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That the Intaki who supported Caldari independence from the Federation were first exiled from the Federation, and then attacked by Caldari radicals demanding the expulsion of all foreigners? For more, read here.

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Author Topic: Loosening the straps (ooooh).  (Read 13249 times)

Graelyn

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Loosening the straps (ooooh).
« on: 27 Jul 2012, 22:56 »

So, the Fweddit bullshit seems to be subsiding, at least in part.

As part of a return to normal, I intend to examine and probably relax some of the standards of the channel to encourage a little bit of transhumanist wackiness on top of our usual capsuleer srs bsns.

Some of my tireless and beloved mods are probably facepalming after all the work they did to reduce that sort of thing (which, honestly, was usually attempted by the most blase and unskilled of typing typist types).

Well poopie doo! We're going to look at it anyway.

Without turning things into a long and weepy string of I don't like the stupid mod that enforced my face off, I'd like to hear from you guys about what standards you think might be so tight as to stifle Actual Good Material.

Allowing folks to swing thier dicks around on a fluidcomm broadcast stream is not the sort of thing that qualifies! Your virtual vat-grown dick does not impress anyone!

My thanks for any feedback. I love you all...you know, deep down. Somewhere.  :cube:
« Last Edit: 28 Jul 2012, 01:55 by Graelyn »
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Ghost Hunter

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Re: Loosening the straps (ooooh).
« Reply #1 on: 27 Jul 2012, 23:02 »

Fweddit was directly responsible for the troll brigade?
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Graelyn

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Re: Loosening the straps (ooooh).
« Reply #2 on: 28 Jul 2012, 01:47 »

Seems so.

I'd present a smoking gun, but CSI: Yulai got cancelled.

Whoever it was, People did things, and it was derp. Justice got served in clips-o-twenty.

Time to fiddle with the Peacetime ROEs.
« Last Edit: 28 Jul 2012, 01:53 by Graelyn »
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Morwen Lagann

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Re: Loosening the straps (ooooh).
« Reply #3 on: 28 Jul 2012, 09:31 »

It started happening almost immediately after we banned FWeddit wholesale for shitting up the channel with trolling nonsense, so it was a safe bet. Whoever ended up causing the subsequent problem was doing it with alts so we'll probably never know for certain, but we found how/where they were doing it from (recruitment channel) and nuked the alts who were actively responsible. The only trouble since then has been from our usual suspects.

I'd also like to say that it's less that the standards of behavior for the channel have been tightened, and more that the active moderators have started enforcing the existing standards and stopped letting people ignore them. We have enough issues retaining people in the Summit and OOC thanks to people constantly causing trouble, useless drama and what could be construed as RP shitposting.

The most frequent complaint I get about the Summit or OOC is that there are certain people who are always making trouble, or being excessively annoying that make them not want to be in there. (Blocking isn't always the answer, either, because then you have people talking to that person, and half a conversation is more irritating than the whole thing. There's a reason people who talk loudly on their cell phones in public are so annoying to most people.)

As a mod I'm inclined to act in the best interests of keeping people visiting the channel. If that means sodomizing repeat troublemakers with the modstick so that they aren't causing people to leave, I don't have a problem with that, and I doubt most of the other moderators do either. But I disagree with the notion that we've actually tightened standards or rules when we haven't. As I said before: all we did was start enforcing the ones that were already there.

Are there some new-ish rules and policies? Sure. But they're designed to cut down on the stuff that is disruptive and causes people to not want to be in the channel.
  • "No parading of slaves." Self-explanatory, really, and a policy that predates myself being on the mod list. The mods have nothing against slave-owning capsuleers/Holders with this rule. It's simply to cut down on the stupid, thousand-times-overdone drama and disruption that occurs when Holders make a show on the channel about their owning slaves. Want to avoid it? Don't have slaves or servants on screen, let alone ordering them around.
  • "Holders will suffer the same consequences as their slaves, should the slaves cause trouble and earn the ire of the moderators on the Summit." This one's new, but also self-explanatory. I'm not going to go into my personal beliefs about 'capsuleer slaves', but if you're a Holder, you are responsible for your slaves' behavior. If a slave earns themself a mute or a ban, that punishment will be carried over to the Holder as well. Want to avoid it? If you're going to insist on having slave characters connecting to the Summit, make sure they stay on their best behavior and don't cause trouble.*
  • "No shirt, no shoes, no service." Again, self-explanatory. Act like an adult. If you're going to connect via a visual medium, put some clothes on. This had already been enforced for a long time with female characters, but now it's universal out of fairness. Want to avoid it? If your character isn't wearing a shirt, keep the visuals to shoulders and up or just connect via audio. Easy!
  • "Non-capsuleers are allowed on the Summit by the grace of Mod alone." This one also predates me being added to the moderator team. If you're going to insist on having a non-capsuleer character connect to the Summit, you've been warned: keep them on their best behavior, because if a moderator decides to hit them with the modstick you will have no right to appeal; they're not even supposed to be connecting to the Summit in the first place.
Also, the majority of mod action being taken these days is on the previously-mentioned repeat offenders who have had multiple warnings for their behavior. The vast majority of new players (note I said players, not characters) have not run afoul of any of these rules or standards. The same can't be said for the characters of players who like to be disruptive on multiple alts.

