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Author Topic: After TonyG... then what?  (Read 8327 times)

Vieve

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Re: After TonyG... then what?
« Reply #15 on: 14 May 2013, 11:31 »

*  More fracturing within the Federation along racial lines.

Not just Gallente vs. Matari or Gallente vs. Intaki (though I would love to see a ruling against the practice of the Reborn process within Federation space and the fallout from same), but Jin-Mei vs. everybody, including themselves. 

And what grounds would the Jin-Mei have to get up in arms? Why, their precious caste system.  Has it grown stronger over the years, or has it broken down/begun to break down outside of Lirsautton?  Are there those who believe it can now be abolished entirely?

* More fracturing within the Republic along tribal/clan lines.

If the Sebbies and the Brutors go after one another, time might be ripe for a Krusual/Vherkie coalition to take the Republic's lunch money.

* Ardi Freaking Shapur and the Kingdom of "We're More Holy Than Thou" Ammatar.


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Shintoko Akahoshi

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Re: After TonyG... then what?
« Reply #16 on: 14 May 2013, 11:47 »

I can't really see something like your ruling against the practice of the Reborn, considering how integrated Intaki are within the Federation. There are simply too many high ranking Intaki in the Federation government to see something like that happen.

What I can imagine (and would love to see) would be something more of a "World's Rights" movement. The Federation isn't the most "federal" of republics, and individual planets have far more relative power than modern U.S. states do, for instance. You saw (bizarrely amplified) versions of this in the Intaki development auctions. It would be interesting to see more of this. It could lead to some pretty grimdark in-game effects, as well: Mission runners for Creodron might be given missions to disrupt industrial operations of Roden in Placid, for instance.

Creep

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Re: After TonyG... then what?
« Reply #17 on: 14 May 2013, 12:30 »

I can't really see something like your ruling against the practice of the Reborn, considering how integrated Intaki are within the Federation. There are simply too many high ranking Intaki in the Federation government to see something like that happen.

What I can imagine (and would love to see) would be something more of a "World's Rights" movement. The Federation isn't the most "federal" of republics, and individual planets have far more relative power than modern U.S. states do, for instance. You saw (bizarrely amplified) versions of this in the Intaki development auctions. It would be interesting to see more of this. It could lead to some pretty grimdark in-game effects, as well: Mission runners for Creodron might be given missions to disrupt industrial operations of Roden in Placid, for instance.
YES. This is exactly what I'd want to see. Less racial stuff which plays to stereotypes (and which we already have in great abundance), more ideology and philosophy of power!
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Esna Pitoojee

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Re: After TonyG... then what?
« Reply #18 on: 14 May 2013, 12:31 »

I'm throwing my weight behind the "FW needs to be ended/significantly altered" argument as well. The de-TonyGification of the political scene would either leave the Big 4 having accomplished their primary goals or be entirely unable to do so:
- The Amarr cannot exactly strike at the Elder Fleet or any of the various freedom figher groups outside of the warzone without a full-on invasion of the Republic. Conversely, the Minmatar are probably not freeing many slaves as the warzone is almost certainly scorched to a wasteland by now; the largest slave populations also lay far beyond the militia's reach.
- The Gallente will have actually achieved one of their major goals - the removal of Heth - and unless something major shifts will probably still be solidly in control of their border as well. The Caldari, in contrast, will likely have realized by then that the Federation really isn't that interested in trying another bloody invasion of Caldari Prime, leaving them solidly in control of their primary goal while the continuing border war proves both unsuccessful and unprofitable.
- I do not favor turning FW into a full-on war due to the same difficulties that were faced by Incursions and the current incarnation of FW: If it gets implemented, we can expect to see an utterly unchanging and boring mechanic for the next several years, with some minor tweaks but ultimately no significant shifts - because lets face it, CCP can't radically redesign a mechanic that large, that quickly.

