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[Ciarente]

Repentence: While the brain scan delivers Information from a dying clone to a new clone, it does require...a Brain. If he's a computer inside a fleshy body(or a full robot), he's going to need to replace not just the organic shell(or robotic shell), but the computer as well. Though, to be fair, with Capsuleer level resources, having even the most sophisticated and/or illegal of computer parts replicated and replaced should not be a huge deal.

As for finding true AI possible: I believe that there are scientists working very hard right now to replicate the human brain in silicon. I defer to their expertise and say Yes, eventually.

I recall somewhere in PF there was a CEO who had themselves put into a computer. Zainou, maybe?

[Gottii]

Well, yes, thats why i said most characters will view him as crackpot or insane?   

[Silver Night]

Repentence: While the brain scan delivers Information from a dying clone to a new clone, it does require...a Brain. If he's a computer inside a fleshy body(or a full robot), he's going to need to replace not just the organic shell(or robotic shell), but the computer as well. Though, to be fair, with Capsuleer level resources, having even the most sophisticated and/or illegal of computer parts replicated and replaced should not be a huge deal.

As for finding true AI possible: I believe that there are scientists working very hard right now to replicate the human brain in silicon. I defer to their expertise and say Yes, eventually.

I recall somewhere in PF there was a CEO who had themselves put into a computer. Zainou, maybe?

Yeah, it was the founder of Zainou, Todo Kirkinen. He was, it says, the first to transfer his mind into a machine.

[Myyona]

Real AI... until we actually understand what consciousness is and how it works, that's an awkward question.

So very true.

The "real AI" suffers from the condition of trying to create something we do not fully understand. Most exemplified by the fact that while we know exactly how digital systems work, because we created them from the bottom up, we have to explore, and have so far not gotten long into, how biological systems work. Frankly I very much doubt that it will ever be possible recreate "real AI" (and by that I mean intelligence as found in the biological system) using the digital system; the physical properties of the two systems are too far apart.

That does not stop me from accepting people who want to roleplay robots in a sdi-fi setting, though. There are a lot of things that sci-fi authors write about that are not physical possible, but that does not mean they are not interesting thought experiments. I would advice though, not to believe that your robot with human emotions is anymore realistic than a unicorn.


Hm, so what I am essentially saying, is that it would be ok for me for you to roleplay an unicorn in a fantasy setting. The question remains to whether or not unicorns actually exist in this setting, or translated, if robots with humane like AI exist in Eve. There is the CONCORD ban to take into notion, so in someway it is supposedly possible (otherwise no need for a ban) and then it can likely also have been succeeded. Though, for such a robot to stand out in public, especially in an environment heavily controlled by CONCORD, appears very unlikely, or at least destined to a quick termination. Anyhow, I generally accept peoples background story whatever it is, though, depending on which character I play, I might complain why such abominations are allowed to post on the IGS.

[Rok-Yuni]

Firstly, it would seem that both myself and Synthia came up with the same basic premise for conciousness transfer.

clone gets made : tranciever gets installed. Remote access is re-activated.

Z-ARK, for you i'd say it's a lot more simple. Creating a copy of a proven technology is a lot cheaper than researching and prototyping it, so, while your first cyber-body was likely expensive and one-of-a-kind, after it's creation, you could easily have built a whole array of replacement bodies just in case you needed to reclone.

As for the transfer of conciousness and memories, as you are playing a full AI, and instant-communications exist, you could easily have a backup server somewhere that keeps a real-time copy of Z-ARK's memories and experiences, then, when a body goes pop, you simply send the activation code to the next one, and upload the most recent 'save'

As others have mentioned, I have found that the best way to play any AI slanted character, whether it be a full AI like yourself, or an AI augmented human mind like Yuni, is to keep it simple, keep it consistent and to keep specifics regarding your history somewhat vague.

I would also suggest reading up on Asimov's  laws of robotics and how they have been used in popular media. I found them useful when building Yuni's character in my head.

[Hamish Grayson]

I thought it had already been figured out that the sleepers were the Jovians sans bodies or something? "Sleeping" Jovians from the Second Jove Empire living in a Matrix style VR world or something?  Or am I just crazy?

[Repentence Tyrathlion]

"When the Sleepers were initially discovered beyond the wormholes, their exact nature of their ships were a mystery. Further study eventually revealed that they were artificial drones. They appeared to be more advanced than rogue drones technologically, but also seemed less capable of independent growth and action.

Theories say that the Sleeper drones are fully developed strong AIs which remain in thrall to the lost Sleeper race. Because of the danger of the drones, direct study has been incredibly limited. Most scientists only have access to their wrecks, delivered by fortune-seeking capsuleers. However, it is hoped that the Arek’Jaalan will coordinate efforts and allow further research into the mysterious drones.

Recently, mysterious wormholes have been seen appearing around rogue drone infestations[11], drawing concern from Sansha's Nation forces which had been using wormholes as staging grounds for their invasions[12]. Soon after, a creature called an “Awakened Informorph” was spotted across New Eden near rogue drone structures and wormholes.[13] These sightings have left researchers baffled, with some worrying that the Sleeper Drones and Rogue Drones have formed some sort of alliance."

Courtesy of the wiki.

[Morwen Lagann]

I thought it had already been figured out that the sleepers were the Jovians sans bodies or something? "Sleeping" Jovians from the Second Jove Empire living in a Matrix style VR world or something?  Or am I just crazy?

