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[Arkady Sadik]

a neutral IC environment

I'm not sure such a thing is possible. ;-)

[Saxon Hawke]

My .02 isk. Saxon is a busy guy with a whole lot going on in his corner of the universe. The ILF's mission is more than just philosophical, we physically have a lot going on with industry, mining, planetary interaction, anti-pirate activity, faction war drama, internal divisions, we have a mole we're trying contain, a neighboring corp is trying to cherry-pick our best pilots, etc.

Saxon has a lot more productive things to do with his time than sit around and discuss Caldari shopping centers and Amarrian prayer rituals. If, however, Seriphyn wants to discuss Placid Region affairs, Intaki culture or one of the issues I mentioned above, feel free to say something in the freeintaki channel. I see him there from time to time already.

[Kaleigh Doyle]

I swear, we have this discussion about every six months or so, just like bitching about how the IGS is so horrible and no one goes there. I need to start saving my posts so I can just cut&paste for ease, but I'll respond nonetheless with some points:

1) Tiberious is one of the few people that make the channel shine. He is engaging and has something to say about everything, so thanks for that.

2) The "herp derp" internet meme bullshit has to end, cause I know it kills any incentive I've had to interact with that behavior. Not that I'm very engaging in the channel, but if I was moderator I'd be keeping some strict standards on that.

3) I don't want world building discussions; I want meaningful player interaction. That doesn't mean hearing who fucked Stacy last week or having pseudo-intellectual diatribes about why slavery is wrong unless there's going to be some fundamental character perspective changes going on, and I don't ever perceive that happening. People argue for the sake of arguing, and generally screw around because they are bored and hungry for interaction.

4) The Summit is, at present, a generic RP channel with a whole lot of people meshed together for OOC reasons rather than IC ones; they are either new and just looking to find their place in the community (God help them), or they are established characters with factional ties who have nothing in common with anyone else but have nowhere else to interact that's active. It's no wonder no one gets along or anything meaningful happens, everyone's characters perceives each other as an adversary.

[Graelyn]

...everyone's characters perceives each other as an adversary.

Perceives? Everyone is everyone else's adversary. You're not going to get around that.

[kalaratiri]

Kala really doesn't use the summit much. Pretty much only when she thinks she can get away with being inappropriate :p

[Borza]

I'd discuss PF news items IC there... but they're rather thin on the ground.

Neither re-hashing the PF background nor public character development of my rather private character appeal.

So what's left? Listening to people jabbering away about nonsense/capsuleer private life gossip. Meh.

[Graelyn]

Kala really doesn't use the summit much. Pretty much only when she thinks she can get away with being inappropriate :p

This is true in many cases. Many only use The Summit when they want to be controversial.

Look, some folks seem to have a problem with the fact that The Summit does not have the community feel they are looking for in EVE.

That is not what The Summit is, and I would go further to say that it isn't what a majority of our characters are.

Most of us are Bastards. Mass murderers. Justifiers of absolute atrocity.

A room full of such folk will never be the wonderland of debate and scholarly discourse.

We have the NEA for that. I was glad to be apart of both, for these reasons. Each is their own animal, and folks shouldn't look for one to become the other. It's not likely to happen anytime soon.

The Summit is, and will continue to be, the front door of the madhouse. We mods do our best to keep too much mud from being tracked in, but we don't want pure civility and calm. We encourage TACTFUL rough play. We are still playing EVE.
New folks should hang out in OOC channel. The Summit is encouraged as a starting place for IC, but it's is not a training room with soft walls. Starting out in the Summit is akin to learning to swim by being fired into the deep end of a pool with a cannon. I, for one, value this sort of thing. Others are not forced to believe the same.

Other issues raised in this thread, like moderator scarcity, are valid, and I'm looking into various solutions. Serious suggestions are welcomed and encouraged..

[Kybernetes Moros]

I'd discuss PF news items IC there... but they're rather thin on the ground.

Neither re-hashing the PF background nor public character development of my rather private character appeal.

So what's left? Listening to people jabbering away about nonsense/capsuleer private life gossip. Meh.

Because people are utterly reliant on CCP or the ISD to spew out IC news articles. :\

There are plenty of folks doing their own news articles on an IC perspective, or at least there were -- Arcadia News Network was notable, though I'm unsure where that stands just now after Ashar Incorporated returned from being in stasis, and there's those Tech4 people who were on the IGS recently.

