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[hellgremlin]

Yes, yes, I know. It's possible to keep your humanity after becoming an immortal capsuleer. However, I think... it's unlikely.

In all CCP storyline we've been described, generally, as aloof demigods who care not a whit about their crew, or humanity at large. We're unbound Ids and Egos. We have access to every pleasure, every sensation, every tidbit of information we could possibly desire...

... and most of y'all act like the cast of Friends.

No offense. Or maybe, some offense is intended. But your problems are... too human.

Really put yourselves in the shoes of an immortal, an elite, a supreme being of which only a handful exist among the teeming, suffering trillions of New Eden. Even an ego-removed ascetic would find himself feeling special.

I want to see less words-only squabbles on IGS. I want to see more IGS posters responding to a slight or slander by OBLITERATING THE POPULATION OF A PLANET.

Basically, this is a radical appeal for you all to alter your style of RP based on my drunken ramblings. We really need to cultivate the whole "planetsiders are shit" mentality if we're to establish a properly arrogant and conceited relationship with the nascent Dust community. Your thoughts, kind sirs and madams?

[Aria Jenneth]

Weirdly enough, Aria's presently headed back the other way.

In general, though: I tend to think of the "Demented" (a.k.a. regular players, whose detachment from "reality" inhibits recognizing the reality of their situation or the enormity of their actions) as filling this niche for the most part.

"Immersionist" characters, at least the more moderate and compassionate ones, represent the most "human-like" of their breed, but are the exception, not the rule.

[Kybernetes Moros]

I enjoyed watching the discrepancies, honestly.

Capsuleers (characters) would have their own "cast of Friends" squabbles and disputes, claiming that they'd remained well-grounded and down-to-earth despite it all... and all the while wiping out fleets of thousands of people in minutes, spending collective trillions in churning out more weapons and ammunition with which to do that, and so on.

Aria mentioned the non-RPers as filling that niche nicely, but I'd argue that the vast majority of players fit what I described as a subcategory of it -- capsuleer isolation creating this bubble in which they're quite solidly convinced they're nicely sane and rational. I know the "personal dramas / vast wealth and destructive capacity" dichotomy started to develop to be quite pronounced in Kyber, but then I stopped playing him, so.

[Lyn Farel]

Oh well, Lyn never really actually cared for people. She care for people as statistics, because of :detachement:

So well, if she has to obliterate a planet as you say, she would do it without a lot of remorse, but she would need a damn good reason to do so.

[hellgremlin]

There was a great Amarr roleplayer around in the 03/04 era, aligned with Sabaoth Inc. if my memory serves correctly. I forget her name.

She roleplayed a capsuleer that had not left her pod in months. She was an emaciated blanched flesh-draped skeleton displaying signs of liquid immersion decay (imagine the pruney fingers you get from soaking in the bath too long... times A THOUSAND)

She (or he, I don't know) performed the most immersive RP of what being a capsuleer is like, that I've ever seen. A complete detachment from humanity. A complete adherence to what it would be like to live your life floating in a fullerene pod with a slimy goo center.

I want to see stuff like that again.

Capsuleers that aren't in love with their old, human self. Capsuleers who completely and utterly fall in love with their new form.

[Gottii]

Here's a couple points.

One, I do agree there are a lot of RP problems and roles that come off as trite in EVE RP.  Granted, "Im not allowed at so-and-so's dinner party!" seems kind of silly, but such trivial things can matter at the highest levels of power. 

Frankly, if someone I RPed with said "I JUST DESTROYED ALDERAAN BECAUSE OF YOUR IMPUDENCE!"  I would prolly mutter "tool" and stop RPing with them.  But if someone could say "for your arrogance, my alliance will take such and such constellation from the Republic and give their population to Amarrian overseers" then Im a little more impressed.  A lot impressed actually.

Part of the problem is that typically, RP corps and alliances are generally small.  So their ability to impact in game events is limited.  And claiming to destroy a planets population comes off a bit god-moddy to me, if you cant stop it. 

As for why I try to play a character who still tries to act human, or at least pretend to be, it basically boils down to this for me. 

 An ambitious, brilliant, powerful and amoral demi-god doing everything he can to advance to immortal full-on godhood, and conquer the galaxy, while stomping on the little people who get in his way?  Kinda boring and overdone for me.  I've read it before, and know how it ends.

A powerful, wealthy, destructive, murderous demi-god trying desperately to hold onto some kind of home in "mortal" society and retain some shred of humanity left in him?   That actually interests me a lot more, and gives me more opportunities to write and more RP arcs to follow. 

[Yoshito Sanders]

People who threaten to obliterate the populations of planets (like the guy in Xenocracy) are incredibly goofy, because we can't and even when we can shoot at people in DUST, we won't be wiping out entire planetary populations. Making that threat is a lot like me threatening to kick Jamyl in her tits if I don't get a free Titan. I can claim I'm going to do it, and when I don't get my Titan I can either claim to kick Jamyl in her tits and then have everyone point out that there's no actual way I did it, or I can just neuter myself by admitting it was an empty threat.

The only people we, as capsuleers, can legitimately threaten are each other, because we're only ones we can actually have any effect on. Sure, we can claim "Grr, I'm gonna kill all Amarr slavers!" but no, no you're not, because no matter what you do the Amarr Empire is going to continue on living with all its stations, all its agents, and so on just fine. The best you can do is occupy some of their systems in FW and blow up some of their ships in missions and the like, which has no real effect (though I guess the FW stuff has a little bit of it now).

