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[scagga]

We are ready to do away with human societal 'norms' at a whim; ethics/morality, empathy with the non-capsuleer patatiots, sense of civic duty, remorse, etc. (see ethics/morality thread, for instance).

Yet I find there is a preponderance of sexuality amongst the capsuleer caste.  Men roleplaying capsuleer-grade semen receptacles. Stand back a moment and ponder.

Back to basics, a question of how becoming a capsuleer and the associated technology modulates the perception of pleasure.

In my view, the ecstacy of orgasm is likely to be inferior to the pleasures that can be gained through legal psychotropics, direct brain stimulation, many etc's.  Observe how drug-addicts on earth may lose complete interest in sex. Observe how those who become wrapped up with their carreers/material success may follow suit.

Now, imagine a universe where technology exists that can replicate your entire body down to the molecular level. Is it not conceivable that the highest degree of pleasure can be obtained by the flip of a switch, preceded by a quick transfer of isk?  The effort vs. reward ratio in this situation is highly biased towards mobilising techology to our favour.

I find this theory of capsuleer behaviour to be more efficient and more in line with the time afforded by a capsuleer caste's 'busy' and meaningful lifestyle.  I mean, would you commute to the planet you came from to eat dinner with your 'family', or would you enjoy a meal exactly tailored to your every gustatory desire?  Would you engage in the courting behaviour of a lowly planet-bound teenager, acting 'baitfully' in order to achieve a mere kiss or fluid exchange, or would you activate a simulation that would achieve these objectives to whatever degree you pleased (case study: Japanese boys who fall in love with simulated video game girlfriends).  If a person went so far to become a capsuleer and still want to hunt pussy, I'd ask him what's wrong with him...why he wasn't going for the optimal simulation?  Simulations could so real you wouldn't be able to tell it wasn't real in any discernable way, as you could use reader-technology to anticipate what you'd expect in reality and have it adjust realtime to thwart your suspicions.

Why would capsuleers do things the half-assed way?

I repeat, it's about effort vs reward. Time is isk, pleasure is a sum of neurons firing a certain way in a certain part of the brain.  Why would such frivolities as 'the chase' be so valued when all comparables had been abandoned? Why would you work so hard to get so little?  I find it is not consistent with the enhanced abilities and privelages afforded to the capusleer caste.  However...it is conceivable that it is consistent with the desires of the players behind the characters.

I conjecture that the degree of sexualisation is not so well explained by being a simple case of 'roleplaying the character', but rather better understood as one of 'characterising the roleplay'.  It is so desirable to throw off the 'restrictions' that the players find in their real lives - thus throwing away duties and responsibilities comes naturally, throwing away the natural 'cares and ugh worries' is fine. Throwing away sexual things for some reason...which is entirely in the same category in my opinion...doesn't happen?  What hypocrisy. I ask you, what prominence have sexual relations had in capsuleers in the prime fiction?

I expect retorts to come along the lines of:

- "Well nobody is an authority to talk on good/bad roleplay!" (my reply here is that you're dodging the argument and should be addressing my points, as I'm not talking about good/bad roleplay, I'm theorising about the role that sex has )

- "Well I think that sexual nature would be retained blah blah blah" (my reply here is to kindly refute my arguments against that - I might be wrong)

- "Well my character grew up in blah blah land and logically has blah blah abuse/perversions/sexual appetite that can't be satisfied by uber-technology." (my reply here is to refute my arguments, and explain why talking about your imagined character has any bearing on them)

[Myyona]

The dreaded/informative Empyrean Age novel did have capsuleers engaged in the art of sex and they were quite primitive about the technique as far as I recall. But that is about it for sex in EVE prime fiction to my knowledge.

[Casiella]

The dreaded/informative Empyrean Age novel did have capsuleers engaged in the art of sex and they were quite primitive about the technique as far as I recall. But that is about it for sex in EVE prime fiction to my knowledge.

"Primitive"? It was zero-g!

Scagga, it seems like most of your points relate to variations of the following statement:

In my view, the ecstacy of orgasm is likely to be inferior to the pleasures that can be gained through legal psychotropics, direct brain stimulation, many etc's.

Well... okay. So this is your view. It's one I share for Casiella, actually, as I've long RPed that her cybernetic implant can take care of her physical sexual needs better than any lover.

However, I recognize as a player that sex is about far more than physical stimulation, at least once you're out of the "planet-bound teenager" phase. That tends to affect my view of the character, since she lacks for anything resembling intimate human companionship.

And your post primarily revolves around your views and conjectures. Those aren't things to refute, necessarily. Your views are interesting, of course, but not necessarily something to be proved or disproved. Like Silver says, it's a big cluster and we have a LOT of capsuleers.

[Saxon Hawke]

Scagga's post immediately brought to my mind Edgar Friendly's line from the movie demolition man, delivered in Dennis Leary's trademark staccato fashion:

Edgar Friendly: You see, according to Cocteau's plan, I'm the enemy, 'cause I like to think; I like to read. I'm into freedom of speech and freedom of choice. I'm the kind of guy who likes to sit in a greasy spoon and wonder, "Gee, should I have the T-bone steak or the jumbo rack of barbecued ribs with the side order of gravy fries?" I WANT high cholesterol. I wanna eat bacon and butter and BUCKETS of cheese, okay? I want to smoke a Cuban cigar the size of Cincinnati in the non-smoking section. I want to run through the streets naked with green Jell-o all over my body reading Playboy magazine. Why? Because I suddenly might feel the need to, okay, pal? I've SEEN the future. Do you know what it is? It's a 47-year-old virgin sitting around in his beige pajamas, drinking a banana-broccoli shake, singing "I'm an Oscar Meyer Wiener".

