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[Vikarion]

Vikarion, seriously, you need to take your bitter and bury some of it. I don't agree with the way Vincent portrayed his examples (from a Cadlari-IC viewpoint as opposed to OOC-unbiased) but he has a point. To begin with CCP don't only bitch on the State, or the Fed, or the Empire or anyone, everyone get their rounds, and that's a fact many of us lament. Also, CCP has not made any indication that all they ever wish to do is screw the RP'ers over.

Calm down, remove those sot-covered sunglasses and relax a little. It's not nearly as pitch-black as you see it.

Bitterness is fun. 

Also, pessimism and poor expectations tend to be much more accurate predictors of the world than hopefulness and optimism. As I consider it, we are all born with one sure truth in our lives, and that is that said life is going to end, almost certainly with a lot of pain. And there's going to be a lot of pain in between, with your own biological systems motivating you to avoid death primarily through fear and pain.

So, you know, expecting that CCP is going to add to that pain is pretty much the safe bet. And they'll probably do it to everyone. But I only have any interest at all (and it is waning) in the Caldari - and if I'd been smart, I wouldn't have jumped into that. Character-driven RP, like Cia and others engage in, gives much less opportunity for others to screw you, I think. Unfortunately, I was stupid and got interested in the faction. This has not and will not be repeated in the future with other fictional settings, as CCP has taught me an excellent lesson about becoming invested emotionally in a fictional setting.

[Lithium Flower]

Instead of living to predictions or expectations, either pessimistic or optimistic, it is much better to live here and now! With what we have, and deal with it!
It will change when it will change, and then we will think how to play about it, but now it didnt happen, and we can't be sure if it actually will or won't happen!
It is equally bad to live in past and in future.
But the present is all yours, so use it at full extent!

[Uraniae]

Bitterness is fun. 

I'm getting a little distressed by this sort of common perspective among gamers in general and roleplayers specifically.  It seems that more and more often that a player, who has no real authority in design or decision making in a game, feels that changes to the game that do not mesh well with their own perception of the game consider it some sort of personal attempt by the actual creators of the game setting to ruin their day, personally.

CCP and every other developer are not setting out to screw you.  You signed up for the potential to screw yourself.  For every change and development in the game's storyline you are presented with a myriad of choices that boil down to two overarching paths.  You can either embrace the change and work with it, incorporating and building upon it for your personal roleplay.  Or you can hit it in the face with a shovel, rant and rail against it and embrace your opposition to the change as part of your personal roleplay. 

You get to make your story in EVE. 
You do not get to make EVE's story.
CCP gets to make EVE's story. 
CCP does not get to make your story in EVE.

[Lithium Flower]

^ this.

Because it is their game, and they are masters. Whatever you try, whatever you do, in the end the gazebo will kill you.
So, just play their game, enjoy their game.
And try not to awaken gazebos 

[Aelisha Montenagre]

I never knew large, open canvas structures could be so dangerous.  Vigilance is our sword and shield!

[Mithfindel]

Hey guys, here's a fun thought.

What if the new boss is worse than the old boss? :p

First thought at this post: "Istvaan Shogaatsu, Executor of the Caldari State". Admittedly, this would probably be a different meaning of "bad".

[Lyn Farel]

I have never been happy with the portrayal of the Mandate, and even less since TEA, I have never been happy with the portrayal of CONCORD, and even less since TEA.

I am not bitching all the time about it. It brings different opportunities, even if lore wise it's not the best looking option.

A lot of Caldari RPers should relax these days. Seriously, it's palatable ICly too, and very hostile as an OOC atmosphere.

[orange]

Really, why, but why the State has to be ruled by "multiple heads"? Theoretically, multiple head scenario gives slower, but more balanced and wise decisions, while singular head gives quick, but not optimal decisions. For fast pacing and eventful scenarios the later still is better, because fast reaction is crucial for surviving in changing environment. That's why there is no democracy in military ranks. That's why you are put under tribunal for not following order, even it wasn't the best and optimal solution.
So tell me, why, i won't be afraid to say, the most progressive society, should cling to tradition if it endangers survival?

Because a mix of the two systems, ie a small group of supposedly intelligent, meritorious leaders can come to a reasonable rapid solution at the strategic level.

Sometimes the best way to ensure survival is to actually slow down in a fast pace/eventful scenario if at all possible.  I know that is counter to the scenario, but in a fast pace, event-filled scenario, random action can be worse than no action and deliberate thought-through action can have a huge impact.

