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that the Society for the Conservation of State Traditions is a fiercly nationalistic Caldari lobbyist organization that unleashed a scathing rebuke of PIE Inc. pilot Kostantin Mort in late YC106.

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Author Topic: The "Purity" War  (Read 607 times)

Casserina Leshrac

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The "Purity" War
« on: 08 May 2017, 11:00 »

Figured I go OOC about this since that is the purpose of this board.

OK with the Purity of the Throne war-dec'ing Sani and Faithful Amarr factions I am wondering if this going to lead up to something bigger.

Currently I am hearing some whispers that suggest that some of the more Faithful corps had finally enough hanging around and causing non-drama.

Don't get me wrong playing the character I do, I do sort of ask being war-dec'ed just for being heretic.

I can see the current message of P-THR which is "If you converse with them you must be with them mentality," which could cause a shift in perception to a presumably loyal Amarr Corp.

Thoughts, ideas.. discuss
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Ilan Ardishapur

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Re: The "Purity" War
« Reply #1 on: 08 May 2017, 12:39 »

Ilan and presumably the Purists are a collection of hardliner/conservative/traditionalist Amarr, who obviously are very upset that their team lost. I'm not sure that the war or even the words of a branded traditionalist heretic will change much internally for loyalist corps, in the public eye though, it is possible.

However, I can't speak for the real loyalist groups out there.
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Lunarisse Aspenstar

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Re: The "Purity" War
« Reply #2 on: 08 May 2017, 13:04 »

I would hope SFRIM has enough of a track record it won't amongst loyalist corps.

That being said, with respect to "If you converse with them you must be with them mentalit", there's ic/ooc challenge to this particular tact as to one "loyalist" corps can be very vulnerable too.  SFRIM has never adopted PIE's strict rules as to venues/channels/fleets.  Part of the rationale is ooc - the rp community is segregated enough and we'd rather have our rpers able to be out in the community creating and sharing content rather than be a 'closed shop'.  Part of it is IC - to sow the 'good word' one has to be in the fields, amongst the wheat and weeds alike, in order to do so.    While personally I welcome new adversaries, my main concern is constantly defending against that particular line of attack is it causes ooc/ic challenges from a big picture POV.  Particularly since this whole matter arose from an ooc blunder by a player looking forward to talking to an old eve friend and who had no awareness of the sort of things that happen on the IGS when people post.  He's aware now, unfortunately!
« Last Edit: 08 May 2017, 13:12 by Lunarisse Aspenstar »
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Ilan Ardishapur

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Re: The "Purity" War
« Reply #3 on: 08 May 2017, 13:43 »

I really doubt SFRIM's name will be in jeopardy. Purists are Ultra-Conservitive in nature, SFRIM is liberal leaning and PIE is centrist. It is a IC political dynamic that should be embraced and built upon while ensuring a civil, respectful OOC relationship is maintained.
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Casserina Leshrac

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Re: The "Purity" War
« Reply #4 on: 09 May 2017, 08:55 »

First to Ilan for giving us a brawl last night. Many Thanks

You gave my boys something to chew on in regards that no matter what you do in EvE there is always PvP. Personally I didn't think my old tired skills were up to the task. Well not completely so I look forward to the next engagement.

IC threats to follow on the appropriate channels.

That being said we must develop the RP and OOC interactions together and openly. That way idea can grow and evolve beyond the Corp Lore and Prime Fiction.
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Utari Onzo

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Re: The "Purity" War
« Reply #5 on: 09 May 2017, 10:11 »

Personally I'm just happy to see people finding entertainment from going pew-pee in space from IC interaction.
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Casserina Leshrac

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Re: The "Purity" War
« Reply #6 on: 09 May 2017, 13:32 »

I really doubt SFRIM's name will be in jeopardy. Purists are Ultra-Conservitive in nature, SFRIM is liberal leaning and PIE is centrist. It is a IC political dynamic that should be embraced and built upon while ensuring a civil, respectful OOC relationship is maintained.

Actually it could be very easily be in jeopardy. Take look on how PIE reacted their RP practically dictates what they want to do. Not I am trying to second guess the PIE players since they would know best.

But Sanguine Illuminations party line is to add gray to what should be a Black and White issues.

A "good" Sani Sabik? How could that be? The Loyalists say she's evil and corrupt. But she's delivering medical supplies in Efu. Then it's because she is up to something.

And thing that led me to this RP what the SS RP which have demented madmen until Casserina's return.

At the same time we really have PIE and P-THR also playing on the old tropes to make Casserina out as the bad guy.
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Julianni Avala

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Re: The "Purity" War
« Reply #7 on: 09 May 2017, 14:00 »

The idea of the purity people and pie "making Cass out to be the bad guy" just seems like an in character thing, in my opinion. In fact, all if this just seems like it's an ic reaction. If someone is affiliating with what characters feel is a "bad guy", then they will react accordingly.