So, what DO I want?
- Relations between the Big 4 turn to a shaky, cold peace as all four acknowledge that the border conflicts have essentially netted them nothing and cost an uncountable volume of lives. As the years go on, we could see articles about the restoration of trade, diplomatic cross-contact efforts, etc.
- The Empire turns inward, leading an internal reclaiming aimed at purging infestations of Blood Raider and Nation sympathetics. This soon expands to those who dealt with the Cartel, Serpentis, and other smaller pirate operations as the true extent of the corruption the extended war had fostered becomes clear. This leads to some conflict between the houses that feel they are "purer" and those they feel are "more contaminated". At the same time, the bulk of the Empire's forces are redeployed to handle engagements against the Raiders or Nation to the far edge  of the Empire.
- The State is still handling the turmoil from Heth's departure, but things seem shaky as old debts between megacorps and rising postwar unemployment shake at the foundations of the megacorps' power. Looking for both a solution to the legions of unemployed workers and the raids by Guristas seeking to take advantage of the chaos, the State declares a no-tolerance policy and makes its first objective halting the attacks by its most annoying foe - all the while hoping the policy holds them over long enough to flatten out the debts.
- The Federation finds itself in a militarily strong position, but continues to be shaken by tensions between ethic groups - not just Matari-Gallente, but also by Jin-Mei and some Intaki groups, who view the recent anti-immigrant upswing with deep concern. Along with the continued political ramifications of the Black Eagles' actions, Roden desperately searches for a uniting force to paper over the differences - and finds it in the Serpentis, who he can blame for the wartime PR catastrophe of drugged-up Federation soldiers murdering innocents. A "policing task force" is quickly destroyed by Serpentis and Guardian Angel assets, leaving Roden forced to send a full force to avoid appearing weak to "mere pirates".
- The Republic finds itself embroiled in tribal tensions as well, but even these cannot hold back a tidal wave of previously-repressed Matar rage when the Cartel attempts a second annexation of a Republic border world. Facing the first open attack on a protected Republic system in years, the tribes turn their full might against the Cartel - perhaps to the concern of the Thukkers, who still have some contacts there.

Your guys' thoughts?
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I like the implications of Gallentians being punched in the face by walking up to a Minmatar as they so freely use another person's culture as a fad.

Anslol

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Re: After TonyG... then what?
« Reply #19 on: 14 May 2013, 12:35 »

'Boy Anslo your press release sure was good, you're such a great writer!'

Oh thanks! Eeeh I'm not so good, just practiced. Ho ho ho~

...ho.
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Lyn Farel

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Re: After TonyG... then what?
« Reply #20 on: 14 May 2013, 12:39 »

Ardishapur grip on the Mandate shattering to cinders, and the Mandate becoming for the first time of its existence something else than the cluster apathetic laughing stock. Or anything else that fixes that, but always "Ardishapur this Ardishapur that" in lieu of Mandate news is hardly the way to make the Mandate interesting at all, quite the contrary actually.
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Pieter Tuulinen

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Re: After TonyG... then what?
« Reply #21 on: 14 May 2013, 12:42 »

Yeah, so done with the economic powerhouse of New Eden being economically incompetent, thanks. If the State has problems, let them be internal and political.
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Creep

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Re: After TonyG... then what?
« Reply #22 on: 14 May 2013, 12:48 »

I'm throwing my weight behind the "FW needs to be ended/significantly altered" argument as well. The de-TonyGification of the political scene would either leave the Big 4 having accomplished their primary goals or be entirely unable to do so:
- The Amarr cannot exactly strike at the Elder Fleet or any of the various freedom figher groups outside of the warzone without a full-on invasion of the Republic. Conversely, the Minmatar are probably not freeing many slaves as the warzone is almost certainly scorched to a wasteland by now; the largest slave populations also lay far beyond the militia's reach.
- The Gallente will have actually achieved one of their major goals - the removal of Heth - and unless something major shifts will probably still be solidly in control of their border as well. The Caldari, in contrast, will likely have realized by then that the Federation really isn't that interested in trying another bloody invasion of Caldari Prime, leaving them solidly in control of their primary goal while the continuing border war proves both unsuccessful and unprofitable.
- I do not favor turning FW into a full-on war due to the same difficulties that were faced by Incursions and the current incarnation of FW: If it gets implemented, we can expect to see an utterly unchanging and boring mechanic for the next several years, with some minor tweaks but ultimately no significant shifts - because lets face it, CCP can't radically redesign a mechanic that large, that quickly.

