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[Louella Dougans]

At times, looking at things going on ingame, and on IGS, I feel this sort of thing happens:



That is, it is rather difficult to tell what a particular entity you encounter is, unless they make over-the-top proclamations about it.

And people have various schemes, which many people would be opposed to, if they were to find out.

But mostly, the only way people would find out about a scheme, is if the schemer tells them about it.

What are your thoughts on this sort of thing?

[Casiella]

That IGS is not a place for schemes any more than the CIA uses LiveJournal to plan clandestine operations.

[Grr]

You worry too much.  Eve is full of honest, high integrity individuals and organisations who want nothing more than to help each other.

[Senn Typhos]

If you're a good RPer, the hat is unnecessary. A good hustler doesn't have to tell anyone he's a hustler. He does what he does and if people want answers, they can do the digging themselves.

Jumping on IGS and yelling about how evil your evil evilness is evil... eh, its a crutch, and some people need it.

Sidenote: other things that should tip you off to an evil character; if they use the word "exquisite" or "resplendant" too much, they're evil. Mustaches are also a good indicator. If he seems like a "changed heart mercenary" just remember he'll eventually betray you down the line. Take it from Uncle Senn.

[Benjamin Shepherd]

I roleplay as a pursuer of fairness and good, if we are using the philosophical "good". Some people think I'm extremely evil and mysterious, just based on my ingame avatar.

That is when you know you've done your job: You leave people guessing. But yeah I'm good kk

[Bacchanalian]

You worry too much.  Eve is full of honest, high integrity individuals and organisations who want nothing more than to help each other.

Confirming I am one such person.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Hi
From: Visitmaniac
Sent: 2010.12.14 07:12
To: Bacchanalian, 


Just wanted to say thanks alot for steeling all my stuff its been over a week now a bit uncalled for

I helped him rid himself of an Orca, Hulk, Covetor and various and sundry mining tools.  Maybe he'll figure out how to actually enjoy EVE now instead of hating his life when he logs in. 

[Ulphus]

That is, it is rather difficult to tell what a particular entity you encounter is, unless they make over-the-top proclamations about it.

And people have various schemes, which many people would be opposed to, if they were to find out.

But mostly, the only way people would find out about a scheme, is if the schemer tells them about it.

What are your thoughts on this sort of thing?

Thinking about this, I think it might be a bandwidth issue. There are all sorts of cues we don't get from characters in Eve, which we potentially can get IRL. There is not thousands of people gossiping at drunken parties about your corp saying to their friends "Yeah, I can't talk about it, but the boss is really an arsehole, and he has these evil plans", who gossip to their friends, and their friends etc... So there really aren't as many back-channels as there perhaps should be.

So the easy way for this information to leak out is for people to spread it themselves.

* Ulphus considers creating an alt who goes to bars and complains about the schemes of Ulf...

Not that I have any schemes or anything...

Honest.

[Kyoko Sakoda]

Meanwhile, in RP-land: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEiyBbP28g8

[Senn Typhos]

Meanwhile, in RP-land: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEiyBbP28g8

Mah spoon is too big! D:

[Silver Night]

That is, it is rather difficult to tell what a particular entity you encounter is, unless they make over-the-top proclamations about it.

And people have various schemes, which many people would be opposed to, if they were to find out.

But mostly, the only way people would find out about a scheme, is if the schemer tells them about it.

What are your thoughts on this sort of thing?

Thinking about this, I think it might be a bandwidth issue. There are all sorts of cues we don't get from characters in Eve, which we potentially can get IRL. There is not thousands of people gossiping at drunken parties about your corp saying to their friends "Yeah, I can't talk about it, but the boss is really an arsehole, and he has these evil plans", who gossip to their friends, and their friends etc... So there really aren't as many back-channels as there perhaps should be.

So the easy way for this information to leak out is for people to spread it themselves.

* Ulphus considers creating an alt who goes to bars and complains about the schemes of Ulf...

Not that I have any schemes or anything...

Honest.

I wonder if something could be set up. There is so much stuff that it isn't realistic for your character to blab about in public, but that might get leaked other ways - that OOC you might like to leak because it would lead to RPs, and which realistically someone who really wanted to know might find out.

