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[Myyona]

It does appear as a rather stacked one-sided battle. Both in space and on ground.

Unless some nullbear alliance get involved on the Provist side of course. But I do not foresee it if there is an option to get on a live event titan killmail.

[Aelisha Montenagre]

BAM right in my work day. 

Oh well, prepping for 10 years of 'You didn't quit your job to turn up, so you're not a real Caldari supporter'. 

As for the rest, I wish I didn't agree with Vikarion, Orange and Laerise (for the sake of the fiction, not because of the people mind you!) but my only hope is that CCP want to prove you all wrong.  If not, your conjecture seems pretty solid to me . 

[Caellach Marellus]

Pretty sure the last time anyone tried to organise enough people to shoot a Titan, there were plenty of Caldari supporters on the otherside endlessly RRing it so that it barely took damage.

That said, this is a bit of a self fulfilling prophecy of "Oh CCP isn't going to let us win this, so let's not bother entering." Look at it this way, you've more chance of keeping it there, than the railroaded unstoppable plotline where the Gallente didn't get a chance to defend it's inception.

[Aelisha Montenagre]

The point is more 'we are completely locked out, either by standings or by FW allegiance (and by proxy, standings if they quit FW), leaving an entity that has claimed it will light up the titan (and rightly so by virtue of their roleplay direction) if it so much as glances at the planet the wrong way as the majority representation'. 

As for me, it's the standard work day issue, but there's no helping that as CCP need the marketing this event will provide for PAX, GDC and other such events, and so putting it off till saturday would be self defeating in that regard.  I'm not usually in the defeatism camp, but Vikarion et al. are making a lot of sense on this specific issue.

[Caellach Marellus]

Isn't there a limit to police spawns? I've recalled people tanking them before and letting other people slip through unhindered.

Sure you require a lot more logistical planning than the other side, but you're attempting an invasion in order to carry out a rescue operation. If CCP were to make some magical means to evade the consequences that come with the situation, that would be more railroading than the actual scenario as it's presented. For years the Caldari were given something for nothing in having it there storyline wise, and now you have to put in a bit of planning and effort in defending it?

Struggling to have sympathy here.

[Aelisha Montenagre]

Faction police response scales with security status, so 1.0 will be pretty horrendous, not to mention that the logistics of moving in the heavy assets to defend will be made virtually impossible by the speed with which scrambling occurs. 

Your sympathy is not required, but at least be honest that you lack sympathy because things are going your way.  It's a perfectly valid approach.  A 'bit' of planning is somewhat of an injustice to the scale of the situation.

[Desiderya]

A 'bit of planning' is an understatement.

[K_Wiroshoda]

Look at it this way, you've more chance of keeping it there, than the railroaded unstoppable plotline where the Gallente didn't get a chance to defend it's inception.

[Aelisha Montenagre]

Look at it this way, you've more chance of keeping it there, than the railroaded unstoppable plotline where the Gallente didn't get a chance to defend it's inception.

Fallacious reasoning.  A cut scene is more fun (and pretty) than turning up to a table top game to be told that today most of the group gets to ride Pegasi, but your mode of transport will be to do 'the worm' over caltrops and thumbtacks.  The comparison is also void as live events were not a thing, and the inclusion of ANY player was not on the table.

I must reiterate that I am arguing in terms of 'I can see their (Vikarion, Orange et al.) point(s)'.  I'll wait and see how the event goes to see if it validates their POV.  Suffice to say it will take more than the titan being destroyed for me to cry foul - our collective love of big explosions is overwhelming, but the factors against the inclusion of arguably the biggest anti-federation bloc have raised some valid and insightful points. 

Suffice to say, fair isn't a requirement (it'd be silly for everything to be balanced), but it must sting those rendered impotent to intervene in a vital aspect of their roleplay, when 'given the chance' at least informally. 

[Caellach Marellus]

Your sympathy is not required, but at least be honest that you lack sympathy because things are going your way.  It's a perfectly valid approach.  A 'bit' of planning is somewhat of an injustice to the scale of the situation.

Nothing is going my way at all, well other than the opportunity to remove another of Tony G's terrible plothole legacies.

Also live events existed way before TEA and the cutscenes. Remember the Serpentis Titan?

[Aelisha Montenagre]

Remember the dead zone between Aurora and the Sansha events? 