All of this has rp potential, really. It turns into content. I'm not saying that it doesn't suck, because any sort of conflict can weigh on you if you're leading an organization. Trust me. But at the same time, I'm not sure it's so easy to handwave interactions as ooc. It's not just one organization that's effected.

Maybe I'm not understanding what's being said here. Correct me if I'm wrong, as I don't want to misunderstand, but it seems to me like people are worried about ic consequences to ic actions?
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Ilan Ardishapur

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Re: The "Purity" War
« Reply #8 on: 10 May 2017, 02:44 »

At the same time we really have PIE and P-THR also playing on the old tropes to make Casserina out as the bad guy.

I can't speak for PIE but P-THR are traditionalists, obviously to the point of heresy. Casserina and any heretic or heathen is a bad guy in their eyes. If P-THR had the funds they would issue a war declaration to all heretic organizations, and I'm sure they will given time. It is all IC in reaction.
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Casserina Leshrac

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Re: The "Purity" War
« Reply #9 on: 10 May 2017, 17:04 »

In reality the Amarr Faith is literally a duality stemming from the same source.

The Holy Scriptures among which the "Faithful" or "Loyalists" tend to follow. How this is viewed depends on the House and Holder.

The Apocryphon is a collection of rejected books by the Theology Council which the Sani Sabik has adopted as their primary source material.

To be a "Traditional" Sani Sabik, one must strive on individualism, the ability to lead and demonstration of power. So frequently to be Sani Sabik is to buck tradition and challenge Traditional Core Values.
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Gaven Lok ri

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Re: The "Purity" War
« Reply #10 on: 19 May 2017, 23:16 »

Yay! I remembered my log in.

PIE claims traditionalism, to some degree. But we are more absolute monarchisy centralist (note, not centrist) than truly traditionalist
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Gaven Lok ri

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Re: The "Purity" War
« Reply #11 on: 19 May 2017, 23:23 »

If you want to understand PIE in one scripture quote:

"Here we are.
This is the world of God.
We are his chosen ones.
This place, this planet of peace and abundance, he made for us. It's ours for the taking.
There will be obstacles and difficulties. That's his test. We must make his gift deserving.
This beginning.
This birth of life.
This dawn of greatness.
We can not fail, for we have the Emperor to lead us and destiny to follow."
- The Scriptures, Second Letter of St. Junip of Aerui
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Casserina Leshrac

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Re: The "Purity" War
« Reply #12 on: 23 May 2017, 15:38 »

Gaven, I remember coming across a whole lot of stuff that you did Scripture-wise for PIE.

Awesome body of work.

Now if I could only do the same with the Apocryphicon. Sadly I just have a few fragments from my time in Dark Seraph and Bloodveil.
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Gaven Lok ri

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Re: The "Purity" War
« Reply #13 on: 24 May 2017, 20:17 »

Well, one thing that is worth thinking about with Sani Sabik scriptures is that you have a lot more creative license than loyalists do. We basically cannot use non-PF scripture, because the TC is controlling and policing.

I would expect sanist scripture to look a lot more like pre-Nicea Christian scripture. That is, it would be fragmented and bizarre and surviving in single books or small libraries, none of which have the same content as the next. It's not like the Sani Sabik can safely have a church council to decide which books are real and which are not, after all. I mean, Omir could and probably has done something like that, but unless you are RPing specifically one of his followers, there is no reason you would follow his lead.

So how I imagine the Apocryphal scriptures is that each community is going to make those decisions for themselves based on what survived in those particular communities, and that they are going to have wildly different ideas about which texts count and which texts are more important. I would also expect that the only thing creating any illusion of a monolithic Sanist movement is the Amarr authority's tendency to label new heresies with old names.

So I would expect many Sani groups start like this: someone finds an old library with a compelling book, starts preaching it. Amarr doesn't like it, goes down the list of banned Theologies, decides that "oh, this is one of the Sanist ones." Then makes a proclamation that so and so preacher is a Sanist, at which point he probably seeks out other people labeled Sanists (if he lives long enough).

What this means for you from an OOC standpoint is that you can actively make up scripture rather than only relying on a small body of curated scripture. As long as you do not claim that *all* sani followers believe the text is sacred, you are on pretty solid ground.
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Louella Dougans

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Re: The "Purity" War
« Reply #14 on: 24 May 2017, 23:22 »

There are only like 2 known CCP written quotes from the Apocryphon:

"My word lies within all, All it requires is the breath of faith, To ignite the fire, So the lost can find their way, So the fallen can rise, To take their place as my chosen, For you are all my creation, And are all equal in my kingdom." - Apocryphon, Lost Passages

"For all life is holy, and if a man revels in his own death he is become the Beast, And that man will come before the Beast after death, and stay at his knees forever." - Apocryphon, Lost Passages

also note that the Apocryphon has been studied at times by Imperial scholars, including the Tetrimon Order.

http://wiki.eve-inspiracy.com/index.php?title=Sani_Sabik#The_Apocryphon

http://backstage.eve-inspiracy.com/index.php?topic=372.0 might also be helpful
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