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[Jade Constantine]

I think the public drubbing they are receiving on the IGS at the moment is an entirely appropriate way of "rp'ing this out" 

[Verone]

Okay, I'll add my two cents.

First off, I hit the report post button on the IGS and gave this reasoning in the submit box :

This is not even a remotely roleplay based thread, and is shocking.

Someone is obviously making an ooc attempt to smear I-RED and has included all their OOC details, interaction and diplomacy within an IC post.

You can see the RP community's feeling on this here : http://backstage.eve-inspiracy.com/index.php?topic=2296.0

IMO the link should be taken down and the thread locked with reasoning.

Now, I'm all for this kind of thing happening completely in character.

For instance if a Provist Corporation is secretly dealing with a Gallente Loyalist outfit and people are looking to expose them, or a Matari Loyalist Corporation happens to be buying and selling slaves, to give basic examples.

What happened here had very little to do with IC interaction, and in all honesty is a disgrace.

A huge swathe of OOC information has been posted, that has NOTHING to do with I-RED's IC stance and their IC opinion of things.

I agree with people who've said it's nothing more than a weak and poor attempt at a smear campaign given the inclusion of all the OOC information.

Any roleplayer in the right mind who wanted to make an IC release of I-RED's personal data would have had the common decency to sit down and sift through it all to pick out what was relevant IC and what was blatently IC information.

Sorry, but this is well out of order in my opinion and has nothing to do with roleplay.

Ironically your report is almost identical to the one I submitted last night.
Funny old world isn't it

How Bizarre! 

[Kaleigh Doyle]

I think it wouldn't have hurt ANN at all to parse out the irrelevant data, and probably would have saved them a lot of 'questions of integrity' in the end. Posting all that and then wiping your hands of it is dubious at best. Of course, what matters is as John said, how you handle it in-character, but it certainly raises some red flags from me as a player. For what that's worth, lol. 

[Ken]

I think the public drubbing they are receiving on the IGS at the moment is an entirely appropriate way of "rp'ing this out" 

I guess so.  All I can do IC is shrug and wonder at the strange unity of the chorus shouting down the leakers and the thinly (if at all) veiled OOC responses by I-RED directors.  Brings me back to my initial summation that I think John deserves more hardcore RPers in his ranks.  Also, I wonder if an Anshar Inc/ANN rep will actually make an IC response on IGS.

[Jade Constantine]

I think the public drubbing they are receiving on the IGS at the moment is an entirely appropriate way of "rp'ing this out" 

I guess so.  All I can do IC is shrug and wonder at the strange unity of the chorus shouting down the leakers and the thinly (if at all) veiled OOC responses by I-RED directors.  Brings me back to my initial summation that I think John deserves more hardcore RPers in his ranks.  Also, I wonder if an Anshar Inc/ANN rep will actually make an IC response on IGS.

Well the BEST solution that I'd suggest would be for that thread to be nuked.
For Anshar to properly vet the information and present a decent IC summary of what was there and re-format to ensure it had no extraeous ooc guff mixed in.

ie doing a proper IC stitch-up job rather than just chucking a load of mingled copy/paste info on the net and putting a vaguely ic stamp on it.

And basically start over.

But equally, it could be argued that the damage is already done and they fluffed this story badly and best bet might be to shrug and move on and wait for people to forget about it.

[Creedance Talor]

There's one difference here. That bit was about actual in-game stuff planned and executed, and thus IC. This... seems mostly to be just about OoC Real Life stuff and then a huge dump of useless shite that has no real 'revelatory' effect at all. Now, the useless shite seems to be perfectly valid IC leaks, and the rest should have been sifted out a bit.

But get off ANNs back. Why should ANN be the filter here? If it's just something that is to be filtered, do it your freakin' self. It's not rocket surgery to disregard statements about internet cafes and real life info when reading through this dump. Get off that particular high horse and apply the same damn standards to yourself that you are now lumping onto ANN and it's people.

We do it all the time in EM, as an immersionist alliance that deals with non-RPers. Logs sometimes gets posted and there's a small warning that some things are OoC chatter. Everyone applies a little filter in what they mentally omit or transform into something that's IC equivalent.

"So yeah, I was afk for ten minutes." turns to "I was off comms for ten minutes." or whatever other IC equivalent is around.
Almost everything can be made IC this way, and those few things that aren't can easily be omitted from the discussion that follows.

Leave ANN alone and just RP the rest out. It's not that hard.

