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[Sakaane Eionell]

And ups, w-space is in a distant galaxy? That will break some bones.

As it happens, I was looking up stuff about the Seyllin disaster just recently, and this bit about w-space being in a distant galaxy is not really new PF. It was mentioned in this Scope news article back in 2009 when the expansion hit, so I guess anyone who feels their bones breaking now has just missed the info for three years.

As for the debate about the Fiction Portal pages being locked, if players could go in and update the pages, we'd immediately have a blurring of lines between what is actually CCP-sanctioned PF and what is everyone's interpretation of it. The Fiction Portal would no longer be a definitive source of PF, and isn't that the whole point of it? I thought it was. I see it more like an encyclopedia from the bookstore, not an actual wiki, even though it happens to be included in the same framework as one.

But there are Discussion tabs for all of those locked pages. This being the best bet to get something noticed, definitely going to make use of it rather than hoping someone happens to see something on a forum.

[Shae Tiann]

To everyone complaining about locked Fiction Portal entries: There's this thing called "Intellectual Property". CCP owns it. Despite the investment that we as players have in it, we have no more right to change their IP without their permission than they do to go into our blogs and change out player-created fiction to meet PF standards.

There is a section for Player-Created Fiction. I had no issues uploading my own work into it, and clearly others have likewise done so. Player-created bits of the EVE universe can easily fit there.

[Uraniae]

Did anyone else notice the Admiral Noir page in the wiki?  I'll get right to the  moment for me.

"It was these efforts that led to his being selected to lead the military escort for the delegation that was dispatched to Malkalen. He was selected to fly the "FNS Wandering Saint" - a Nyx-class mothership - at the head of the Gallente fleet. He never got the opportunity, however, as he was murdered in his own home by The Broker, who assumed Noir's cloned form."

If that is public knowledge, doesn't it sort of throw a King Kong sized monkey wrench into one of the reasons for the recent flare in Gallente/Caldari hostilities?

Of course maybe this is just news to me, in which case I'll scurry on back under my blanket of perceived neutrality.

[Publius Valerius]

Did anyone else notice the Admiral Noir page in the wiki?  I'll get right to the  moment for me.

"It was these efforts that led to his being selected to lead the military escort for the delegation that was dispatched to Malkalen. He was selected to fly the "FNS Wandering Saint" - a Nyx-class mothership - at the head of the Gallente fleet. He never got the opportunity, however, as he was murdered in his own home by The Broker, who assumed Noir's cloned form."

If that is public knowledge, doesn't it sort of throw a King Kong sized monkey wrench into one of the reasons for the recent flare in Gallente/Caldari hostilities?

Of course maybe this is just news to me, in which case I'll scurry on back under my blanket of perceived neutrality.

It is Info from the Empyrean Age novel. The same counts for this: http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Jamyl_I#Apparent_Death_and_Cloning

And yes it is a gamechanger for IGS and some RP, but you always can say... you play your Char "In Character" and the wiki gives us just "god like infos". In german the "allwissender Erzähler" in english most likely to compare with: Omniscient narrator.

[Morwen Lagann]

They're not really the same thing, in terms of RP, though.

With Jamyl, it is mind-bogglingly obvious she's a clone. She committed ritual suicide, and then came back several years later. Call it what you like, you don't come back from the dead like that without a clone. Some people seem to confuse toeing the party line and regurgitating the "OMG IT'S A MIRACLE SO IGNORE THE GODFLESH DOCTRINE" noise the TC has forcefed them with an inability to know (provably) that Jamyl is a clone. Anyone (or any character) who understands how the cloning process works would easily be able to see that Jamyl is a clone. Someone made a comment somewhere (Lallara or Silas, on this forum I think?) that anyone who supports Jamyl's reign has no real grounds to call themselves a "conservative" Amarrian. They're not wrong. :p

On the other hand, with Noir you have a celebrated Admiral who was known for his peace efforts, suddenly pulling an about-face and committing one of the greatest atrocities of the "modern" era (in terms of EVE, anyway) without any warning at all. Sure, it's perfectly plausible that it was "someone else" and not Noir himself, but nobody can cast reasonable doubt on it having been Noir himself. All anyone can prove is that someone wearing Noir's body was flying that Nyx, and that whoever it was turned and did something nobody would have ever expected of Noir at the worst possible time. But with no actual evidence beyond completely unexpected behavior, there's not enough to put someone other than Admiral Noir himself inside the Admiral Noir suit and make the "it was an impostor!" claims dissimilar to the "9/11 was an inside job!" or "there was no moon landing!" claims some people make in the real world.

