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[Elsebeth Rhiannon]

Rule #10: Only provoke the enemy when you are prepared for the wardec.

[Milo Caman]

Correct. I do hope some of the people deccing this guy take a brief OOC to let him know what's up for courtesy's sake as he seems to not quite get it, but yes, you make public statements supporting x,y,z you best expect people who hate x,y,z to shoot at you.

I'm less than Sympathetic:

friendly warning
From: StalinGrad6
Sent: 2010.12.28 16:52
To: Milo Caman, 

your words mean nothing.

i left that business of this RP crap and i wash my hands of it, permanently.

your threats are wasted words.

right now im in hiding, kindly respect my privacy and do not send me any more messages.

goodbye, and happy fucking new year.

[Syylara/Yaansu]

But then he posts in the Capsuleer Dossiers thread. 

[Senn Typhos]

See, here's my problem with everyone that claims we're being "too hard" on a young player:

If he had made an innocent mistake, then apologized for it, and was ridiculed by older players in a ruthless manner, yes, that would be cruel. But he didn't do that.

What he did was make a stupid error in judgement, defend it way too vehemently for his own good, throw as many swears as his young mind could muster into a livejournal-style raegquit post, then make an equally terrible post to try to recover ground, then raegquit again. And THEN he continued to not-have-quitted.

Its very simple. If you want to avoid cannonball wounds, don't stand directly in front of a lit cannon.

[BloodBird]

So, let's get a little history down first. Years ago, I was a RP noob. Of the type that did not realize the divide between IC and OOC. I had lurked around on a spesific forum for the good ol' Baldurs Gate II game, for well over a year before I registered and started out. My first character was effectively a hard-liner Paladin, and I ended up god-modding a bit and bad-mouthing the 'evil' guys OOC over their choice of RP avenue.

I was promptly put in my place and 'shown the error' of my ways, as such. I wised up. I appologized, in honestly, and I woved to improve. I effectively redeemed myself and had alot of fun. Today, I look back at the following year of RP fondly and with some degree of longing, I will admit.

Then along came EVE Online, and some time later so did I. About 1.5 to 2 years into my EVE 'career' I started RP'ing seriously with my main character, perhaps, a year before FW came out?

Anyhow.

While RP'ing on my oldest toon is hell of a lot of fun, when I do, I'm playing this game at this point mostly for the RP and the PVP, combined with some PVE like mining and general industry for the flavor, right? So when I wanted to explore how it was like to be an Amarrian Imperialist and a 'proper' religiously convinced reformer, I had to create a new toon. I planned it out for about a month, laid down all the groundwork and eventually created Jesmine Kyriel.

A year of alot of fun passes by and here we have Stalingrad6, who appears to have happily strolled into the same mistake I did years ago. After I decced him on RP grounds the only person who acted civilized about it all apart from myself was his CEO of the time. After starting the counter on the vote I mailed said CEO with my intentions and my terms for peace, due IC reasons.

While he was rather annoyed at first because this was the third or fourth time someone decced him over Stalin's RP set-up, he was grateful for the warning and promptly removed Stalin's roles and prepared to kick him. Soon there after Stalin retracted his BR loyalties and the rest is history. The war never even went live.

At this point, I was somewhat horrified to find I was on the oposite end of the divide I had been on years ago – now I was the one slapping a noob for his sillyness in RP and he was the guy heavily out of line. Only problem is, evne after talking to him OOC it won't appear that he's learned anything, or taken any advice. During our chat I tried to underline how RP 'works' (the IC/OOC divide among others things) and I offered him the link to this site. It will appear he has not yet made an account here, this is a shame because I think he could be an addition to the RP 'community' if only he wised-up and don't act so hostile all the time. He reacts to RP opposition and any advice with... well, we all have seen his responses to most, I'm sure.

