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[Seriphyn]

(Actually figured this can have its own topic, as its a worthy discussion, so here's a simply c+p from what I would have replied)

Seriphyn's celebrity status is only within Federation non-capsuleers, in fact I think I've made it clear enough, with various posts of press conferences to the ordinary press, and the Quafe sponsorship being targeted at ordinary citizens. And even then, he's only a celebrity in the Placid area, since that's the place he is based, and has worked for a year in liberating and defending, so I figured it makes sense. For other capsuleers who worked in the same conflicts, barely any of them are RPers, and thus the license to explain why they are not celebrities is because they do not give themselves any public exposure.

However, if Seriphyn visits, say, Sinq Laison, where the cosmopolitan population most likely don't give a shit about the war, he's just another capsuleer. If he goes to the Republic, same thing. If he ever visits the State, well, again, another capsuleer, though perhaps somewhat disliked by certain Caldari Navy officers. And in the Amarr Empire, just another enemy militia pilot. He finds this "refreshing" to be able to visit somewhere, baseline, and not get hounded by various Gallentean and Intaki girls.

An example of a news item regarding player-capsuleer celebrity statuses amongst the general populace

Not letting their spirits be dulled, the organizers continued straight on to the Miss Federation beauty contest. The contest was decided by a Federation wide voting system to ensure every citizen could participate, and Uni Zueto (of Gemini Federation), an Amarr by birth but now a naturalized citizen , was crowned Miss Federation for the year 109. Despite not being born in the Federation, her victory was welcomed by it's citizens. "She's not Gallentean, but her heart is in the right place," said pod-pilot Tiffy Mezzier. "Her winning demonstrates the diversity of the Federation."

The celebrations continued long into the night, with both pod-pilots and citizens joining in with the festivities. Across the Federation, similar celebrations were held in both orbital stations and planetside, with extravagant parades taking place in major population centers. The Federation police services reported no serious incidents, but there were a number of arrests arising from drink-fueled disputes.

I am a massive "Do things according to PF" type RPer, mainly because I have to take what I can get when I RP a faction where you have to scrape that damn barrel for any sort of cohesive lore and PF. Nothing I do, as such, whether SDII or celebrity, is 'out-of-line' with PF, because of this nature to "stick to the rules".

Anyway, I like this topic very much. Some capsuleers are anonymous, almost totally unknown by anyone other than CONCORD. Some capsuleers are in incredible standing with their faction, but only for their military work, and just stick to pilot parts of station...what do people RP? I think Graelyn RPs this fame too, but, ah, doesn't whore it IC as much as me 

[Merdaneth]

I don't really care overmuch about Seriphyn's status among non-capsuleers. I never speak to non-capsuleers, they never speak to me, there is no way to properly establish a capsuleer's status among non-capsuleers for me. If enough people corroborate his story and the story make sense and is internally consistent, then I will likely believe it. But without any noticable in-game reflection of such a status, does it really matter that much?

I am a massive 'PF is no different from other IC sources of information' freak. News message from Federation agencies are just as suspect as info coming Seriphyn, Soter, Andreus or someone else who is actually giving me IC info on the Federation (and honestly, there isn't a lot).

Heck, Amarr news agencies are also suspect. Merdaneth believes all factions and people are biased when it comes to presenting info.

Hence I often collide with people that consider PF 'immutable fact from an unquestionable source' rather than simple a biased opinion like any other.

Faction standings I find completely unplayable other than an indicator of how much missions you've done for a faction. It doesn't imply anything. I could have 10.0 standing to the Amarr Empire, join some extreme anti-Amarr group tomorrow and still be 10.0 standings for many months to come. I can post horrible things about Jamyl on the IGS and my Sarum Family and Emperor Family standings will remain exactly as they were. Those standings (by all logic) cannot indicate how well you are liked, or such things would have an effect.