[Matariki Rain]

To everyone complaining about locked Fiction Portal entries: There's this thing called "Intellectual Property". CCP owns it. Despite the investment that we as players have in it, we have no more right to change their IP without their permission than they do to go into our blogs and change out player-created fiction to meet PF standards.

There is a section for Player-Created Fiction. I had no issues uploading my own work into it, and clearly others have likewise done so. Player-created bits of the EVE universe can easily fit there.

Just be mindful of the exclusivity clause in the EULA. Not really a concern for small stuff, but for works that could stand alone (or have the EVE serial numbers filed off some day when you decide to publish a fiction collection) it's worth remembering that unless you have an agreement to the contrary:

11. C. User Content
The System may allow you to communicate information, such as by posting messages in chat rooms, on bulletin boards and other user-to-user areas (collectively, "User Content").
[....]
You hereby grant CCP an exclusive, perpetual, worldwide, irrevocable, assignable, royalty-free license, fully sublicensable through multiple tiers, to exercise all intellectual property and other rights, in and to all or any part of your User Content, in any medium now known or hereafter developed.

[Seriphyn]

Did anyone else notice the Admiral Noir page in the wiki?  I'll get right to the  moment for me.

"It was these efforts that led to his being selected to lead the military escort for the delegation that was dispatched to Malkalen. He was selected to fly the "FNS Wandering Saint" - a Nyx-class mothership - at the head of the Gallente fleet. He never got the opportunity, however, as he was murdered in his own home by The Broker, who assumed Noir's cloned form."

If that is public knowledge, doesn't it sort of throw a King Kong sized monkey wrench into one of the reasons for the recent flare in Gallente/Caldari hostilities?

Of course maybe this is just news to me, in which case I'll scurry on back under my blanket of perceived neutrality.

I do believe that page hasn't recieved a makeover. It's the same one from the previous EVElopedia IIRC...but it isn't exactly clear as a layman what bits would be OOC or IC knowledge.

[Sakura Imoru]

Articles like the Malkalen-disaster really should be divided into two parts: IC and OOC, aka "What your char knows" and "What really happened". That also applies to Jamyl. Everone knows she is a clone, but her strange abilities can't be explained by that.

[orange]

Did anyone else notice the Admiral Noir page in the wiki?  I'll get right to the  moment for me.

"It was these efforts that led to his being selected to lead the military escort for the delegation that was dispatched to Malkalen. He was selected to fly the "FNS Wandering Saint" - a Nyx-class mothership - at the head of the Gallente fleet. He never got the opportunity, however, as he was murdered in his own home by The Broker, who assumed Noir's cloned form."

If that is public knowledge, doesn't it sort of throw a King Kong sized monkey wrench into one of the reasons for the recent flare in Gallente/Caldari hostilities?

Of course maybe this is just news to me, in which case I'll scurry on back under my blanket of perceived neutrality.

I do believe that page hasn't recieved a makeover. It's the same one from the previous EVElopedia IIRC...but it isn't exactly clear as a layman what bits would be OOC or IC knowledge.

Unless the page has an IC-tag somewhere in it, it is all OOC.

Wouldn't it be nice if a player who was around in 2008 and watched the events unfold through their character's eyes could build a section "What Appeared to Happen?" with the IC-tag & all?

To everyone complaining about locked Fiction Portal entries: There's this thing called "Intellectual Property". CCP owns it. Despite the investment that we as players have in it, we have no more right to change their IP without their permission than they do to go into our blogs and change out player-created fiction to meet PF standards.

There is a section for Player-Created Fiction. I had no issues uploading my own work into it, and clearly others have likewise done so. Player-created bits of the EVE universe can easily fit there.

I get it, CCP owns their IP and they can do with it what they want.

My complaint is that more than a few of the locked entries are worthless.

TLXX-01  - I have commented in discussion and recommended the page be made a redirect to Sellyin.  No response one way or another.
Republic Fleet - representative of most NPC corporate pages.  They do not even show the corporation's logo.

Go to the Evelopedia start page and find player fiction via clicks, let me know what path you take to get there.  Not a search "player fiction," but by clicking on links from the home page.