So with history-lesson out of the way, the thing now is; I still have the logg from our convo saved to my drive. I wanted to post it here as I feel it would clear up a few questions people here may have about him. I've not done so yet because I mailed him after, asking if it was cool with him if I did post it here. I was never answered. Despite that fact I still want to share this as I feel it's important that we, as RP'ers, better understand how to deal with people who 'stumble' in RP as badly as Stalingrad6 has. I for one would like more, not less, RP'ers.

What do people think of this?

[Bong-cha Jones]

I'm a fan of second chances and I was seriously considering trying to recruit this guy to give him a safe-ish environment to learn the ropes.  Until the frothing rage spasms.  That suggests a guy who will be difficult to work with on any level, and while I'm all for helping out, I don't have a lot of time for hand-holding of that degree.  More rp'ers would be a good thing, though, especially Federal ones.

[Mizhara]

Go ahead. Post the logs.

[Milo Caman]

Considering the email I sent was a polite IC warning telling him not to claim he'd been killing Serpentis publicly, I really don't think the rage mail was justified.

[BloodBird]

Considering the email I sent was a polite IC warning telling him not to claim he'd been killing Serpentis publicly, I really don't think the rage mail was justified.

Most likely it wasn't. Jesmine too got 3 rather heated mails effectively demanding a chat after all this. The only reasons I'm not sharing all of this yet is A) I'm not sure the mods will agree and B) I'm not sure it won't degenerate into all-out character assassination.

I'll wait for a bit more to hear some more oppinons for what to do.

[BloodBird]

While the convo between Aria and Syll is interesting I would like to thank you kindly for effectively de-railing the tread. No really, well done.

*ahem* Anyhow, I'm trying to get a hold of the guy again to talk to him again about the whole 'leaving my info in the dossier' thing, because I think he may want to RP (hell, it's fun) he's just pretty much hauling the extensive weight of his own noobishness around while doing so and having a tendency to kick things over as they get in his way, regardless of what that is. Or try, anyhow.

I will also ask to get a clear yes/no answer from him regarding 'make this public yes/no' question about the loggs. I'll post it or not, based in that answer.

In the meantime your thoughts on the matter is facinating, even if it's mostly 'is this shit legal' more than 'do I think you should do it' 

[Misan]

[mod]Split the discussion about EULA chatlogs and such and moved it into non-RP EVE discussion. You can find the new topic here: http://backstage.eve-inspiracy.com/index.php?topic=1599.0. Apologies if your post got moved and you felt like it fit more in this thread.[/mod]

[Bataav]

...I'm trying to get a hold of the guy again to talk to him again about the whole 'leaving my info in the dossier' thing, because I think he may want to RP (hell, it's fun)...

I think you're right.

I have a trade alt who's talked to him a few times when he was first RPing his drone tech research. I'd been in contact with him before, during and after the infamous ragequit and my understanding of his situation is that he's just inexperienced with RP in general and was ignorant about the reprocussions of his particular path in EVE.

When I first aligned myself with the Intaki secessionists I certainly didn't fully realise the finer details of the situation. It's something we all learn as we go along. Stalingrad6 just needs to do the same.

My understanding was that he was never ragequitting the game - only the active RP aspect of it found on IGS. That said BloodBird is right. His post in the "dossier" topic clearly shows he's an RPer at heart (as he just can't stop himself) and so maybe a couple of friendly mails will help him.

I can always have my alt ask after him too. He's raged about IGS to me before so I'm sure he'd open up if I asked.

[Elsebeth Rhiannon]

IGSrage is SNAFU for roleplayers, no?

And hell, yea, I had no frigging idea what I was getting myself into when I first went "wow sounds cool" on the Oath of Loyalty to the Minmatar Republic.

[Milo Caman]

Well, that was a waste of time.

