good enough to avoid shots many times.

vOv

[Silas Vitalia]

Yea I'd stick with brawly stuff for most of your guys, maybe have a few fit range gear just to be able to poke at people on their way in or out.  When they are zooming straight at you with 0 transversal a few dessies with long range kit can likely get a super nice alpha on them before they start orbiting. 

I pulled it off once on an interceptor with an apoc; waited until the little zoomy bastard turned and made a run at me from like 200km doing a few km/s, soon as he got into optimal he was one-shotted and sad.

[Anslol]

We never alpha'd anything yet...we did melt a Rote scythe fleet issue pretty fast. His reinforcements showed up in local right after he popped so we rolled out quick. Was funny.

But yeah. I guess the take away was that we should have stayed and taken on the squishy pricey ones (comet, enyo, ishkurs, etc vs. med asb hawks, slicers, tormentors).

[Lyn Farel]

From experience once your fleet is big enough, long range weapons are the best. You just have to spread out and align everyone out, and shoot at stuff from various angles. If they try to primary your members, they will have to run huge distances between each one of you, while you all bleed them to death. You can also engage at most ranges. Tracking doesnt really matter when everyone is long range.

Does only work with fleets of good size though, more than 20 I would say.

[Anslol]

From experience once your fleet is big enough, long range weapons are the best. You just have to spread out and align everyone out, and shoot at stuff from various angles. If they try to primary your members, they will have to run huge distances between each one of you, while you all bleed them to death. You can also engage at most ranges. Tracking doesnt really matter when everyone is long range.

Does only work with fleets of good size though, more than 20 I would say.

....we've gotten a weee bit above 20 now >.>.....

[Ayallah]

Skirmish fleets that fight aligned are very ~no mistakes~

Try to have perches on the target before you engage on it.  The first four and a bounce are essential, six is best for maximum mobility on grid.  If you do not have those perches already made, a far bounce and a combat prober (best to use an alt) can do the job.  Use both and you are gold.  Use interceptors and you are pro level for skirmishers.   For fighting with skirmishers in FW, it is best to use range+speed over many of the slower but harder hitting skirmishers.  Talwars, SDestrels, snoop bills, Boi Heretics, Crows, etc.  (flycatcher too though I haven't seen them yet.)  All of these doctrines are light missile, what is transversal doctrines that rely on range and effective kiting to win.  They are far far more effective in lowsec than proper skirmishers simply because there are no bubbles and much smaller ranges and targets.  Skirmish Naga's won't do the jobs better than skirmish Talwars in low.  They use range, and speed/sig tanking to avoid enemy damage, the best doctrines are ones that are cap stable or very good in one area or more.  They rely on alpha as well and take time to hit their target so splitting stacks and calling volleys work well once you get the hang of it.  FC's job is to anchor and call targets, drive them away, kite effectively and prioritize fast tackle so your fleet doesn't get snatched. 

There is no better way to learn how to effectively skirmish and these kinds of fleets are often cheap, easy and loads of fun while still hitting well above their weight.  =)