[Benjamin Shepherd]

I find the concept of being a capsuleer politician odd when you are representing non-capsuleers. A more realistic proposition is if that representation is for capsuleers, or when you have majority ownership on a planet that you are harvesting (if CCP ever releases additional stats that lets us view other players' colonies).

As for my own character, I feel ICly that I only work with capsuleers, and rarely speak with normal citizens of any empire due to Jita 4-4's revealing canon. Benji also feels that, since there are already 350k capsuleers or so, there is nothing to be famous for. He carries on like he did before he signed up for the program.

[Senn Typhos]

The line between humans and capsuleers is a little hazy, to me. Its easy to imagine something non-human being a celebrity of sorts, hell, Shamu has had four whales play his role at Sea World since he died. But thats an easy situation for us to accustom ourselves to; its viewed as a animal, its something we have to personify to bring it up to OUR level. Same thing we do with out domestic pets.

But going above human limits, suddenly the situation is different. Yes, comic book superheroes are elevated to celebrity status too, but thats a fantastic representation of what I think must happen to capsuleer "celebrities." On some level, humans can relate to them; they embody things we want to be, they generate fanclubs in their home cities. But, on the other hand, an equal portion of the human population sees them as suspicious, menacing, even evil. They don't want them to be made into celebrities, they want them demonized.

What I'm trying to say here is, considering how tumultuous the universe is, public view of capsuleers must be so varying that calling them "celebrities" is almost impossible. Unless you put your back into some serious PF, your character won't develop a recognized fanclub, and if it does, you're going to get a smack in the face from the public for your ego-stroking. Chrons like "All These Lives" and "Jita 4-4" show us examples of how "normal humans" view anyone who can massacre a million lives a day with a thought.

There's hundreds of thousands of us, and countless of them, yet we're still more powerful. I could imagine that despite where their allegiances lie, capsuleers will always be regarded with suspicion and fear, even anger. Perhaps there are good feelings towards them, but hell, unless you knew how vulnerable they were in their clone bays, how could you NOT be a little afraid?

And before anyone says it, Tony Stark IS a human. He can put on elaborate shows because he feels like it.

I think Bill said it best. Eggers aren't Clark Kent. If you want to be a celebrity, you'll have to put on those glasses and suit, because the real you is terrifying.

[Benjamin Shepherd]

Senn, +10 Respect for referencing one of Tarantino's best.

[Senn Typhos]

Senn, +10 Respect for referencing one of Tarantino's best.

Why thank you, I thought it was appropriate. :3

[Vieve]

In Celeste's case, I've tried to play that her celebrity status went down after she became a capsuleer.  She dropped off the media map, so to speak, after her arrest and incarceration by FIO three years ago.

Not that her status was high to begin with: at its peak, it was likely on a par with Louis Finkel's. (Never heard of Louis Finkel?   He's the current Chief of Staff for the U.S. House of Representatives' Committee on Science and Technology.)

[Zag]

The character/s that I play have tended to be intensely private individuals. The only particular 'fame' I think they would have would be in fairly limited circles.

[Gottii]

One of the things I see as weird with Seri and fame is that Seri's storyline seems to be going in two separate directions, one of them being the public face of Black Eagle death squads, the other being a celebrity publicly endorsing products.  These seem rather at odds.

Covert operatives, particularly ones taking part in illegal assassinations, run away from publicity and notice like the plague.  Indeed, covert agents are picked particularly because they're the type of people who dont want or need public acclaim. The people who need that kind of attention are the ones most likely to spill their secrets at a bar to try to impress a girl, or pen some tell all book down the line, which obviously is not good.  That need for publicity and celebrity is the last thing you would want in a covert operative.

Yeah they want their actions to be seen and noticed, especially in these kind of terror ops, but not them as individuals, its more effective in both the terror they spread and their ability to conduct missions if they're a faceless terror.  And, again, there is a very good chance they're eventually prosecuted for their actions, or even targeted themselves.  So the people offered up as a public face are often a patsy and an offered target and decoy as much as a spokesman.