And honestly, it's how it should be. Gods fight the giants in Ragnarok, with the bravest of mortals as their valkyries. They don't concern themselves with the old man dying in his hovel.

[hellgremlin]

I want you to roleplay not only as if you COULD kick Jamyl in the tits, but that her left tit happens to bear the irremovable imprint of your chosen brand of boot.

We are supermen. We are gods. We are engines of annihilation. Our insecurities translate directly into torpedo launches; our fears detonate doomsday devices. Start bloody acting like it, I say

[hellgremlin]

An ambitious, brilliant, powerful and amoral demi-god doing everything he can to advance to immortal full-on godhood, and conquer the galaxy, while stomping on the little people who get in his way?  Kinda boring and overdone for me.  I've read it before, and know how it ends.

Oh indeed, it is kind of boring... if there's only one of them.

Now imagine 300,000 of them, interacting, plotting against one another.

[Yoshito Sanders]

But EVE is a "proof" game. I can make all the claims I want. But can I prove that I did it? No I can't. It's a lot like people claiming to be "protectors of the State" or whatever and then someone wardecs them, kills all their mission runners, and camps their three PVPers into station all day. Why play a character who just makes bold claims but can't back it up? Sure someone can play the guy that talks a lot of shit he can't actually do, but if everyone does it it's just silly. Kill each other, threaten each other. That's the interesting stuff.

We are supermen, gods, and the like. And we take it out on each other. The gods aren't crazy psychopaths, they're the purification and manifestation of nature with the flaws of humans. Zeus is lightning, but he also likes banging chicks.

[Yoshito Sanders]

Now imagine 300,000 of them, interacting, plotting against one another.

We kind of already have these, though, and they're called Goonswarm.

[Gottii]

There was a great Amarr roleplayer around in the 03/04 era, aligned with Sabaoth Inc. if my memory serves correctly. I forget her name.

She roleplayed a capsuleer that had not left her pod in months. She was an emaciated blanched flesh-draped skeleton displaying signs of liquid immersion decay (imagine the pruney fingers you get from soaking in the bath too long... times A THOUSAND)

She (or he, I don't know) performed the most immersive RP of what being a capsuleer is like, that I've ever seen. A complete detachment from humanity. A complete adherence to what it would be like to live your life floating in a fullerene pod with a slimy goo center.

I want to see stuff like that again.

Capsuleers that aren't in love with their old, human self. Capsuleers who completely and utterly fall in love with their new form.

Here's kinda my critique to this. 

Interesting character.  One shes not playing anymore.  Probably because that character has a very limited shelf-life.

What kind of goals does a desiccated ship-corpse even have?  What motivations?  What would actually inspire a player to invest years of his or her RL life into that character? 

Its a fun thought project.  It would be fun to RP with that character.  But I think a lot of the stories you could actually tell about that character would likely be limited.

[Matariki Rain]

I'd expect to see various different ways of dealing with the issues of being a podder. I find the idea that everyone reacts to being thwarted by enacting random violence as unconvincing as the idea that no one does. (I have considered the possibility that we are intentionally kept thwarted by limitations on what we can do inside our captain's quarters to keep us in a state of simmering rage and eager to undock. It's doesn't feel very demi-godly, though.)

If you're concerned that we might not seem to have it together enough to deal effectively with DUSTies.... well, yeah. I expect that'll vary from group to group, and being able to present an appropriate face to the DUST troops you're working with will come to have similar political significance to coordinating allies in the current EVE gameworld.

Also, I'm not sure that they'll respect our authoritah even if we do avoid soap-opera:

They float naked in their own piss with pipes sticking out of their asses. Sure, what's not to respect?
- Magin Ongrau, Privateer, commenting on capsuleers

Also also what Gottii said: one of the main things I find interesting about roleplaying in the EVE world is the tension of being a first-generation podder, working out what that means.

Also also also, there's a fair bit here that ties back to "Why do you roleplay?", What do you get out of the investment you make of your time and creative energy, and how does that compare with the other things you could have done with those?".

I've tried to post this three times now, with new posts each time. So much for leisurely discussion threads.

[orange]

For someone who is known for playing the subterfuge side of the game, you are arguing for us to ignore the strings attached to characters' immortality and physical power.

Old & powerful capsuleers (like Istvaan or 0.0 alliance executors) should be terrified of having clones in CONCORD monitored Stations (low-sec & high-sec).  A significant enough threat to the masses might be targeted by "the powers that be," the kind of power Emperyeans only secure through the expenditure of vast wealth.

The ease with which national, patriotic, fanatical agents might destroy someone with clones only in one place is scary.  Don't forget the example of Otro Gariushi, a capsuleer of cunning with the power of a cluster spanning corporation at his back was destroyed (maybe) all because he thought his clones secure in Malkalen.

Capsuleers are gods when at the command of starships, but take away a secure means of cloning and they are just as fragile as anyone else.

[hellgremlin]

Good points. That's why my character has learned lessons from both Otro Gariushi keeping his clones in one basket, as it were; and from Sansha Kuvakei who maintained multiple simultaneous clones and reserves, and managed to survive an extermination campaign wrought by all four empires.