[Vikarion]

Instead of living to predictions or expectations, either pessimistic or optimistic, it is much better to live here and now! With what we have, and deal with it!
It will change when it will change, and then we will think how to play about it, but now it didnt happen, and we can't be sure if it actually will or won't happen!
It is equally bad to live in past and in future.
But the present is all yours, so use it at full extent!

I don't agree. Everything we do in our modern lives relies, in some part, upon predictions. "I'm going to buy groceries tomorrow" is a claim made upon the prediction that a truly incredible number of people will perform their particular jobs well enough to keep a store open, stocked, and ready. It's also a prediction that you won't get horribly sick, that you'll have transportation, that no natural disasters will strike, etc. We do live in the future, in fact, the ability to try to live in the future is probably what has given us our advantage, from a natural selection point of view.

Similarly, we can't help but live in the past, because the past is what has made things the way they are, and is probably the best predictor we have of the future. If seeds planted grew into crops last year, they'll probably do it this year, and etc.

In fact, discussions about the past and potential future are most of what we talk about as humans. So I find it difficult to imagine how you could "live in the present" without an eye to both past and future.

[Vikarion]

I'm getting a little distressed by this sort of common perspective among gamers in general and roleplayers specifically.  It seems that more and more often that a player, who has no real authority in design or decision making in a game, feels that changes to the game that do not mesh well with their own perception of the game consider it some sort of personal attempt by the actual creators of the game setting to ruin their day, personally.

CCP and every other developer are not setting out to screw you.  You signed up for the potential to screw yourself.  For every change and development in the game's storyline you are presented with a myriad of choices that boil down to two overarching paths.  You can either embrace the change and work with it, incorporating and building upon it for your personal roleplay.  Or you can hit it in the face with a shovel, rant and rail against it and embrace your opposition to the change as part of your personal roleplay. 

You get to make your story in EVE. 
You do not get to make EVE's story.
CCP gets to make EVE's story. 
CCP does not get to make your story in EVE.

Do I think it that CCP makes personal attempts to ruin player's gameplay? Well, yes. A company which makes a game designed around the ideas of griefing, robbery, theft, and violence probably does occasionally indulge in some griefing themselves. That's just the nature of the beast. I certainly couldn't say that they are doing so right now, but some previous events did seem pretty close to that.

And yes, signing on to a faction is essentially signing up to be screwed over. However, I think you are confusing the fact that that happens with the idea that one should accept that that happens, no matter how it happens. In general, when we accept the specific fictional guidelines of a universe (say, that the Amarr Empire operates a certain way, that there are no magic powers, etc), it's probably reasonable to expect that Magic Psychic Zombie Space Princesses with Superweapons won't get pulled out, just as it is also reasonable to assume that CCP won't decide tomorrow that all capsuleers are ponies from the MLP universe.

CCP certainly has the right to do whatever they want with their product, just as you have the right to pour maple syrup on your head and lie on an anthill. But that doesn't mean that others are required to think that it's a good idea and not complain. In this case, to extend the analogy, quite a few Caldari RPers spent quite a bit of time styling the hair and making it look better, while still along the lines of what CCP had created.

The problem with embracing Eve's story is that CCP has been busily creating more and more disconnects between what was, and what is. This means that those who invested in the RP scene back then now have to decide whether to ret-con and adjust their characters (hey! actually, we love dictatorships after all!), find something else to RP with (and how long until CCP blunders through that?) or toss out RP altogether (screw you guys, I'm going home).

So no, it's not as simple as "adapt, and HTFU". CCP has shown no respect for the fictional setting it started out with, and now older players have to figure out how to, essentially, be horrible writers who don't care about continuity, characterization, or realism.

[Lithium Flower]

Really, why, but why the State has to be ruled by "multiple heads"? Theoretically, multiple head scenario gives slower, but more balanced and wise decisions, while singular head gives quick, but not optimal decisions. For fast pacing and eventful scenarios the later still is better, because fast reaction is crucial for surviving in changing environment. That's why there is no democracy in military ranks. That's why you are put under tribunal for not following order, even it wasn't the best and optimal solution.
So tell me, why, i won't be afraid to say, the most progressive society, should cling to tradition if it endangers survival?

Because a mix of the two systems, ie a small group of supposedly intelligent, meritorious leaders can come to a reasonable rapid solution at the strategic level.