I'm not making things up just to attack your argument Cael.

[ArtOfLight]

So, this is going to sound really callous to say but please hear me out, I'm not intending it to sound cold.

The reality of the situation is that it's supposed to be stacked against the Caldari. The Caldari grabbed Caldari Prime during a very precisely timed sneak attack when CONCORD was down and Tripwire was sabotaged. They know they can't hold it, that's the whole reason for the Titan and the threat of bombing civilians, it keeps the Federation at bay. If all-out conflict were to break out, the Caldari would have the odds stacked against them.

With all of that said, perhaps CCP is planning on spawning CalNav support to counter-balance the FedNav spawns? I'm pretty sure GMs can handle specific processes like that. I'm holding out hope that something has been worked out to level the playing field a bit for the players but I expect the odds to still be stacked against the Caldari, it's the reality of the situation. (I just hope "stacked against" doesn't mean "impossibly so and not fun at all").

I'd attend as Malcolm, but I'll be at work.

[Caellach Marellus]

Remember the dead zone between Aurora and the Sansha events? 

I'm not making things up just to attack your argument Cael.

Point, but still, for years the other side of the fence has had to deal with railroaded RP plotline after another. Remember what kicked all this off with the Broker, Noir and a suicidal Nyx. The chance to actually do something in game this time for either side is far better than having another cutscene and "Oh the titan blew up/glassed a planet/grew arms and danced the macarena"

Because if the above happened without player involvement, the crying would be immense.

[Aelisha Montenagre]

I agree with both of you (Cael and ArtofLight), and I think that for the health of the game (marketing and subscriber-wise) SOMETHING blowing up is going to happen and it will be glorious.

I must state that my sympathies and recognition of plight are directed at the fact that a lot of people who truly feel invested, and who have had the carrot dangled, are going to come off feeling sore.  Balance is a rare thing - IRL we have entire religions based on that concept as some form of nigh unobtainable concept so I consider that some indicator of how frequently we should expect it.   But the fact that a subset of the population is going to feel rightfully disenfranchised should not be ignored.  They are not whining - they are valued and equal players in our world, who are upset that they cannot have a hand in their faction's actions.  Should they be guaranteed that input?  Not for me to say.  But I recognise their frustration. 

With railroaded events (completely ignoring any personal issues you, I or anyone else may have with he who shall not be named), both sides had their cherring hordes and disappointed supporters.  The loss of Otro was a wrecking blow to many in the Liberal Caldari bloc, and even Patriots didn't clap with glee about it (at least too openly).  The retaking of Caldari Prime is an often weaponised barb to sling at the Gallente, but the logistical nightmare it represents is a constant murmur of discontent in the Caldari community I have contact with.

To my mind, it is not irrelevance to the story line we fear or bemoan, but irrelevance to our peers.  We are competitive to the point of viciousness sometimes, and it will no doubt be a point for years to come of 'Where were you when we smashed your titan?'.  All role players have pride in something, at least them selves and sometimes in the community as a whole, but most often in a given PF supported element they chose as their own anchor. 

So please take my words at face value when I say; I do not promote pandering, but the degradation of people's concern and vocal presentation of that concern, that they will be made irrelevant in respects to something they have spent substantial emotional and temporal resources contributing to, is a little unfair. 

[Gabriel Darkefyre]

It was indeed possible to Permanently tank the Faction Police in Highsec regardless of the Sec Status of the System. While I was in Shadows of the Federation, we did it several times in various systems including Jita.

At the time, it took 10 guys going in first with Frigates, speed tanked to hell and back. They'd warp out to safespots, pick a direction and hit the MWD. Spawns would trigger on them but due to the speed of the ships, they'd be out of range before they managed a lock. The spawn would despawn and then respawn again to try to get the Frigate.

Meanwhile, anyone else in the system was free to operate without any interference at all from the Navy once all the Frigates were engaged because CCP Limited the Navy response to 10 Spawns per system.

-----

Please note however that it's been at least a year or two since I last saw this tactic being used. I'm not sure if the Navy still stay on their original Target or if they shift to a new target when they lose contact with the first one.

If it still works though, then with a small bit of co-operation between the Caldari Militia Members, they can effectively shut down the Navy response and operate freely during this event