* As an aside: my personal opinion is that slaves should just be banned from the channel wholesale both as background NPCs and as player characters. Outside of deliberately attention-whoring, interrupting whatever was going on before they showed up, and general drama-mongering, there is no reason for a character that self-identifies as a slave to be on the channel in any capacity, capsuleer or otherwise, and removing their presence entirely would cut down on the vast majority of the pointless drama and disruptive behavior that they cause. This rule is a compromise so that we don't have to ban one of the moderators who happens to technically be a slave, but who also never ran afoul of the rule simply by never making a point of telling people they're a slave.
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1) The number of capsuleer women who are bisexual is greater than the number who are lesbian.
2) Most of the former group appear lesbian due to a lack of suitable male partners to go around.
3) The lack of suitable male partners can be summed up in most cases thusly: interested, worth the air they breathe, available; pick two.

Katrina Oniseki

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Re: Loosening the straps (ooooh).
« Reply #4 on: 28 Jul 2012, 13:06 »

* As an aside: my personal opinion is that slaves should just be banned from the channel wholesale both as background NPCs and as player characters. Outside of deliberately attention-whoring, interrupting whatever was going on before they showed up, and general drama-mongering, there is no reason for a character that self-identifies as a slave to be on the channel in any capacity, capsuleer or otherwise, and removing their presence entirely would cut down on the vast majority of the pointless drama and disruptive behavior that they cause.

Seconded. So much.

NISYN Aelisha

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Re: Loosening the straps (ooooh).
« Reply #5 on: 28 Jul 2012, 13:28 »

Agreed on the majority of points, especially those involving wholesale removal of attention whore tropes.  Good rp is being killed by those that feel RP is an extrovert parade of shitting up other's rp to glorify their own - a return to the glory days of character exploration through interaction would be welcome, but I know it is not your duty as moderators to do such. 

Though I am unlikely to return to the Summit for this reason, you as mods are providing a thankless service, one likely to get harder with this more vigorous enforcement, so from a former patron and enthusiastic observer, thanks for the hard work. 
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kalaratiri

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Re: Loosening the straps (ooooh).
« Reply #6 on: 28 Jul 2012, 14:32 »

Only sort of related, but I've just had an idea that I'd like people to pick holes in.

Many people see the Summit as the 'bottom' of eve RP, and long for the days when people actually met up IC/in space and did things. So, why not encourage this by reducing the amount of time people can sit in the summit and bicker?

Give the Summit 'opening hours'. This would cut down on the amount of work the moderators have to do, and possibly also break the growing trend of 'passive rp' that's done by just sitting in the summit. If people can't just sit in the summit all day, then we will see those who are really interested in rp find other ways of progressing their character, and those who aren't will not be forcing the rest of us to deal with them 23.5/7.

You could open the summit for, say, three hours, three times a day. This should give a reasonable timezone coverage without it being permanently open.

I'm sure there are problems with this idea that you excellent theory crafters will be able to spot, but I figured I'd put it out there.
« Last Edit: 28 Jul 2012, 14:34 by kalaratiri »
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Kybernetes Moros

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Re: Loosening the straps (ooooh).
« Reply #7 on: 28 Jul 2012, 14:49 »

I'd argue that forcing at least one mod for each "shift" to be active for its duration would be awkward as fuck, and it'd be pretty easy for people to never see the Summit open with that model. No reason why someone couldn't just open a secondary channel with the same rough purpose that was always open, too.

My approach (before I left, so how effective it was is debatable) was just to approach people without using the Summit if I wanted proper RP. Rather than forcing people to find other vectors for character development, I found it simpler to make my own.
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Ghost Hunter

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Re: Loosening the straps (ooooh).
« Reply #8 on: 28 Jul 2012, 15:21 »

* As an aside: my personal opinion is that slaves should just be banned from the channel wholesale both as background NPCs and as player characters. Outside of deliberately attention-whoring, interrupting whatever was going on before they showed up, and general drama-mongering, there is no reason for a character that self-identifies as a slave to be on the channel in any capacity, capsuleer or otherwise, and removing their presence entirely would cut down on the vast majority of the pointless drama and disruptive behavior that they cause. This rule is a compromise so that we don't have to ban one of the moderators who happens to technically be a slave, but who also never ran afoul of the rule simply by never making a point of telling people they're a slave.