So, what DO I want?
- Relations between the Big 4 turn to a shaky, cold peace as all four acknowledge that the border conflicts have essentially netted them nothing and cost an uncountable volume of lives. As the years go on, we could see articles about the restoration of trade, diplomatic cross-contact efforts, etc.
- The Empire turns inward, leading an internal reclaiming aimed at purging infestations of Blood Raider and Nation sympathetics. This soon expands to those who dealt with the Cartel, Serpentis, and other smaller pirate operations as the true extent of the corruption the extended war had fostered becomes clear. This leads to some conflict between the houses that feel they are "purer" and those they feel are "more contaminated". At the same time, the bulk of the Empire's forces are redeployed to handle engagements against the Raiders or Nation to the far edge  of the Empire.
- The State is still handling the turmoil from Heth's departure, but things seem shaky as old debts between megacorps and rising postwar unemployment shake at the foundations of the megacorps' power. Looking for both a solution to the legions of unemployed workers and the raids by Guristas seeking to take advantage of the chaos, the State declares a no-tolerance policy and makes its first objective halting the attacks by its most annoying foe - all the while hoping the policy holds them over long enough to flatten out the debts.
- The Federation finds itself in a militarily strong position, but continues to be shaken by tensions between ethic groups - not just Matari-Gallente, but also by Jin-Mei and some Intaki groups, who view the recent anti-immigrant upswing with deep concern. Along with the continued political ramifications of the Black Eagles' actions, Roden desperately searches for a uniting force to paper over the differences - and finds it in the Serpentis, who he can blame for the wartime PR catastrophe of drugged-up Federation soldiers murdering innocents. A "policing task force" is quickly destroyed by Serpentis and Guardian Angel assets, leaving Roden forced to send a full force to avoid appearing weak to "mere pirates".
- The Republic finds itself embroiled in tribal tensions as well, but even these cannot hold back a tidal wave of previously-repressed Matar rage when the Cartel attempts a second annexation of a Republic border world. Facing the first open attack on a protected Republic system in years, the tribes turn their full might against the Cartel - perhaps to the concern of the Thukkers, who still have some contacts there.

Your guys' thoughts?

I...actually fucking love this. Pirate Militia opportunities, PLUS giving the FacWar groups a new outlet, PLUS a smoothly transitioning storyline.
You wouldn't even have to deal with NPC Null becoming NPC Low (or vice versa), either, because you're not suggesting an Empire-led invasion of Nullspace. (Also, Deployable/Destroyable Sentry Guns are a terrible idea for both NPC Null and Lowsec).

You COULD make Syndicate a battle-ground (Gallente recolonization/Long Arm of the Law), but I suspect that the Cat's current inhabitants may not appreciate a sudden influx of the MilitiaBlob. What WOULD be cool would be set a battleground in Outer Ring, since it's currently pretty damn useless. Those interested in reclaiming ORE from Serpentis (and harvesting whatever new goodies would be planted there), versus those who are interested in Serpentis' money faucet padding their wallets. That would give the Nullsec-Interested FacWar groups an outlet, while maintaining the original Lowsec dynamic for the most part.
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Karmilla Strife

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Re: After TonyG... then what?
« Reply #23 on: 14 May 2013, 14:16 »

I like the idea of developing the npc null regions, but maybe something a bit more gradual? Perhaps constellations of lowsec within the regions. These could potentially be hubs for both industry and big 4 vs pirate "faction war." You could even make it more interesting by having those pockets be several jumps through npc-controlled null. 

This would shakeup the endless back and forth between the current factions and fit with CCP's plan to keep nudging people in the direction of nullsec.
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BloodBird

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Re: After TonyG... then what?
« Reply #24 on: 14 May 2013, 18:23 »

I'm throwing my weight behind the "FW needs to be ended/significantly altered" argument as well. The de-TonyGification of the political scene would either leave the Big 4 having accomplished their primary goals or be entirely unable to do so:
- The Amarr cannot exactly strike at the Elder Fleet or any of the various freedom figher groups outside of the warzone without a full-on invasion of the Republic. Conversely, the Minmatar are probably not freeing many slaves as the warzone is almost certainly scorched to a wasteland by now; the largest slave populations also lay far beyond the militia's reach.
- The Gallente will have actually achieved one of their major goals - the removal of Heth - and unless something major shifts will probably still be solidly in control of their border as well. The Caldari, in contrast, will likely have realized by then that the Federation really isn't that interested in trying another bloody invasion of Caldari Prime, leaving them solidly in control of their primary goal while the continuing border war proves both unsuccessful and unprofitable.
- I do not favor turning FW into a full-on war due to the same difficulties that were faced by Incursions and the current incarnation of FW: If it gets implemented, we can expect to see an utterly unchanging and boring mechanic for the next several years, with some minor tweaks but ultimately no significant shifts - because lets face it, CCP can't radically redesign a mechanic that large, that quickly.

