Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Silas Vitalia]

Sometimes in abusive relationships the victim can be brainwashed into thinking they deserve the treatment they are getting, even that they want it on some level.       


They have such a difficult/weird relationship with the playerbase.  On the one hand trying to be cool and friendly and then on the other hand being secretive and back-stabby on a regular basis.   We have to remember that it's a big company and plenty of people are making decisions for plenty of other people who may or may not agree with what's going on. 

If it's your paying job to tell the proles that 'everything is alright' even if you are lying through your teeth, we can't get too upset with the messenger. 

[PracticalTechnicality]

I agree, though when they know that duplicity will be part and parcel of community management an element of professional distance might actually be beneficial.  Rather than cultivating a community that already has certain individuals earmarked as 'liars' or certain policies as 'betrayal' at the Dev level.  These emotive labels are products of the 'wanna be like common people' attitude that CCP Devs seem to revel in; the policies are pretty much standard fare - the bad press something almost every developer runs into eventually.  It is the 'abusive relationship' as you so aptly put it, that magnifies these small issues into prime evils in the eyes of the community members affected.

Shooting the messenger might seem unfair, but when he or she is sticking you in the back (or so you feel, regardless of what is really happening), it is pretty hard not to pull the metaphorical trigger despite assurances it is 'nothing personal'.  The guys up top won't get the message until they run out of messengers or customers.

Having said this - I consider it noteworthy that CCP itself and only a small subset of it's representation are the only thing I feel embittered about.  EVE is a great game that I enjoy, warts and all, but cuddling up with Devs that like to dutch oven you and say 'that's love baby' turns me off a fair bit. 

[Silas Vitalia]

I agree, though when they know that duplicity will be part and parcel of community management an element of professional distance might actually be beneficial.  Rather than cultivating a community that already has certain individuals earmarked as 'liars' or certain policies as 'betrayal' at the Dev level.  These emotive labels are products of the 'wanna be like common people' attitude that CCP Devs seem to revel in; the policies are pretty much standard fare - the bad press something almost every developer runs into eventually.  It is the 'abusive relationship' as you so aptly put it, that magnifies these small issues into prime evils in the eyes of the community members affected.

Shooting the messenger might seem unfair, but when he or she is sticking you in the back (or so you feel, regardless of what is really happening), it is pretty hard not to pull the metaphorical trigger despite assurances it is 'nothing personal'.  The guys up top won't get the message until they run out of messengers or customers.

Having said this - I consider it noteworthy that CCP itself and only a small subset of it's representation are the only thing I feel embittered about.  EVE is a great game that I enjoy, warts and all, but cuddling up with Devs that like to dutch oven you and say 'that's love baby' turns me off a fair bit.

Do we have examples of gaming companies who do this the 'right' way? I'm not that familiar with the rest of the industry. What's a good developer that is open and responsive to the community?

I want to see how CIG (star citizen) does once the rubber hits the road because right now it's easy to look fantastic and open when the game isn't out yet and a thousand people aren't yelling about 'nerf x'

[PracticalTechnicality]

No one does it right IMO, but people should always push for better - of themselves, their community and their community representatives. 

That is all I am saying really - I do not expect miracles, but decoupling what is said from how it is said, and requesting a professional, clear, concise report on the changes being made, regardless of the community hurf blurf, would level out a lot of the emotional roller-coaster and out-of-synch responses. 

The improvement of customer-provider relationships is an iterative process; part arms race between the thinking audience and marketing dept., part clearly defining changes and managing community expectations (in this case what to expect from a Dev interaction).  We don't need to be unreasonable pushing for better, and hell, we ourselves need to have a good hard look in the mirror (or at our families, jobs, outside) when we feel a sense of betrayal welling up over a game.  But push for better we should, starting with that mirror and ending with offering it to those would state they represent our community, when they are merely an interface with the company that provided the sand we distributed ourselves, the community, in. 

Tl;Dr - I cannot disagree with a thing you say Silas, because we're pretty much two sides of a spinning coin right now.  You are absolutely right in your assessment of how things are and the general state of gaming communities.  I just hope that I am in that ballpark with my insistence that through introspection, analysis and a demand for better standards, we can have authority figures who act the way they would like us to, and dispense of this false camaraderie in favour of a more honest, friendly-but-professional means of disseminating information. 

[Silas Vitalia]

No one does it right IMO, but people should always push for better - of themselves, their community and their community representatives. 

That is all I am saying really - I do not expect miracles, but decoupling what is said from how it is said, and requesting a professional, clear, concise report on the changes being made, regardless of the community hurf blurf, would level out a lot of the emotional roller-coaster and out-of-synch responses. 

The improvement of customer-provider relationships is an iterative process; part arms race between the thinking audience and marketing dept., part clearly defining changes and managing community expectations (in this case what to expect from a Dev interaction).  We don't need to be unreasonable pushing for better, and hell, we ourselves need to have a good hard look in the mirror (or at our families, jobs, outside) when we feel a sense of betrayal welling up over a game.  But push for better we should, starting with that mirror and ending with offering it to those would state they represent our community, when they are merely an interface with the company that provided the sand we distributed ourselves, the community, in. 

Tl;Dr - I cannot disagree with a thing you say Silas, because we're pretty much two sides of a spinning coin right now.  You are absolutely right in your assessment of how things are and the general state of gaming communities.  I just hope that I am in that ballpark with my insistence that through introspection, analysis and a demand for better standards, we can have authority figures who act the way they would like us to, and dispense of this false camaraderie in favour of a more honest, friendly-but-professional means of disseminating information.

I don't think we disagree at all

I guess what I want is EVE people to expect more from CCP.  Shiny trailers are awesome. Shiny demos of walking around and shooting things are awesome.  They don't mean shit aside from tapes of people clapping and cheering, though.   Instead of shiny trailers and cryptic announcements why not just be honest and open and talk about what the plans are? 

CCP is one of those developers that's particularly guilty of showing something shiny and super cool looking, 'look at all the awesome shit coming your way!' and then radio silence for months or years 'oh, uh, you didn't want that anyway'

Now this following example could be completely full of shit as well, but this is exactly the kind of thing I'd want from CCP every month.  Every department just writes a few paragraphs, shows a few pictures, and you wouldn't believe how far that can go.  Read this and see what I mean.

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/13848-Monthly-Report-April-2014

[Shiori]

I want to see how CIG (star citizen) does once the rubber hits the road because right now it's easy to look fantastic and open when the game isn't out yet and a thousand people aren't yelling about 'nerf x'

My balls tighten just imagining how this bunch will face down the reverse swing of the hype pendulum. My money's on a lot of shell-shocked community managers lying around hugging themselves, moaning "what the fuck happened" over and over while copiously bleeding out the ass.

[Elmund Egivand]

I want to see how CIG (star citizen) does once the rubber hits the road because right now it's easy to look fantastic and open when the game isn't out yet and a thousand people aren't yelling about 'nerf x'

My balls tighten just imagining how this bunch will face down the reverse swing of the hype pendulum. My money's on a lot of shell-shocked community managers lying around hugging themselves, moaning "what the fuck happened" over and over while copiously bleeding out the ass.

Get them 10cc of HTFU serum each, STAT!