Now that Seri has stepped forward as the public face of these death squads, it would make sense that Quafe would pull their endorsement, and do everything they could to distance themselves from him.  The last thing they would want is for the public to associate their product with death squads, illegal summary execution, loyalty through paranoia, and faceless terror and fear. Not exactly the kind of feelings that make people want to reach for a soft drink.  It would be marketing suicide.

I dont mind celebrity in a capsuleer.  But it should be a hindrance as well as a boon.  

[Vikarion]

One of the things I see as weird with Seri and fame is that Seri's storyline seems to be going in two separate directions, one of them being the public face of Black Eagle death squads, the other being a celebrity publicly endorsing products.  These seem rather at odds.

Covert operatives, particularly ones taking part in illegal assassinations, run away from publicity and notice like the plague.  Indeed, covert agents are picked particularly because they're the type of people who dont want or need public acclaim. The people who need that kind of attention are the ones most likely to spill their secrets at a bar to try to impress a girl, or pen some tell all book down the line, which obviously is not good.  That need for publicity and celebrity is the last thing you would want in a covert operative.

Yeah they want their actions to be seen and noticed, especially in these kind of terror ops, but not them as individuals, its more effective in both the terror they spread and their ability to conduct missions if they're a faceless terror.  And, again, there is a very good chance they're eventually prosecuted for their actions, or even targeted themselves.  So the people offered up as a public face are often a patsy and an offered target and decoy as much as a spokesman.

Now that Seri has stepped forward as the public face of these death squads, it would make sense that Quafe would pull their endorsement, and do everything they could to distance themselves from him.  The last thing they would want is for the public to associate their product with death squads, illegal summary execution, loyalty through paranoia, and faceless terror and fear. Not exactly the kind of feelings that make people want to reach for a soft drink.  It would be marketing suicide.

I dont mind celebrity in a capsuleer.  But it should be a hindrance as well as a boon.  

Why? James Bond, were he real and outed as an agent, wouldn't be able to get a moment's peace between sponsorship offers.

Remember, what the Gallente people see is a brave fighter for freedom ferreting out traitors amongst capsuleer and private citizen alike, protecting them from the brutal Caldari war machine.

Think about it - the Federation just finished having most of its low-sec territories occupied, and the counter-push into Black Rise first slowed, then stalled, and has been mostly repulsed. The war is a dead even stalemate.

This has to be very frightening for the Gallente. To the majority of the population, who probably still see the State as a minor break-away state, watching the Caldari first conquer Caldari Prime, then occupy Gallente low-sec, and then successfully face down the counter-attack...well, it's probably a period of national trauma. Emotionally, it's a bit like China facing down Taiwan, losing Tibet and all their islands, and then, even when they push them back, unable to actually invade.

In such an atmosphere of fear and insecurity, it's quite likely that they would happily look for people willing to "do what it takes" to win.

[Graanvlokkie]

Why? James Bond, were he real and outed as an agent, wouldn't be able to get a moment's peace between sponsorship offers.

Remember, what the Gallente people see is a brave fighter for freedom ferreting out traitors amongst capsuleer and private citizen alike, protecting them from the brutal Caldari war machine ...

Interesting thought. Like the "G-Men" of old.

[Senn Typhos]

I suppose I hadn't thought about celebrity in the forms we usually see it in...

I guess in that definition, we could just be talking about a capsuleer version "the Situation." :/

[Goshien]

I read that tidbit and come up with 'capsuleers' are celeberities. The fact that you are a pilot makes it not who you are. I figure a kind of celebrity likes status from people involved in and around the industry behind capsuleers, but general working populace would probably not know the names/faces of a good chunk of the pilot populace.

Example: CEO's of large companines being rich as fuck probally have any number of followers and such, but not many people outside the financial purview would know who the hell runs which company.

[Louella Dougans]

Wasn't Eliot Ness a bit of a celebrity at the time?

[Boma Airaken]

I am so totally displeased that I am not being discussed in this thread.