So, what DO I want?
- Relations between the Big 4 turn to a shaky, cold peace as all four acknowledge that the border conflicts have essentially netted them nothing and cost an uncountable volume of lives. As the years go on, we could see articles about the restoration of trade, diplomatic cross-contact efforts, etc.
- The Empire turns inward, leading an internal reclaiming aimed at purging infestations of Blood Raider and Nation sympathetics. This soon expands to those who dealt with the Cartel, Serpentis, and other smaller pirate operations as the true extent of the corruption the extended war had fostered becomes clear. This leads to some conflict between the houses that feel they are "purer" and those they feel are "more contaminated". At the same time, the bulk of the Empire's forces are redeployed to handle engagements against the Raiders or Nation to the far edge  of the Empire.
- The State is still handling the turmoil from Heth's departure, but things seem shaky as old debts between megacorps and rising postwar unemployment shake at the foundations of the megacorps' power. Looking for both a solution to the legions of unemployed workers and the raids by Guristas seeking to take advantage of the chaos, the State declares a no-tolerance policy and makes its first objective halting the attacks by its most annoying foe - all the while hoping the policy holds them over long enough to flatten out the debts.
- The Federation finds itself in a militarily strong position, but continues to be shaken by tensions between ethic groups - not just Matari-Gallente, but also by Jin-Mei and some Intaki groups, who view the recent anti-immigrant upswing with deep concern. Along with the continued political ramifications of the Black Eagles' actions, Roden desperately searches for a uniting force to paper over the differences - and finds it in the Serpentis, who he can blame for the wartime PR catastrophe of drugged-up Federation soldiers murdering innocents. A "policing task force" is quickly destroyed by Serpentis and Guardian Angel assets, leaving Roden forced to send a full force to avoid appearing weak to "mere pirates".
- The Republic finds itself embroiled in tribal tensions as well, but even these cannot hold back a tidal wave of previously-repressed Matar rage when the Cartel attempts a second annexation of a Republic border world. Facing the first open attack on a protected Republic system in years, the tribes turn their full might against the Cartel - perhaps to the concern of the Thukkers, who still have some contacts there.

Your guys' thoughts?

I...actually fucking love this. Pirate Militia opportunities, PLUS giving the FacWar groups a new outlet, PLUS a smoothly transitioning storyline.

THIS, DAMN IT. It's pretty much what I want too.  :cube:
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Gaven Lok ri

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Re: After TonyG... then what?
« Reply #25 on: 14 May 2013, 18:29 »

Suggestion: Amarr Matari war continues. Caldari and Gallente pair off with pirates.

I can see arguments for the Caldari-Gallente war dying down. I cannot see arguments for the Amarr-Matari one dying down short of an actual victory.
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Shintoko Akahoshi

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Re: After TonyG... then what?
« Reply #26 on: 14 May 2013, 18:35 »

There would have to be a threat grave enough to force the Minmatar and Amarr to band together. I don't know what that threat might be. I mean, we've already got the Nation popping into random systems and snatching planetary populations wholesale...

Ghost Hunter

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Re: After TonyG... then what?
« Reply #27 on: 14 May 2013, 19:18 »

The concept of pirate militia gameplay scares the shit out of me in general, but alas.

I'm hoping they'll cold war the galaxy again so internal faction conflict can happen more openly. Covert tensions aren't necessarily making for an interesting story.
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Ghost > So yes, she was Ghost's husband-
Ashar > So Ghost was a gay Caldari and she went through tranny surgery
Ghost > Wait what?
Ashar > Ghosts husband.
Ghost > No she was - Oh god damnit.

He ate all of them
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Esna Pitoojee

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Re: After TonyG... then what?
« Reply #28 on: 14 May 2013, 19:19 »

I don't think it necessarily demands them "banding together". As I said, I'm looking for a shaky, cold peace and not the Amarr and Minmatar suddenly going out for drinks and patting each others' backs.

As for a reason - well, let's face it: What has the war accomplished? In the past few years, what significant, national gains have the Matari or Amarrians made toward their greater goals? What is the point of continuing, even?
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I like the implications of Gallentians being punched in the face by walking up to a Minmatar as they so freely use another person's culture as a fad.

Creep

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Re: After TonyG... then what?
« Reply #29 on: 14 May 2013, 20:44 »

The concept of pirate militia gameplay scares the shit out of me in general, but alas.

I'm hoping they'll cold war the galaxy again so internal faction conflict can happen more openly. Covert tensions aren't necessarily making for an interesting story.
Not up the challenge, eh?  :yar:

No, I get you. I remember hearing rumours during Fanfest that CCP was going to open ALL of Lowsec to FacWar, and thinking "well, shit, that's the end of all the small Pirate corps, and time for me to go live in GW". The blob is just so fucking big.
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