I agree with Myyona that sex is (or at least should be) about much more than physical stimulation and that your assumptions are made broadly for all capsuleers.

I have long role-played that Saxon is a pod pilot because it is the best and most direct way to achieve a safe and prosperous Intaki. He finds being in a pod bothersome and claustrophobic. He would much rather be in the airy halls of home with his wife and children.

Saxon also forgoes the use of all but the most necessary implants. He maintains only one clone with "optional" augmentation and uses it only in the most dire of emergencies.

Saxon looks at "post-humanist" capsuleers with pity and an example of what can happen to a person who loses sight of what is truly most important in life.

You may have noticed "did you know" about the inscription Saxon puts on all of his ships: "A man travels the universe in search of what he needs and returns home to find it." That is at the core of his motivations.

As for the OP "over-sexualized" is a judgment call and sexual appetites can vary significantly between individuals. I think what you meant was hyper-sexualized behavior and why it seems so prevalent  in some RP communities.

I attribute it to the basic need of most people to express themselves sexually. For a number of gamers it is easier and more within their comfort zone to make these expressions in whichever game it is they happen to be playing.

[Goshien]

Possible that the effects of being a pod pilot would change sexual drive, but if not, I see nothing unusual about the behavior. Sex is pretty hardwired into the human brain and there's no reason to suspect that would change. If raised to the status of a rich celebrity, the opportunities would become abundant. Sure, you could get technology to help you, but I'm certain there would be any number of groupies willing to help a pod pilot out.

[lallara zhuul]

I think Scagga is on to something there.

If you spend most of your time in a pod (and buy the view that the ship becomes your body) then your libido quite naturally will change, because you will not have the constant barrage of stimuli from your body that give you those pleasant feelings when you let your mind stray into sex.

It may even explain why pod pilots turn into such combat monsters, they try to fill that void with something.

[Ghost Hunter]

I've generally been under the impression that for the most part, Capsuleers have access to materials that vastly outperform anything traditional sex could ever achieve.

Whether or not they use it, of course, is generally how badly they want to retain some semblance of normalcy - however fleeting.

[lallara zhuul]

There is one problem with overstimuli, they cause addiction.

Direct manipulation of the brain through the pod interface while having a sexual encounter through a virtual link could cause such behaviour.

[Arnulf Ogunkoya]

There is one problem with overstimuli, they cause addiction.

Direct manipulation of the brain through the pod interface while having a sexual encounter through a virtual link could cause such behaviour.

It could be theorised that wetgraving is just that, addiction.

This sounds like the wireheads from Larry Niven's Known Space setting. They are people who have an implant that can feed a trickle of current into the pleasure centre of the brain.

But, as said by others, sex is more than simple physical stimulation. Might it be the case that some people would become more intensely sexual as a way to remind themselves of the fact that they are still humans underneath all the flshy implant tech and training?

I would tend to assume that it's not about reproduction. Any podder with half a brain would have sperm/eggs from their birth body kept in stasis to be tube grown should they want to have a child. In fact I'm not sure the clone bodies can make sperm or eggs.

[Shae Tiann]

I would tend to assume that it's not about reproduction. Any podder with half a brain would have sperm/eggs from their birth body kept in stasis to be tube grown should they want to have a child. In fact I'm not sure the clone bodies can make sperm or eggs.

I've wondered about that, too.

For my part, sex is part of Shae's relationship with Cael. If all you're looking for is a quick jolt in the pleasure-centers, might as well flip a switch. If you're looking for something emotional and to be close to another person -- and Scagga's right, they could easily have relationship sims that can be tailored to whatever a person's preferences are -- sex tends to be an integral part of that. I can just imagine someone walking into a bar with their simulated holographic girlfriend on their arm... ^_^ *cues flashbacks to the Star Trek holodeck* There's something poignant in that, though: however much you may love the sim and feel attached to it, it's not real, and neither are the feelings it claims to have.

...That would be an interesting RP to run with, though. Hmmm...

[Silver Night]

I would tend to assume that it's not about reproduction. Any podder with half a brain would have sperm/eggs from their birth body kept in stasis to be tube grown should they want to have a child. In fact I'm not sure the clone bodies can make sperm or eggs.

I've wondered about that, too.

For my part, sex is part of Shae's relationship with Cael. If all you're looking for is a quick jolt in the pleasure-centers, might as well flip a switch. If you're looking for something emotional and to be close to another person -- and Scagga's right, they could easily have relationship sims that can be tailored to whatever a person's preferences are -- sex tends to be an integral part of that. I can just imagine someone walking into a bar with their simulated holographic girlfriend on their arm... ^_^ *cues flashbacks to the Star Trek holodeck* There's something poignant in that, though: however much you may love the sim and feel attached to it, it's not real, and neither are the feelings it claims to have.

...That would be an interesting RP to run with, though. Hmmm...

Which is why in your desperation to make it real you turn to deeply unwise experimentation with AIs and Rogue Drones... 

[Casiella]

Which is why in your desperation to make it real you turn to deeply unwise experimentation with AIs and Rogue Drones... 

* Casiella coughs discreetly to hide her own self-consciousness here.

Erm, well, Casi-c would. Because, yeah, nail, meet hammer.

[Usagi Tsukino]

You think it's bad now, wait till Incarna comes out.

CCP can kiss that T rating buh bye. Maybe it can be salvaged if they have a couple of GMs checking IDs outside that VETO bar...

[Silver Night]

T rating was so Eve could be sold in Walmart. True story.

Not such a big deal for them, now, I'm thinking. (Though still potentially problematic in places like China and Australia. >>)

[Casiella]

I've speculated that Incarna could bump it up to M, though the online play disclaimer could still apply.

Depends on those exotic dancer costumes...