It wouldn't even have to be true stuff. It could be like Em's gossip wiki, where most of the stuff is totally wrong, even if it has a grain of truth to it. It would just provide more surface area for RP to gain traction, though.

[Shae Tiann]

TBH I think we need to get rid of the hats.

The biggest problem I see with the whole "I am Evil!"/"I am Good!" thing is that it's all subjective and societally determined. An example, if you will indulge me:

The Amarr believe slavery is justified, the Gallente strongly disagree.

In accordance with contemporary Western culture, slavery is frowned upon, if not completely illegal; it does happen, more commonly than you might think, but it's considered Wrong. Because we're seeing the issue of slavery in Eve through the eyes of this contemporary perception of slavery, we end up with people who own slaves IC acting in an overtly sinister fashion.

But if you look at slave owners throughout Earth history -- even modern slave-owners -- they do not think of their actions as wrong or harmful to others. It's their way of life; it's a personal economy. You wouldn't find them lurking in a dark corner twirling their mustache and cackling deviously simply because they own slaves.

The point is that nobody ever views themself as being "evil". They may feel, morally, that their actions are in the wrong, but they have justification for why they do it. Even if that justification is a total fabrication to set their own mind at ease, nobody WANTS to think of themself as being "evil".

And then we have the conundrum of Eve. Eve is twenty thousand years into our future; society has fractured, collapsed, fractured again, and rebuilt itself. Society is going to be fundamentally different, and if you try to Westernise it and simplify it you end up with a sad little pile of clichés and parodies that just make people watching cringe.

I love watching people dispense with the hats when they RP; they have transcended contemporary cultural ideals and enabled themselves to portray a person who sees things differently.

[Inara Subaka]

RP hats are one of the reasons I tend to avoid RPing on IGS/Summit/Public Forums (for EVE anyways); everything that a character does that's not "okay" by RL society is judged by RL society standards, making it appear that Inara is wearing the "black felt hat" in an old western.

I love watching people dispense with the hats when they RP; they have transcended contemporary cultural ideals and enabled themselves to portray a person who sees things differently.

This is how I try to approach things when RPing Inara. She doesn't see the things she does as evil, just business and unfortunately sometimes business involves unnecessary deaths of those that refuse to come to reasonable terms (Inara's perspective IC, not mine OOC). And by the terms of the society (Capsuleers in general, as well as the "pirate" element of EVE) she immerses herself in... she's not "abnormal", she's actually "average".

By modern cultural ideals (which aren't all good, in my personal opinion) she'd be in Gitmo and no lawyer would ever consider raising a case if she was being tortured for information, and many would consider her a monster.

[Louella Dougans]

Not just about "good" vs "evil", it's also about the kind of weirdness of it all.

It's like comic book supervillains, or the Bond villains, explaining their scheme to the captive/restrained superheroes/Bond.

Like, suppose someone was to organise a planetary raid on Planet X, with PI structures, freighters + industrials full of troops + supplies, etc.

It's a big effort to set that up, and there would be lots of opportunity for interesting/enjoyable RP and pvp in opposing it/fighting through to complete it.

But that only happens if someone deliberately mentions it ahead of time. Which feels a bit artificial or metagamey to me.

It's like a medieval challenge, like ones that happened here. "In 3 days time, we shall tether a pig on your land, and the devil take any of yours that try and move it."
And that sort of thing only fits with a handful of character concepts - esp. arrogant types.

[hellgremlin]

At times, looking at things going on ingame, and on IGS, I feel this sort of thing happens:



That is, it is rather difficult to tell what a particular entity you encounter is, unless they make over-the-top proclamations about it.

And people have various schemes, which many people would be opposed to, if they were to find out.

But mostly, the only way people would find out about a scheme, is if the schemer tells them about it.

What are your thoughts on this sort of thing?

Ever watch a movie where the sneering villain monologues to the captured protagonist, explaining every step of his devious plot and laying out the reasons why it is IMPOSSIBLE to fail?

It's a bit like that.

edit: And of course, the post directly above mine says the same thing, which I failed to notice :\

[Louella Dougans]

* Louella Dougans hugs Istvaan