[spoiler]Milo Caman > Hey
StalinGrad6 > you want chat?
StalinGrad6 > hlo
Milo Caman > Bear with me. In a fight. Give me. 5 Minutes to resolve this.
StalinGrad6 > kk take ur time.
Milo Caman > Alright
StalinGrad6 > k
Milo Caman > Just wanted to be clear that the IC stuff is just that. IC
StalinGrad6 > i kno.
Milo Caman > Threats, Decs and stuff will come your way as a result of stuff said, that's just EVE
StalinGrad6 > i kno.
Milo Caman > And getting angry about it n' stuff kinda makes you look daft
StalinGrad6 > dont care.
Milo Caman > Well you seem to when people point it out IC
Milo Caman > http://backstage.eve-inspiracy.com/index.php?topic=1561.0
StalinGrad6 > ppl think what they want to think. its thier problem, not mine, so i dont give a **** what ppl think, its thier problem.
Milo Caman > Well it often becomes yours when they wardec you because of you reactions
StalinGrad6 > not my ****ing problem.
StalinGrad6 > if they have issues, they have to get the F over it.
Milo Caman > As I said, when they dec you, and rage, it's your problem as well.
Milo Caman > You have to understand, in EVE, reputation is currency, and you're presently a laughing stock.
StalinGrad6 > its why im going to presently delete this rediculous fuckfest of a character after ive done something.
StalinGrad6 > start over.
Milo Caman > You know, if you sat down and actually listened and thought before doing stuff, you mgiht be able to recover stuff
Milo Caman > read that thread I linked. You feature in it quite a bit.
StalinGrad6 > yeah i "feature" in it. as a laugh. a joke. a play. a toy. i dont want any fucking part of it. ive had enough of this abuse. i do something and suddenly i have 10 000 reasons not to play this game.
Milo Caman > The thread isn't abuse
Milo Caman > It's people discussing your situation
StalinGrad6 > which i take offense to.
Milo Caman > You have to understand that people don't sit behind their keyboard cackling at your failure or anything
Milo Caman > It's a level headed discussion
StalinGrad6 > i hate these damned humans.
Milo Caman > On the Internet, no-one knows you're a dog.
StalinGrad6 > nobody cares if im human so what does it matter?
Milo Caman > But seriously, Don;t let shit get personal, because it isn't. You've just made yourself a bit of a target by the way you've reated to people
Milo Caman > *reacted
StalinGrad6 > thats thier problem. if they want an apology or a retraction, they ASK for it like human beings. that way i wont take it personally and do things the way I do out of game.
Milo Caman > They're not asking for an apology.
Milo Caman > Most people seem to feel sorry for you.
StalinGrad6 > oh really? heh. i seriously doubt that. nobodys ever done that before.
Milo Caman > Don't give me all that self-pitying bullshit.
Milo Caman > Read the thread, then think about what's been said.
Milo Caman > I've gotta head out. Laters
StalinGrad6 > goodbye
[/spoiler]

[StalinGrad6]

So this is how i go huh?

Shot down both IC and OOC.

Milo, i appreciate your help but its quite obvious i can do nothing to remedy this situation with or without help. your efforts were not a waste of time and seriously i thank you for your help, but im so agitated im deaf to voices of reason.

thats over now, ive calmed down some.

ever since this stuff started ive recieved almost daily death threats.

i tell them to read my bio. and its over.

but i'll tell you one thing.

youre right about me not leaving RP permanently. i got ONE little storyline left in me.

All that rage? thats because you people were screwing me over. i plan EVERYTHING i say or do when it comes to EvE, unfortunately my "plan" didnt expect so many people to automatically shoot me down.

so thus, the thread was shut down due to nobody listening to me anymore.

but that will change. i got one more little thread left in me. i know better than anyone it will do NOTHING to help my main. but one things for sure.

i think you'll like it.

if not, i leave EvE online with a legacy.

as the worst RPer in history.

either way, i leave a mark. its not a good one, but its somming you'll remember.

im getting irritated again. you'll have to exuse me for not continuing, but i need to stop before i say something truly horrible.

good day. for now.