Sometimes the best way to ensure survival is to actually slow down in a fast pace/eventful scenario if at all possible.  I know that is counter to the scenario, but in a fast pace, event-filled scenario, random action can be worse than no action and deliberate thought-through action can have a huge impact.

This is not exactly a type of discussion I wanted to have. I don't want to make choice and argue about what is better between these two forms. I just made a simple attempt to diminish significance of decentralized management. I would do counterwise  if it was said, that Caldari State must to have a single ruler.

I would rather ask the main question again,
but why the State has to be ruled by "multiple heads"?

This is a very minor concept, and I really don't see why it should be important. Having one or multiple heads is not the idea that defines Caldari. It doesn't define the State, nor society, nor either of existing races, countries, cultures or nationalities in our world. You don't gonna say something like: "Hello, Im Jane Smith and Im ruled by decentralized government." There are many others concepts, that are greater and way more significant, there are loyalty and treachery, honor and infamy, greediness and generosity, devotion and liberty, cold calculations and emotions, hatred and love.

There are too many artificial, hand-made minor concepts, that some people bring as ultimate truths. Because of these insignificant concepts many lives throughout human history have been lost. And I beg you not to bring them at least here, and lets better concentrate on something that is really important. If we have to define Caldari, we need to discuss mentality, culture, beliefs and characters, but not such things as being ruled by one man or many.

[Svetlana Scarlet]

This is a very minor concept, and I really don't see why it should be important. Having one or multiple heads is not the idea that defines Caldari.

Except that it does -- or rather, it is a symptom of the Caldari mindset. The inherently suspicious, close-knit social structure that distrusts centralized authority, because it was the thing that nearly destroyed them 300 years ago. The Caldari have a decentralized government because they do not want to be put under anyone's thumb, and because none of the eight megacorporations trusts the others further than they can throw them. That is what was thrown under the bus on a whim by the development of Tibus Heth, where evidently every megacorporate CEO and board member became guillible, weak pawn of a man who they had no reason to be afraid of.

[Lithium Flower]

Instead of living to predictions or expectations, either pessimistic or optimistic, it is much better to live here and now! With what we have, and deal with it!
It will change when it will change, and then we will think how to play about it, but now it didnt happen, and we can't be sure if it actually will or won't happen!
It is equally bad to live in past and in future.
But the present is all yours, so use it at full extent!

I don't agree. Everything we do in our modern lives relies, in some part, upon predictions. "I'm going to buy groceries tomorrow" is a claim made upon the prediction that a truly incredible number of people will perform their particular jobs well enough to keep a store open, stocked, and ready. It's also a prediction that you won't get horribly sick, that you'll have transportation, that no natural disasters will strike, etc. We do live in the future, in fact, the ability to try to live in the future is probably what has given us our advantage, from a natural selection point of view.

Similarly, we can't help but live in the past, because the past is what has made things the way they are, and is probably the best predictor we have of the future. If seeds planted grew into crops last year, they'll probably do it this year, and etc.

In fact, discussions about the past and potential future are most of what we talk about as humans. So I find it difficult to imagine how you could "live in the present" without an eye to both past and future.

Oh no no, I didnt mean you should ignore past and future. Of course you have to look in both sides. Learn from the past and plan for the future. What I did mean, is that you shouldnt devote your whole life to the past or future. Everything around us evolves, and we have to accept it as it is now, and not as it was before. We have to accept it as it is now, and not as it is expected to be in future. Because the life is the greatest Gift, that time gives to us, and every moment is unique, so enjoy it now, and then it will be gone forever and nothing will ever bring it back.
Shall you live by the past or look only to future, you will miss the life itself, everything that surrounds you, it will pass by, leaving only phantoms and emptiness behind.

[Lithium Flower]

This is a very minor concept, and I really don't see why it should be important. Having one or multiple heads is not the idea that defines Caldari.

Except that it does -- or rather, it is a symptom of the Caldari mindset. The inherently suspicious, close-knit social structure that distrusts centralized authority, because it was the thing that nearly destroyed them 300 years ago. The Caldari have a decentralized government because they do not want to be put under anyone's thumb, and because none of the eight megacorporations trusts the others further than they can throw them.

Such symptoms are peculiar to confined time and space, but they are not universal constants. The society evolves, taking form that it believes to benefit the best. Or just was given a chance to become something new. This is a distinctive trait of a progressive society rather than the one that is stagnating.

[Svetlana Scarlet]

Cultural mindsets do not generally change in the space of a few months. They are generational changes, and there's been no evidence of any such change or reason for such change.