"Figured out" where "figured out" means "entirely revealed within Templar One to parties who will not talk about it to anyone for various reasons that may include being dead."

It's not really 'available' information IC, and Myyona's research paper that was released shortly before the book was never verified or validated by Hilen Tukoss, iirc, so IC it should be taken with a grain of salt. Unfortunately.

[Hamish Grayson]

I'm a little puzzled at your quandary re: podding.  You're implying that the hardclone 'burn scan' retrieves some mystical and magical thing called 'consciousness', separate from science and utterly unfathomable, and wings it across the stars by unknown means.  Exaggerated, but that's the logical premise of your question.  Since Eve is a (relatively) hard science universe, though, this clearly isn't the case.  A brain scanner simply reduces the memories and mind of an individual into data that can be fed through the relays to the appropriate destination.  I'd honestly argue that an AI would find it easier to use a pod-style hardclone system, with some suitable adaptation to connect with the scanner - or even just use custom-built pod interfaces.  We've got instant communication across the known universe, and the ability to send an entire mind's worth of data (can't be small) instantly as well (how else could some poor schmuck who got old fashioned doomsdayed in his pod still be around?)
 

I agree with this, the podding mechanism would be fairly easy for an AI.   The hard part would be explaining away how CONCORD doesn’t come screaming in with pitchforks and torches.     This isn’t some random capsuleer who doesn’t do any more evil than any other capsuleer but just happens to claim ties to the Angel Cartel…high level rogue AI is one of the things that seems to really freak them out.   

I’m all about the Stargods being out reach of the mere baseliners but everything from PF and ingame mechanics suggest to me that while CONCORD can’t completely enforce their law over a bunch of demigods they still observe everything we do in highsec and quite a bit of what we do in low and null and pick their battles.   They also have control the FTL network we use to interface with the market, chat with each other and transmit our minds over when we are podded.  So, they'd know about him and be able to box him in pretty easy.

For an emergent AI, why not hide out among the rogue drones instead of exposing ones self to CONCORD by mimicking a capsuleer?

[Hamish Grayson]

I thought it had already been figured out that the sleepers were the Jovians sans bodies or something? "Sleeping" Jovians from the Second Jove Empire living in a Matrix style VR world or something?  Or am I just crazy?

"Figured out" where "figured out" means "entirely revealed within Templar One to parties who will not talk about it to anyone for various reasons that may include being dead."

It's not really 'available' information IC, and Myyona's research paper that was released shortly before the book was never verified or validated by Hilen Tukoss, iirc, so IC it should be taken with a grain of salt. Unfortunately.

For the record, I never cared much about the sleeper lore but it seemed pretty obvious even to me thats what was up as soon as I explored my first WH.    Well, I didn't know it was the Second Jovian Empire or what not but that somebody was napping in the Matrix because of a plauge was pretty clear.   I think I said so on these forums too.

/smug

[Hamish Grayson]

Ok I lied, more smugness

http://backstage.eve-inspiracy.com/index.php?topic=967.0

I was under the impression that the sleepers drones worked like the androids in the movie surrogates and that is why they are called sleepers.  Their bodies are in stasis while their minds interact in some virtual world and some of them are supposed to upload into the sleeper drones to protect the rest of them.
It could be that they don't even use their bodies anymore and their minds have been transferred into hardware, this mirror could be a back up for their minds in case they die or the main server for their virtual world 'shard' goes down.

No corroborating information to support that theory Grayson, sorry. It would appear that the Sleepers are just artificial intelligences that are emerged as needed.

[Synthia]

I think Synthia's construction - with the human flesh&blood robot controlled remotely, might be enough that DED can't get a warrant to take action. I.e. you could tell the robots were robots if you dissected them, but you'd need a warrant to do that. And so long as Synthia isn't breaking any laws, then that warrant will not be issued.

one of the DED actors said something along those lines anyway.

[Louella Dougans]

I.e. you could tell the robots were robots if you dissected them, but you'd need a warrant to do that.

I think the Amarr epic arc kind of has stuff related to this, with the Sansha artificial impostor person. If you dissected them, you'd find the implants, and be able to go "hmm". But being able to arrest and do that to the impostor is almost impossible, given the status of the person they're impersonating.

[Karmilla Strife]

Or you could tell that they were really dedicated to their delusion.

[Myyona]

"Figured out" where "figured out" means "entirely revealed within Templar One to parties who will not talk about it to anyone for various reasons that may include being dead."

It's not really 'available' information IC, and Myyona's research paper that was released shortly before the book was never verified or validated by Hilen Tukoss, iirc, so IC it should be taken with a grain of salt. Unfortunately.

Ah yes, my master piece and culmination of my efforts into the A'J project. Let me be so bold to link the article here. One might notice, how I pull many different pieces together, like old COSMOS portals in Traun and bits of mission background info, and attempt to come up with a plausible explanation that can include them all. Quite contrary to Tony G, I say, who never hesitated to contradict previous pieces of lore if they did not fit into the story he wanted to tell.

And while yes, Dr. Tukoss never made an opinion on the article, it is really not necessary. The theory presented in the article was shown not to be directly wrong, given the OOC info provided by T1 (note: the article was written before I read T1). And as a theory, it is up to people to decide if they believe the evidence support it. If they think not, they would have to either present a different theory based on the same pieces of evidence or find new pieces to support a contradiction. Both things would have my interest.