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[Morwen Lagann]

Good points, you all.

I'm still new to the rough-and-tumble RP style of EVE. I'm trying to figure out how I can spin the TCRC argument.

The best I have so far is that Ishukone simply doesn't give a damn about the slavery issue. They had a product to sell, and wanted to sell in bulk. Holders were the most likely to buy in bulk, so Ishukone offered a discount to encourage that. I figure that's not going to go over well with Matar blues (of which color we have few left from any faction), but the only other alternatives are denial or confirming we're evil slaver enablers on purpose.

Just a minor nitpick - it's TCMC (Transcranial Microcontroller) not TCRC - TCRCs (True Creations Research Centers) are a particularly nasty Headquarters-level Incursion site. Very different beasts. >.>

I'm not sure if it's publicly known that Ishukone (Otro, specifically) gave Insorum to Shakor in the lead-up to the Elder Fleets' attack on the Empire. If it is, that's a decent playing card in your hand, I'd think. (if I knew for certain that it was, Morwen would've mentioned that in the thread already.)

[Tiberious Thessalonia]

Yeah I am dreading to see how CCP will play out Templar One's developments.

Ishukone is now an Enemy of the State.
Ishukone is now an Enemy of the Empire.

Not sure if this will be a good thing or bad thing. Not sure how the RP community will treat this drastic official shift in policy.

Oh hey, what a coincidence.

So are we...   

[Desiderya]

Also, it's worth noting that this recent I-RED endeavor is slowly teaching me that I hate playing a loyalist to any faction or organization.

Call me weird, but I hate being judged based on something far out of my control like TCRCs, TonyG, or Dropbear's AJ mess. Maybe I'm just pissy that Ishukone was turned into the cluster's punching bag and it makes me want to go pirate and reset standings with everyone. I'd probably be happier if I was judged based on my own actions IC, which makes me admire Jade and Silas and other players who forge their own reputation unrelated to PF ridiculousness.

I'd rather be hated for who I am than hated for who I associate with.

Luckily, I have no diplomacy or policy power within I-RED, so we won't be going pirate. But rest assured, I'd reset everyone if I could. xD

Or you could go out there, do your ( respectively I-RED's ) thing and prove the critics wrong. The criticism is valid, and personally I really like that it has come up - instead of "LET'S HUG AND BE FRIENDS"- RP, but that doesn't mean you should simply bend over. :p

edit:
I don't think the Insorum thing coming from Ishukone is known to the public. :/

[Katrina Oniseki]

Good points, you all.

I'm still new to the rough-and-tumble RP style of EVE. I'm trying to figure out how I can spin the TCRC argument.

The best I have so far is that Ishukone simply doesn't give a damn about the slavery issue. They had a product to sell, and wanted to sell in bulk. Holders were the most likely to buy in bulk, so Ishukone offered a discount to encourage that. I figure that's not going to go over well with Matar blues (of which color we have few left from any faction), but the only other alternatives are denial or confirming we're evil slaver enablers on purpose.

Just a minor nitpick - it's TCMC (Transcranial Microcontroller) not TCRC - TCRCs (True Creations Research Centers) are a particularly nasty Headquarters-level Incursion site. Very different beasts. >.>

I'm not sure if it's publicly known that Ishukone (Otro, specifically) gave Insorum to Shakor in the lead-up to the Elder Fleets' attack on the Empire. If it is, that's a decent playing card in your hand, I'd think. (if I knew for certain that it was, Morwen would've mentioned that in the thread already.)

Yeah I run them all the time in fleets, which is probably why I thought TCRC instead of TCMC. My derp.

As for the Insorum thing, I have been biting my tongue every time a Minmatar player gripes about Ishukone. We lost our leader, our golden ticket, and much more for the Matari people... and I can't seem to use it IC at all. I just want to have Kat slap their tribal faces silly and say, "YOU FOOLS!"

But then, it could be argued that Insorum was a deviously wonderful idea to remove TCMC's biggest competitor for slave control - Vitoxin. Bleh.

[Tiberious Thessalonia]

Can't it be both?  Enlightened self-interest, after all.  You just have to decide that TCMC's are okay, and Vitoxin is awful.  Not sure why you would come to that conclusion, mind.

You could probably twist it around a bit to make it happen, though.

[Chell Charon]

I'll just leave this here.

[Ulphus]

As for the Insorum thing, I have been biting my tongue every time a Minmatar player gripes about Ishukone. We lost our leader, our golden ticket, and much more for the Matari people... and I can't seem to use it IC at all. I just want to have Kat slap their tribal faces silly and say, "YOU FOOLS!"