WTB exclusion clause for Sansha True Slaves.
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Ashar > Ghosts husband.
Ghost > No she was - Oh god damnit.

He ate all of them
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Esna Pitoojee

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Re: Loosening the straps (ooooh).
« Reply #9 on: 28 Jul 2012, 20:44 »

To clarify something I've been asked about in the past: One of the questions I get regarding the "no slaves" rule is "My character is a slaveholder and might have slaves wandering around in the background just doing work. Are you people seriously going to tell me I can't connect? That's pretty biased against my character's RP etc etc".

No.

We are not going to take action under this rule unless you specifically announce a slave doing something for the sole apparent reason of distracting the channel from a current ongoing discussion, or to draw attention to your character's holding or treatment of slaves.
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Silas Vitalia

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Re: Loosening the straps (ooooh).
« Reply #10 on: 30 Jul 2012, 07:40 »

Good rp is being killed by those that feel RP is an extrovert parade of shitting up other's rp to glorify their own 


Very much this.  And also big thanks to the mods for volunteer work and keeping things running smoothly.  Morwen has patience of a Saint.

My only suggestion is to seriously start banning and muting much much faster and with extreme prejudice.  People causing problems should be out and silenced without so much as a need for explanation or being scolded. 

Banhammer of great justice needs to be a sword of Damocles constantly dangling above the head of anyone acting the fool.
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Tiberious Thessalonia

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Re: Loosening the straps (ooooh).
« Reply #11 on: 30 Jul 2012, 08:41 »

* As an aside: my personal opinion is that slaves should just be banned from the channel wholesale both as background NPCs and as player characters. Outside of deliberately attention-whoring, interrupting whatever was going on before they showed up, and general drama-mongering, there is no reason for a character that self-identifies as a slave to be on the channel in any capacity, capsuleer or otherwise, and removing their presence entirely would cut down on the vast majority of the pointless drama and disruptive behavior that they cause. This rule is a compromise so that we don't have to ban one of the moderators who happens to technically be a slave, but who also never ran afoul of the rule simply by never making a point of telling people they're a slave.
WTB exclusion clause for Sansha True Slaves.

We're the last part of that.  We don't sit there and go "We are slaves, doop doop doop".

I'm not convinced we need a specific anti-slave rule, in any case.  As far as I am concerned, 90% of all issues can be solved through the judicious application of the "Are you being a derp and a drama-whore?  Welcome to ban town" rule.
WTB exclusion clause for Sansha True Slaves.
« Last Edit: 30 Jul 2012, 12:00 by Tiberious Thessalonia »
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Silas Vitalia

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Re: Loosening the straps (ooooh).
« Reply #12 on: 30 Jul 2012, 09:34 »

I sincerely doubt they are referring to you and yours Tiberious. More of the "I'm going to abuse my RP slave alt in public channel and attention-whore! Woe is me! *tear* "

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Casiella

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Re: Loosening the straps (ooooh).
« Reply #13 on: 30 Jul 2012, 10:44 »

"If you and your behavior make the Summit community feel like it would be a better place without you, it will be."
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Makkal

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Re: Loosening the straps (ooooh).
« Reply #14 on: 31 Jul 2012, 01:08 »

Only sort of related, but I've just had an idea that I'd like people to pick holes in.

Many people see the Summit as the 'bottom' of eve RP, and long for the days when people actually met up IC/in space and did things. So, why not encourage this by reducing the amount of time people can sit in the summit and bicker?

Give the Summit 'opening hours'. This would cut down on the amount of work the moderators have to do, and possibly also break the growing trend of 'passive rp' that's done by just sitting in the summit. If people can't just sit in the summit all day, then we will see those who are really interested in rp find other ways of progressing their character, and those who aren't will not be forcing the rest of us to deal with them 23.5/7.

You could open the summit for, say, three hours, three times a day. This should give a reasonable timezone coverage without it being permanently open.

I'm sure there are problems with this idea that you excellent theory crafters will be able to spot, but I figured I'd put it out there.

I’m not sure I see any merit to this idea unless the mods are feeling overwhelmed and need more breaks from the Summit.

If people are against ‘passive RPG’ then the best thing would be for them to ‘active RPG’ instead of trying to close down the Summit on a daily basis to force people to RPG the way they ought to.

WTB exclusion clause for Sansha True Slaves.
It already seems to be in place given Tib is a mod who connects daily.

Makkal previously had 'servants' who brought her food or tea, and she was never called on it.

Honestly, I dislike blanket bans. I'd rather avoid a strict 'no slaves or slave capsuleers' rule, and instead go with a 'no attention whoring or too disruptive behavior' rule. The problem is that some people will see themselves as being picked on by the mods or singled out if that happens.
« Last Edit: 31 Jul 2012, 01:30 by Makkal »
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