If Evelopedia is meant to be the go to place for players to get information about the game(s) world, CCP is taking on a huge task by barring players from assisting in the actual editing of pages and relegating us to data collection and consolidation on discussion pages.  Even then, when a player does take the time to point out simple, straight-forward, improvement to a page, he is informed the page will not be updated until CCP gets a hold of a copy of their own book.

I am frustrated by this situation.  But I get it, it is CCP's own IP and they can protect it however they want.   

[Senn Typhos]

Did anyone else notice the Admiral Noir page in the wiki?  I'll get right to the  moment for me.

"It was these efforts that led to his being selected to lead the military escort for the delegation that was dispatched to Malkalen. He was selected to fly the "FNS Wandering Saint" - a Nyx-class mothership - at the head of the Gallente fleet. He never got the opportunity, however, as he was murdered in his own home by The Broker, who assumed Noir's cloned form."

If that is public knowledge, doesn't it sort of throw a King Kong sized monkey wrench into one of the reasons for the recent flare in Gallente/Caldari hostilities?

Of course maybe this is just news to me, in which case I'll scurry on back under my blanket of perceived neutrality.

I don't think it really matters. Caldari and Gallenteans will always have an excuse to hate each other, its an animosity that goes far beyond "oh, nevermind, wasn't really their fault."

[Shae Tiann]

I get it, CCP owns their IP and they can do with it what they want.

My complaint is that more than a few of the locked entries are worthless.

TLXX-01  - I have commented in discussion and recommended the page be made a redirect to Sellyin.  No response one way or another.
Republic Fleet - representative of most NPC corporate pages.  They do not even show the corporation's logo.

Go to the Evelopedia start page and find player fiction via clicks, let me know what path you take to get there.  Not a search "player fiction," but by clicking on links from the home page.

If Evelopedia is meant to be the go to place for players to get information about the game(s) world, CCP is taking on a huge task by barring players from assisting in the actual editing of pages and relegating us to data collection and consolidation on discussion pages.  Even then, when a player does take the time to point out simple, straight-forward, improvement to a page, he is informed the page will not be updated until CCP gets a hold of a copy of their own book.

I am frustrated by this situation.  But I get it, it is CCP's own IP and they can protect it however they want.   

Wikis are a perpetual work in progress; it will never be "finished". The new format was released because it was considered ready for public use. There is, however, a very fine line between players editing pages live and using that freedom to change pages for their own benefit.

...Or for the lulz. Do I really need to suggest what the Goons might do if the wiki was fully open? The Discussion sections are there for a reason.

As to the location of the Player-created Fiction portal, they seem to have altered the pathway from the old version, where it was linked at the bottom of the Fiction Portal page. The URL still works.

[orange]

Wikis are a perpetual work in progress; it will never be "finished". The new format was released because it was considered ready for public use. There is, however, a very fine line between players editing pages live and using that freedom to change pages for their own benefit.

...Or for the lulz. Do I really need to suggest what the Goons might do if the wiki was fully open? The Discussion sections are there for a reason.

As to the location of the Player-created Fiction portal, they seem to have altered the pathway from the old version, where it was linked at the bottom of the Fiction Portal page. The URL still works.

The Goons have had years to attack evelopedia for the lulz, but they have not done so to my knowledge.

The pages that are under the most threat of being edited to the benefit of one group of players over another are the very kind of pages that CCP cannot build/contribute without dedicating staff to following the actions of player entities extensively.   The Band of Brothers entry is a great example of this and was hit by the Goons.  Should CCP lock it?  Does it make sense for them to lock it and bar it from further updates?

So, unless you know the Player Created Fiction section exist, you have nothing to indicate it does.

[Shae Tiann]

The pages that are under the most threat of being edited to the benefit of one group of players over another are the very kind of pages that CCP cannot build/contribute without dedicating staff to following the actions of player entities extensively.   The Band of Brothers entry is a great example of this and was hit by the Goons.  Should CCP lock it?  Does it make sense for them to lock it and bar it from further updates?

So, unless you know the Player Created Fiction section exist, you have nothing to indicate it does.

I tend to disagree, considering how the rise of facwar has generated a lot of people who might take amusement in editing another faction's wiki entry.

Believe me, I'm a little put out at the navigation to the Player-Created stuff disappearing, as well. It was there just a couple weeks ago.

[Louella Dougans]

It didn't take long for people to start using the new evelopedia as IC knowledge to tell people they're doing it wrong.

[Morwen Lagann]

Like Dex said, CCP needs to go through and mark specific pages as IC or OOC knowledge.

But good luck with them having the time to do it before the damage done is too great.