But then, it could be argued that Insorum was a deviously wonderful idea to remove TCMC's biggest competitor for slave control - Vitoxin. Bleh.

I've just made it about 65% (My kindle tells me so) through TEA (someone told me I should read it before Templar One) and frankly, I share your pain. I really dislike the amount of stuff in that book that is not known IC.

(Although thinking of the Broker as Istvaan really does help with my SOD. )

I asked Hjalti and Gauti (Who's CCP names I can't remember) to consider fewer (or no) stories with stuff in them that couldn't be known to people IC, but they didn't want their story telling to be constrained that much (which I guess is fair). I also asked for stuff that was subjectively true in character, but not necessarily objectively true (i.e. different sides had different "truths") but they seemed to think that was buying a lot of extra work and would just confuse people (which I guess is also fair).

One question: Would you prefer to know that stuff OOC and rage that you can't use it, or not know OOC and just be confused about WTF is going on? (Not that we're necessarily less confused for having that stuff revealed to us)

[Katrina Oniseki]

One question: Would you prefer to know that stuff OOC and rage that you can't use it, or not know OOC and just be confused about WTF is going on? (Not that we're necessarily less confused for having that stuff revealed to us)

Neither. I think both of those situations are rather SNAFU.

I'd rather know the whole story OOC with opportunities to find this stuff out IC. You don't need to release public news reports on Ishukone's donation of Insorum, but for crying out loud... give us in the faction something to work with!

[Saikoyu]

It would have been great if they made missions specifically crafted to do that in game.  Like a Minmatar mission where you have to fight through rogue drones to load up and deliver a load of Insorum, and you see an Ishukone cruiser there, not being attacked by the drones or something.  How hard would that be to make?  Yes, it might not give you the whole story, but it would be something. 

[Ulphus]

It would have been great if they made missions specifically crafted to do that in game.  Like a Minmatar mission where you have to fight through rogue drones to load up and deliver a load of Insorum, and you see an Ishukone cruiser there, not being attacked by the drones or something.  How hard would that be to make?  Yes, it might not give you the whole story, but it would be something.

Actually, that's a really nice idea. I'm not sure that they currently filter missions other than to change the serial numbers based on agent's affiliation, but it would make a great storyline mission.

[Katrina Oniseki]

I'd prefer something even more subtle.

When mission objects get V3'd, how about a storage silo or production factory bearing the Ishukone logo. Just that. No other reference but that logo.

[Bastian Valoron]

At the moment, there's no suitable public venue where I could see my character going and as a consequence I have poor idea who might be doing compatible faction loyalist RP with a political twist these days, apart from those good people who we wouldn't dec. There was a time when we were looking for an IC enemy but couldn't find anyone suitable. Since we tend to RP on our own channels and sometimes in local, we seldom run into dec-grade IC disagreements. On the other hand, we're not really running out of goals which make sense for us and various pirate groups are offering us good fights on a daily basis so all is well and good.

[John Revenent]

It might be worth noting that this whole I-RED thread on the IGS is a response to this thread here on Backstage.

Don't like friendliness in your EVE? Please, keep giving us reasons to set you red.

Why u say that!       

But yeah Kat it's not always about looking like the good guy on the IGS sometimes.. well that's impossible because everyone is a bad guy in someway.

EDIT: Also RPing along the lines of Ishukone is awesome. Being stuck between a rock and a hard place allows for much more interaction/pew/mud slinging. Xd

[Valdezi]

I-RED concentrates more on pew-pew than RP. We generally don't talk about how we're going to shoot you. We just start shooting you (or die trying in some cases).

I-RED's daily face in RP from what I see is mostly me and Simca. We've been trying to make a regular presence and show of I-RED lately, but with John being one of actions instead of words and the rest of I-RED roleplayers only coming out of the woodwork when we're slandered... it's difficult.

Hey, Val RPs. He just doesn't comment on threads that are none of his business unless he's chasing women.

Also, just on Gotti's point, I Have a few characters and I would call them all good guys, even though they wouldn't morally agree on much. (Maybe except Mammal and Val). That's what makes it fun, getting into different moral head spaces.

Also, the FCO declares war on I-RED. Die Caldari scum!

Jks.

[Kyoko Sakoda]

I've resorted to being a troll, but I'm pretty sure that's a part of who pirates are, anyway. vOv