Failing that? Make your own news. Think of something that could have reasonable happened on a planet or station, and discuss. It's a big cluster; use some creativity.

[Lyn Farel]

This wasn't intelligent, intellectual debate, which does happen there on a fairly regular basis, maybe just not ones that you Seri, want to talk about.

I envy you, in all my eve life I have maybe barely seen 2 or 3 of these intellectual debates on this channel. :/

Coming from someone on the new end of things (less than a year)

I barely spend a minute in The Summit, just to see if it's changed.

It hasn't.

I keep looking for active RP channels, and though we have a very nice list going...they're all silent.

if anyone actually wants to start up a place to discuss RP in EVE in a neutral IC environment that isn't about lurking, please contact Techie Kanenald....I'd be interested.

This world is seriously too beautiful to give up on RP....but I'm very, very close.

I consider the Summit channel far worse than the IGS personally. The quality of the RP done here is barely even RP for me (thats not a "your doing it wrong", its just my opinion, im not telling people acting here daily to do it otherwise, especially if they are happy with it). We even see characters that are apparently Linux based AIs of some kind, and all the other things that have been listed above (the facepalming meme, etc).

Now then, all the RP channels are silent because most of us - here - that are interested in something else and more PF oriented than this "IC coated" OOC blabble are silent and do absolutely NOTHING to create storylines and bring stuff on the table, and as I said above, I am the first one not doing it too. Because as I told it countless times everyone keeps RPing in his/her own little corner with his/her factional friends, except on... the Summit. -_-

Now, I have been told that I am doing it wrong if I am looking for this on public channels, and that I should instead look for a network of relationships to RP with, and blablabla. Well, thats now what I have been doing since then and thats even worse, especially as it actually tends to drive people even more in their little corners, isolated from everyone. My only and last resort would be to directly contact people OOC to ask them if they would be interested in something to happen between characters and that kind of OOC driven stuff. I hate that, there is no taste in already planned RP where everything is written.

It annoys me a lot because I have been on Eve for 5 years, and at least 2 of them (the last ones) have been only due to RP, or I would have left since looooong.

On another note, I have create the channel you are looking for several months ago (New Eden Infosphere). It is mostly silent too. Other attempts have been tried before, like the NEA. Same result, even if it worked rather well at the beginning (because we still had an active community and also PF regular news).

a neutral IC environment

I'm not sure such a thing is possible. ;-)

It is, it is. ^^

[Graanvlokkie]

... Well, thats now what I have been doing since then and thats even worse, especially as it actually tends to drive people even more in their little corners, isolated from everyone. My only and last resort would be to directly contact people OOC to ask them if they would be interested in something to happen between characters and that kind of OOC driven stuff. I hate that, there is no taste in already planned RP where everything is written ...

Hey! I like my corner, its quiet, and nobody argues with me, and tells me that I am dong it wrong. 

[Lyn Farel]

I am not telling people to stop playing how they like to do it, just stating facts on my side of things.

[Kaleigh Doyle]

...everyone's characters perceives each other as an adversary.

Perceives? Everyone is everyone else's adversary. You're not going to get around that.

What? Says who and why?

[Graelyn]

Jade:

Your ban from The Summit probably came from your repeated removals from the OOC Channel, as we tend to have a degree of parity in both channels, ban-wise.

The suggestion that the RP community has been 'schism-ed' by this is questionable at best.

That said, the grudges you refer to are undeniable.

Former moderators of these channels, without getting too specific, have sometimes carried such grudges with a visible fervor.

That, along with several other issues raised in this thread, sent to my mailbox, and filling the channels themselves over the last few weeks, has me wanting to shake things up.

Over the next couple of days, I'll be purging the operator lists of inactive players, hiring on new moderators (hopefully in adequate numbers and timezone coverages) and slashing the ban lists considerably, for both channels.

There's been a lot of attempts recently by us bitter vets to re-approach the idea of the RP community. BackStage itself was a successful effort at this. No reason we can't give things a shot.

Folks who are being welcomed back should be advised, of course, that a mod may re-institute some bans based on not much more than a whim. The waters should probably be eased into before being tested too strongly. 

[Graelyn]

...everyone's characters perceives each other as an adversary.

Perceives? Everyone is everyone else's adversary. You're not going to get around that.

What? Says who and why?

Everyone
Versus
Everyone, ma'am. 

[Techie Kanenald]

*snip* No reason we can't give things a shot. *snip*

Thank you Graelyn!