As a IC News Agency it is not my job to do it , it is their job to sift through it. Why should I have to sit down as another person and have to filter it myself when a supposid news agency released it. Piss poor job in that case!

[Verone]

I think the public drubbing they are receiving on the IGS at the moment is an entirely appropriate way of "rp'ing this out" 

I guess so.  All I can do IC is shrug and wonder at the strange unity of the chorus shouting down the leakers and the thinly (if at all) veiled OOC responses by I-RED directors.  Brings me back to my initial summation that I think John deserves more hardcore RPers in his ranks.  Also, I wonder if an Anshar Inc/ANN rep will actually make an IC response on IGS.

Well the BEST solution that I'd suggest would be for that thread to be nuked.
For Anshar to properly vet the information and present a decent IC summary of what was there and re-format to ensure it had no extraeous ooc guff mixed in.

ie doing a proper IC stitch-up job rather than just chucking a load of mingled copy/paste info on the net and putting a vaguely ic stamp on it.

And basically start over.

But equally, it could be argued that the damage is already done and they fluffed this story badly and best bet might be to shrug and move on and wait for people to forget about it.

Stop making sense god damn you. IT'S NOT RIGHT.

[Silas Vitalia]

Nuke the thread (from orbit).

It's the only way to be sure.

[Jade Constantine]

There's one difference here. That bit was about actual in-game stuff planned and executed, and thus IC. This... seems mostly to be just about OoC Real Life stuff and then a huge dump of useless shite that has no real 'revelatory' effect at all. Now, the useless shite seems to be perfectly valid IC leaks, and the rest should have been sifted out a bit.

But get off ANNs back. Why should ANN be the filter here? If it's just something that is to be filtered, do it your freakin' self. It's not rocket surgery to disregard statements about internet cafes and real life info when reading through this dump. Get off that particular high horse and apply the same damn standards to yourself that you are now lumping onto ANN and it's people.

We do it all the time in EM, as an immersionist alliance that deals with non-RPers. Logs sometimes gets posted and there's a small warning that some things are OoC chatter. Everyone applies a little filter in what they mentally omit or transform into something that's IC equivalent.

"So yeah, I was afk for ten minutes." turns to "I was off comms for ten minutes." or whatever other IC equivalent is around.
Almost everything can be made IC this way, and those few things that aren't can easily be omitted from the discussion that follows.

Leave ANN alone and just RP the rest out. It's not that hard.

As a IC News Agency it is not my job to do it , it is their job to sift through it. Why should I have to sit down as another person and have to filter it myself when a supposid news agency released it. Piss poor job in that case!

Is a damn good point. Imagine if the BBC just put out a random collection of junk notes and unattributed videos and with the disclaimer ... "sort out the news yourself guys!"

Not really good enough.

[Benjamin Shepherd]

John, I was never actually was involved with this, when you claim in the first post "Props to Ben/Anshar/everyone else involved."

Actually, I biomassed Ben. 

[Mizhara]

Faulty comparison, I believe. ANN didn't release the source material as a news article. They just made a news article about an infiltration and provided the full dump, Wikileaks style. I don't see a problem with this.

[Kaleigh Doyle]

That doesn't negate them from the responsibility of what they post.

[Milo Caman]

That doesn't negate them from the responsibility of what they post.

Please elaborate. Aside from one entry regarding JR's Net cafe I didn't see anything that could possibly be considered 'irresponsible' on my part.
Miz has pretty much summed up how I think of the leak. We obtained the information, there was a lot of it, we published it without comment. I have a feeling if we had made attempts to comment on released material, we'd have been jumped on in a similar fashion, given past reactions to criticism from ANN.

I'd also like to know whether the people decrying it at 'petty', 'irrelevant' and 'smear material' OOC have actually read through it. Most of the specific complaints I've had seen been one or two entries, which in my mind, are hardly inflammatory at all. I've removed one on request, but frankly, I feel a number of people are using this as an opportunity to make attacks on me and my corporation.

[Silas Vitalia]

Posting OOC content to an IC forum (IGS) is a dick move, end of story. No way to weasel out of it, argue, change opinions, or the usual.  That content does not belong on IC threads on IGS.

That the link contained some IC related things is completely irrelevant considering the vast majority of the content was in no way, shape, or form, related to anything IC.

[Milo Caman]

Posting OOC content to an IC forum (IGS) is a dick move, end of story. No way to weasel out of it, argue, change opinions, or the usual.  That content does not belong on IC threads on IGS.

The IGS post was not one of mine. There is presently a blanket ban on AI posting there, and I'm no exception to the rule.